Here is a CNN Video of the attack scene immediately after it happened
Benazir Bhutto assassinated
al-Qaeda appears to have claimed responsibility for the attack.
I think I read another article which places blame on factions in the ISI, but believes that Musharraf was unlikely to have been involved with the attack. (ISI is semi-autonomous now anyways, with differing factions supporting each of the major powers in Pakistan.)
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/...o.dhs.alqaeda/
^ Al-Qaeda claims responsibility.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle3100052.ece
^ Belief in ISI and Warlord behind attack (with little Musharraf responsibility).
Rudy's campaign just got a boost as did McCain's.
If Bhutto fingered Musharraf in her death letter that trumps anything else...
Especially when you see how her father was executed.
All Al-Qaeda claiming responsibility does is tell me that they have their lot thrown in with Musharraf....not exactly a surprise.
Musharraf is so corrupt he can pretty much be counted on to be bought or align with anyone depending on the situation...
Which is why I want a President that says he's going to nuke Mecca and other countries if any sort of Nuclear Terrorism is carried out in the US. Because that's the only threat they will understand...and it can't just be a guy that says he will do it...it has to be a guy you freaking know will do it...and that's Rudy.
I don't see any other way...you really can't sanction these guys, it only hurts the people.
By the way...Props to Bhutto...
The way this is reading to me...this lady is one of the bravest leaders of a country ever.
She basically knew she was going to get killed...and she placed herself in danger and gave up her life just to reveal who the corrupt party truly was, and how bad the situation was....that's congressional medal of honor worthy valor on her part...I don't care if she was a Silver Spoon or not. The Woman had balls...
Once nukes start flying God help us all.
...let's not gloss over the fact that Bhutto and her hubby were corrupt...
A. If you don't think they intend for the nukes to start flying you are very naive. The Maddrassas in Pakistan teach them to love the concept of nuclear annihilation and the destruction of the US. They were teaching them this when we weren't even involved with Pakistan and they weren't on our radar.
This is what they were teatching them in those schools...we when we hadn't even been involved with them in a decade...that's why Sept 11th happened.
B. The nuclear threat will not threaten their engines of destruction, their radicals, their homeless kids pulled off the street and given a purpose in life by Radical Islam...an alternative to a life spent dying slowly smoking opium
It won't threaten those guys...but it will threaten those that control them, and that seek to use Radical Islam as a means of attaining power...
Common sense really.
The best way for us to get nuked via terrorism? Is to have a President they don't think will nuke them in retaliation. As long as the nuclear threat exists, as long as those leaders think we have a guy that will nuke them, regardless of whether or not the world wants him to do it...you will never see an act of nuclear terrorism.
Read up on what they teach those homeless kids they pull off the street in Pakistan...then you'll understand exactly what is we face. Just how real and deadly the threat actually is....and how close we really are to the day that happens.
You guys call Bush stupid, ignorant greedy all you want...but he's proven he will act in opposition to world opinion, and he will do so forcefully...and it's something noticed by every guy in control of one of those countries.
So you guys can sit here and be anti-war and think it will make a difference...but you really have no idea of the mindset we face...
You are the rich wealthy fatcat, because you live within the borders of the United States of America...and it doesn't matter who we elect, it doesn't matter if we pull out of Iraq or not....it does not matter, you will still be the rich wealthy decadent fatcat that they want to gut. It does matter if you are pro-war or anti-war...it does not matter.
You have...and they have not, and they hate you for it. You are evil to them.
You know how I know this stuff? Because I dated a Pakistani woman...she was raped at the age of 4 by her parents houseboy...not only did they not the fire the guy, they told her it was her fault...and she says her family was one of the more decent ones. When she tried to get a job, refused her prearranged marriage, and wanted to be independent her father beat her and tried to have her ins utionalized. Lots of other stuff beyond that...
It's what happens when women have no voice in a society...a brutal destructive society emerges...
You've just seen what they think of women trying to have a voice over there....what happens to them.
It will not go away if we ignore it...
The only way it can be fougth is with representative government and giving a voice to the people...and Iraq is the place to start, whether we went over there for oil...or not. We pull out, Rad Islam will move in and tend to their wounds...and it will become an even more brutal war like society...only one that is very wealthy...
Last edited by whottt; 12-28-2007 at 01:30 PM.
Bolton blames US for Pakistain crisis.
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Bolton..._for_1228.html
Coupled with the idea that US secretly negotiated Bhutto's repatriation, Bolton seems to be right on this one.
Damn, can't dubya and head and their cowboy posse get anything right? They've f ed up EVERYTHING they've touched, except tax cuts for the super-rich and corps.
Or maybe they wanted this assassination as a geo-political crisis to bolster Repug candidiates? We all know in our hearts that only Repugs can defend America, as they did so well on 9/11.
Corrupt compared to who?
This woman knew she was going to get it and still went and faced death...which gives this spoiled, silverspoon, corrupt, aristorcrat, more balls and integrity than 75% of this forum.
Corrupt compared to who?
I'm not saying to ignore anything. My point is that it is just a matter of time that a nuclear war will happen and I pray, and you can call me all the names you want, that the world's leader, kumbaya, will realize that once you push that button there is no turning back. Are there radicals who are just itching to nuke the US? Sure there are but I also know there are radicals who just itching to nuke some middle east countries.
I am all for a strong defense and make no mistake about it, we must retaliate or if need be strike first but we must do it very wisely, if such a thing can be done.
Is it fair to assume you count yourself among the 75%?
The facts may never be known, but these are as good as any right now:
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Police...utto_1228.html
Anyway, why should America care? The Army is the only force for stability in Pakistan, and America has been pumping it full of $Bs and hot hardware for years.
And it was reported a few weeks ago that US actually has its own military in helping the Pakis guard the nukes.
And BTW Dan...i am going to keep voting for guys that I think will be the most willing to use nuclear weapons...the guys that are scary, are the guys I like...
Rudy pusshing the button while dressed up in the finest lingere from Victoria's secret? Works for me...
You guys either stop putting up wimps against them...or you can get a sane, gentle and caring scary guy...but anyone whose platform begins with, let's leave so they'll like us...I am not voting for. Because that's the guy they will use nuclear terrorism to intimidate, for money, for resources, for power...and just to be guy who did that to the US.
Personally...I'd rather someone more moderate...but that alternative doesn't exist...because you refuse to let him exist...so the scary authoritarian it is.
W is one of the least likeable men I have ever seen in my life...just a look at him and you despise him and think he's a moron...the fact that he actually became more popular is testament to just how off you guys are on this.
Her hubby funneled millions of dollars into Swiss bank accounts...so that would make her corrupt by every standard...Corrupt compared to who?
A mystery has emerged about how Bhutto perished..
A handout released on Friday by Pakistan's Interior Ministry shows images of opposition leader Benazir Bhutto's skull. Interior ministry spokesman Javed Iqbal Cheema said on Friday Bhutto had not been shot, nor had she been hit by shrapnel from the blast but she had been killed when the force of the explosion crashed her head against a lever on the sun-roof of her vehicle.
(Interior Ministry/Handout/Reuters)
She's dead. That is all that matters besides who carried out the plot.
Unfortunately, it's much more complicated than this joe....
Alleged connection to 9/11
On October 6, 2001, a senior-level U.S. government official told CNN that U.S. investigators had discovered Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh (Sheik Syed), using the alias "Mustafa Muhammad Ahmad" had sent about $100,000 from the United Arab Emirates to Mohammed Atta. "Investigators said Atta then distributed the funds to conspirators in Florida in the weeks before the deadliest acts of terrorism on U.S. soil that destroyed the World Trade Center, heavily damaged the Pentagon and left thousands dead. In addition, sources have said Atta sent thousands of dollars -- believed to be excess funds from the operation -- back to Saeed in the United Arab Emirates in the days before September 11. CNN later confirmed this. <1>
The 9/11 Commission's Final Report states that the source of the funds "remains unknown."
I'm not so sure about that...it drug the Japanese into the 20th century pretty effectively. And the longest lived group of human beings now live in Japan.
Nuclear energy is what gave us life...we are the result of nuclear reaction.
I don't want a nuclear war...but I want a guy that threatens one, not one that thinks this can be solved by pretending it's not happening and trying to mind his own business. The world is too small now to mind our own business...
And if we even do...as the world's wealthiest and most powerful country, they will not mind their own business.
Itching to nuke for no reason? Not I...I view it only as means of retaliation. But I just want to make completely sure they have no doubts we will retaliate.Are there radicals who are just itching to nuke the US? Sure there are but I also know there are radicals who just itching to nuke some middle east countries.
I am all for a strong defense and make no mistake about it, we must retaliate or if need be strike first but we must do it very wisely, if such a thing can be done.
Dude these guys are macho...it's all about power and control, that's their way, that's what they respect..and the only way to change that is to liberalize their society...and that's not going to happen pretending they aren't there. It's going to get worse..as their population grows disproportionately with the governments ability to feed and care for them.
And the idea of country with the wealth of Iraq becoming that way...which is what will happen when we pull out..if this government does not succeed...should be the scariest thing you can imagine...
If a liberalixzed Arab Muslim Democracy emerges we are no longer isolated...sure a bunch of them will just say Iraq is the lapdog of the US...but more will say...you know, Iraq is doing good now...so it's not all about the rich impoverishing the poor muslims...and the pressure on those leaders that remain hardline will increase...the lies will be harder to pull of.
TO me that's the way you solve this problem...that's why I don't care why we went into Iraq...I view victory there(as in representative govt) as the #1 way to combat radical Islam worldwide. It won't end the conflict or radical Islam...but it will be a blow to it...the biggest blow we can mount.
LinkMore than a month after the money transfer was discovered, the head of ISI, General Mehmood Ahmed resigned from his position. It was reported that the FBI was investigating the possibility that Gen. Ahmed ordered Saeed Sheikh to send the $100,000 to Atta <2>; there were also claims that Indian intelligence had already produced proof for the Pakistani administration that this was so.The Wall Street Journal was one of the only Western news organizations to follow up on the story, citing the Times of India: "US authorities sought removal after confirming the fact that $100,000 wired to WTC hijacker Mohammed Atta from Pakistan by Ahmad Umar Sheikh at the instance of Gen Mehmood."<3> Another Indian newspaper, the Daily Excelsior, quoting FBI sources, reported that the "FBI’s examination of the hard disk of the cellphone company Omar Sheikh had subscribed to led to the discovery of the "link" between him and the deposed chief of the Pakistani ISI, Gen. Mehmood Ahmed. And as the FBI investigators delved deep, sensational reports surfaced with regard to the transfer of 100,000 dollars to Mohammed Atta, one of the kamikaze pilots who flew his Boeing into the World Trade Centre. Gen. Mehmood Ahmed, the FBI investigators found, fully knew about the transfer of money to Atta."<4>
The Pittsburgh Tribune notes that "There are many in Musharraf's government who believe that Saeed Sheikh's power comes not from the ISI, but from his connections with our own CIA."<5>
Sheikh rose to prominence with the 2002 killing of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl, who at the time was in Pakistan investigating connections between the ISI and Islamic militant groups. In Pakistan, Sheikh was sentenced to death for killing Pearl, however his complicity in the execution and the reasons behind it are in dispute.
In an opinion piece published by the Wall Street Journal, Tunku Varadarajan has claimed that “It is a fact that Gen. Mehmood Ahmed, then head of the ISI, wired $100,000 to Mohamed Atta before 9/11 through an intermediary."
So Daniel Pearl was investigating the transfer of $100,000 from Omar Sheikh to Mohammed Atta in the weeks before 9/11, on the orders of the head of Pakistan's ISI, General Mehmood Ahmed...
The 9/11 Commission looks the other way when this information surfaces via Pearl's investigation.
Omar Sheikh orchestrates Daniel Pearl's death.
But we are conveniently told that Khalid Sheilk Mohammed is *the real killer* of Daniel Pearl,because he *confessed during waterboarding*.
Bhutto very matter-of-factly states in November, 2007 that Omar Sheikh assassinated Osama bin Laden.
Benazir Bhutto is assassinated on December 27, 2007.
Actually it isn't....the first thing I did after Sept 11th was go down to SA and try to join the armed forces. I wasn't deemed as suitable for being in the military inspite of getting 94 on my avsab, due to a head injury. They didn't want to spend the money it would take to clear me and I had no way of clearing myself. I don't care if anyone believes that or calls me a liar...because they're wrong. I know...America isn't the bad guy in this particular conflict. This is one of the rare opportunities we have to truly be the good guy. Only we don't want to do it...we want to be the indifferent guy, that minds his own business.
What these guys do to women, to minorities, to people who do not believe the way they do....is about 400 years behind the rest of the world...but their technology isn't. That's a huge problem....
"I don't care if anyone believes that or calls me a liar...because they're wrong." I've said to many people myself. You can call me anti-American or a terrorist sympathizer or weak on national defense but I too know they are wrong. I don't think America is the bad guy at all. Far from it. You guys just like to think us guys think that way and you are wrong.
A handout released on Friday by Pakistan's Interior Ministry shows images of Benazir Bhutto's vehicle. Interior ministry spokesman Javed Iqbal Cheema said on Friday Bhutto had not been shot, nor had she been hit by shrapnel from the blast but she had been killed when the force of the explosion crashed her head against a lever on the sun-roof of her vehicle.
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