A More Perfect Union

[Ignignokt]

what issue does obama stray away from the dnc?

How is he different than hillary?

i want these awnsers.

[Ignignokt]

Honestly dude, you don't believe in the guy, so why am I going to sit here wasting time arguing with you on the subject? Don't vote for him if you don't like him! Its fine. But don't say things that aren't true like you did above and then just ignore it when I point out how obviously wrong you are.

I believe in Obama because of what he says. Because of speeches like this. I can point to so many things in this speech that you'd be hard pressed to find equivalents for in any policy/speech/statement from any other modern American politician but there is no use pointing them out to you because you've already written it off.

I don't care about his speech.

I unlike you am not surprised he's able to say these things. He has a free pass by the media. He won't get grilled on his stances and he's free to make grandiose statements.

I would believe in him to if he had a real platform.

bUt that's the difference between you and me. I believe in action, you believe in words.

[MannyIsGod]

I don't believe his platform is very different from Clinton's. There are minor differences but for the most part the policy positions are the same.

How is he different from Hilary? Seriously? You're honestly asking this? He's not the career politician that Hilary is. He didn't vote for the Iraq war the way Hilary did. He isn't the polarizing figure Hilary is. He's a milestone that I believe would mean an incredible amount to a generation of minorities who view the world as unfair to them. Hilary is not that.

[BonnerDynasty]

Talk is cheap.

[MannyIsGod]

I don't care about his speech.

I unlike you am not surprised he's able to say these things. He has a free pass by the media. He won't get grilled on his stances and he's free to make grandiose statements.

I would believe in him to if he had a real platform.

bUt that's the difference between you and me. I believe in action, you believe in words.

I've never understood the free pass mentality. What exactly is he getting a free pass on? What isn't being scrutinized? What is a "real" platform and how does he lack it?

[Ignignokt]

I don't believe his platform is very different from Clinton's. There are minor differences but for the most part the policy positions are the same.

How is he different from Hilary? Seriously? You're honestly asking this? He's not the career politician that Hilary is. He didn't vote for the Iraq war the way Hilary did. He isn't the polarizing figure Hilary is. He's a milestone that I believe would mean an incredible amount to a generation of minorities who view the world as unfair to them. Hilary is not that.

He wasn't around to make the decision, he has the privelege to basically claim whatever he wants. ANd another thing while he was running for office, where was his balls then? He flip flopped on that issue, and was basically eye for eye saying the same thing that hillary was saying at the time.


Here we are all ing becuase america always votes for the candidate with the best superficial and surface qualities. And what does Manny do?

he tells us to vote for a candidate because he has better superficial qualities than the she . Nevermind his policies won't bring change, they're the same as clintons. and Universal healthcare has already been proposed. WHat new things is Obama proposing.



silence....

[MannyIsGod]

He wasn't around to make the decision, he has the privelege to basically claim whatever he wants. ANd another thing while he was running for office, where was his balls then? He flip flopped on that issue, and was basically eye for eye saying the same thing that hillary was saying at the time.


Here we are all ing becuase america always votes for the candidate with the best superficial and surface qualities. And what does Manny do?

he tells us to vote for a candidate because he has better superficial qualities than the she . Nevermind his policies won't bring change, they're the same as clintons. and Universal healthcare has already been proposed. WHat new things is Obama proposing.



silence....

You're focusing on one issue, not his entire platform of issues. This is ridiculous and pretty much why I quite posting a large amount here. If you want to analyze Obama and critique him as a candidate then do it. Go down his platform and look at each issue but to say he's not for change because he and Clinton both want universal HC is so disingenous.

[Ignignokt]

I've never understood the free pass mentality. What exactly is he getting a free pass on? What isn't being scrutinized? What is a "real" platform and how does he lack it?

The guy is recieving the most favorable news coverage of all time. Is not getting questioned about the real differences between him and hillary.

ANd his platform is all DNC and no independent thinking. He's adopted all off the Democrat party splinter groups platforms, and he's claiming he's for change.

Why isn't the media bring up that fact.

I mean if the media can manufacture fake national guard memo's and go the length with them, but they won't touch Rezko's connections with obama, which had not the greedy clintons brought it up. THat story would have never seen the time of day.

[Ignignokt]

You're focusing on one issue, not his entire platform of issues. This is ridiculous and pretty much why I quite posting a large amount here. If you want to analyze Obama and critique him as a candidate then do it. Go down his platform and look at each issue but to say he's not for change because he and Clinton both want universal HC is so disingenous.

If by one issue, you mean his platform. Yeah, newsflash!! that is a whole bunch of issues.

I only used UHC as an example because that's the only real change that would come out of this, which was hillary's baby to begin with. So if anything Hillary is the real change candidate.

but i don't give a .

Between bama and lary, i'd vote for obama bin unsubstantive.

[Spurminator]

Since when has the media ever given a about politicians' stances on issues? We reap what we sow. Maybe if we weren't so obsessed with juicy scandal when it comes to our public figures we'd hear more about the things we should actually care about.

[MannyIsGod]

The guy is recieving the most favorable news coverage of all time. Is not getting questioned about the real differences between him and hillary.

ANd his platform is all DNC and no independent thinking. He's adopted all off the Democrat party splinter groups platforms, and he's claiming he's for change.

Why isn't the media bring up that fact.

I mean if the media can manufacture fake national guard memo's and go the length with them, but they won't touch Rezko's connections with obama, which had not the greedy clintons brought it up. THat story would have never seen the time of day.

Anecdotal. Examples or GTFO. I know its shocking that a democrat has a platform simillar to other democrats but god damn. I understand your bitter about the National Guard stuff but they aren't talking about the Rezko stuff because there is nothing there.

I don't know why you're acting as though the media doesn't have an agenda anyway. Eh, w/e man. This gets old fast.

[MannyIsGod]

You honestly want them to report that his platform is a democrats platform?



Yeah - that'd be some great news there. I can't imagine why CNN and MSNBC aren't all over that one.

[clambake]

Obama speech: incredibly moving with fearless honesty.

McCain statement on Iraq: he had to be corrected by joe in the middle of it.

[Ignignokt]

Anecdotal. Examples or GTFO. I know its shocking that a democrat has a platform simillar to other democrats but god damn. I understand your bitter about the National Guard stuff but they aren't talking about the Rezko stuff because there is nothing there.

I don't know why you're acting as though the media doesn't have an agenda anyway. Eh, w/e man. This gets old fast.

How can one be bitter about the National Guard blooper when it cost your jackass presidential an election, and caused dan rather to resign. If anything i'm exstatic.

I did give you examples of the media going soft on obama, Rezko, and his claims on being for change being one.

Maybe your naive mind can't comprehend. If he's running against hillary and he's saying "vote for me, im for change". one would think that his platform is more current and different from the one his adversary is proposing? Right.

But no, we have to believe he's for change because of his oratorial skills?

give me a break.

I brought the issue.

Is Obama for change?

PRove it.

[clambake]

i guess we could vote for someone that proved today that they still have no idea about the complexities of the Iraqi population.

[MannyIsGod]

Obviously you're not understanding what he's saying change from if you think its from Hilary. He's not running for change in comparison to Hilary. If that was his stance he probably wouldn't be saying in debates that there isn't much difference in their platforms.

How can I have a discussion with you when you when your fundamental arguments are based in fantasy?

[Ignignokt]

You honestly want them to report that his platform is a democrats platform?




No, just want the media to question how adopting the same Washington style democrat politics is actually considered change.


Yeah - that'd be some great news there. I can't imagine why CNN and MSNBC aren't all over that one.


Me neither.

[Ignignokt]

Obviously you're not understanding what he's saying change from if you think its from Hilary. He's not running for change in comparison to Hilary. If that was his stance he probably wouldn't be saying in debates that there isn't much difference in their platforms.

How can I have a discussion with you when you when your fundamental arguments are based in fantasy?

obviously manny didn't watch the DNC debates when obama was actually saying he's the candidate for change.

I mean if all the democrats were for change, he'd have said, we're the candidates for change. But that wasn't the case.

So how can i ever discuss with you the merits of a good presidiential candidate when your expectations of those merits are based on fantasy?

[MannyIsGod]

If there was anything to the rezko situation the media would be all over it. They LOVE scandals. The simple truth is there is nothing there newsworthy. Thats not taking it easy on anything. Thats just the way it is.

[MannyIsGod]

obviously manny didn't watch the DNC debates when obama was actually saying he's the candidate for change.

I mean if all the democrats were for change, he'd have said, we're the candidates for change. But that wasn't the case.

So how can i ever discuss with you the merits of a good presidiential candidate when your expectations of those merits are based on fantasy?

You obviously have missed the context of his statements or simply continue to ignore them.

[MannyIsGod]

I'm done now - this thread is sufficiently derailed.

[Ignignokt]

If there was anything to the rezko situation the media would be all over it. They LOVE scandals. The simple truth is there is nothing there newsworthy. Thats not taking it easy on anything. Thats just the way it is.

Okay, if you must have that much faith in the media.

[Ignignokt]

You obviously have missed the context of his statements or simply continue to ignore them.

SO did hillary and edwards.

[Ignignokt]

bring back the great society.

Yeah that's change.

Obama supporters are the biggest batches of s.

Obama's message is not about change, but his platform is just pandering to the left of his party. His policies are a return to the age of Carter, Mondale, and Johnshon.

His message is not of change, but of a "retrospective" rekindling of proggressive politics.

Actual change politicians were Ross Perot in 92. Nader in 00.

Yet none of these guys were great speakers. therefore they never fit the criteria of change for gullible people like MannyisallboutWords.

[clambake]

being able to listen, yet not hear is something people should not put on their resume.