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The name Redskins was given to the team in honor of a Native American. There are a lot of Indians who would be angry if the term that was given in honor of their heritage was taken away...
So what you're saying is that because 25% of the people think it should be changed, it should be changed? That's ignorant. That's like when 5 out of 100 people say "In God We Trust" should be taken off the dollar bill, so we automatically should take it off...sorry Blake..argue all you want...you're wrong.offensiveness isn't based on a vote.
If one Native American says it's offensive to them and comes up with legitimate reasons why it's offensive, then that's all it takes to be offensive.
so the other 25% of Native Americans that are offended at the racial undertones of the word "redskin" are dumbasses?
No, you are clearly the clueless dumbass.
The name Redskins was given to the team in honor of a Native American. There are a lot of Indians who would be angry if the term that was given in honor of their heritage was taken away...
Great article Blake, glad you posted it. Good to know there are those out there (that have access to a media platform) and still feel there needs to be change despite the social pressure sports culture may create. As long as there are voices still clamoring for it, the day of change is still in view.
LMAO...dude..I was thinking of this shirt..but I didn't post it..lol
not today. today, the vast majority of its use is in respect to a football franchise.
if anything, the franchise name has taken power away from that euphemism.
That should suffice....and also have Dan Snyder do their eulogies in which he would say, "They truly died for the name."at this point, what's a few more dead indians...
just kill the one's that are offended and problem solved.
go ahead and ask them one last time if they find it offensive before pulling the trigger though...
it's the right thing to do.
The cool thing about message boards remain a platform for thoughts/ideas, no matter how radical. Someone who might have a great deal of influence in sports culture/society in the futute maybe reading this thread and may be having their outlook on the nickname shaped/or reshaped in a way that mgith propmt them to use what sway they may have down the line to promote a change in this area. Toss seeds into the winds of change.
John Deere or International Harvester?
Most native americans couldn't GAF. They're laughing all the way to the bank as they use casinos to fleece back their money from the stupid white man. Pretty soon they'll be handing out blankets to the white poor. Hopefully they don't lace them with smallpox the way we did to them.
Maybe then they can buy the team and change the name.
lol @ South Park reference.
I don't give a what their name is, but they are run by some stupid mofos. The Washington Redskins are going to draft an elite pass rusher, a guy who can get to the QB and bring his ass down at any level of football and make him stand up as a LB covering running backs in the flat? These stupid ass s are going to ruin the huge QB smashing talents of Brian Orakpo
I saaaaiiiiidddddd.
Hmmm, you should drive through the Native reservations I just drove through and then say that with a straight face. Pretty much the poorest places in our country.
There was a South Park reference in there?
I've had discussions about this with someone who has dome some intensive native studies. Oh one hand, I feel its a blatantly offensive name and Blake is completely right when he says that if there was a Blackskins mascot with a black dude running around on the field we'd have Al Sharpton with a pitchfork trying to kill Daniel Snyder.
On the other hand, I agree with ES when he says that no one really cares anymore.
There's really no justification for the name other than its no longer much of an issue and most natives don't care but that doesn't necessarily make it right.
I come to the defense of Blake and NewJerSpur only because of the ignorant comments made on this board, but not in the sense that the Redskins should change their name. Y'all need to let it go and worry about something else. This PC stuff has got to stop. You can always find something that offends you, but luckily we're in America (and there's nothing in the Cons ution for protection against hurt feelings) and the Redskins have the right to retain their name (especially since the name has no malicious intent behind it). Someone made a great point about the Yankees...what about all of the people in this country whose forefathers were killed by Union soldiers, aka Yankees, in the Civil War? Like you said, if it affects one person (which I'm sure it does somewhere), then it's legit. There's probably waaaaay more people who can relate to that than those who can relate to being a "redskin." You have never, and never will, hear the Yankee argument from anyone (and if you do, tell them to shut up) because it's ridiculous. Just like the Redskin argument is ridiculous. I'm not losing sleep over the Yankees and neither are the people who say "redskin" bothers them (I also know this doesn't really bother Blake and NewJerSpur).
And people who are against PC (political correctness) need to stop making ignorant comments to get their points across because it gives people like Blake and NewJerSpur a leg to stand on.
Last edited by TFloss32; 06-02-2009 at 04:32 PM.
WOW, all THREE of those lines coming to my defense, sort of....I'm honored.
For me, it's not about political correctness but more about not being ignorant, which is what one would be if they spotted a Native American in the street and said, "Excuse me, Redskin, can you help me out?" Based on the name and the logo that symbolizes it, we should feel free/obliged to do so, though I don't quite think as many take advantage of the opportunity as they should. Not quite the same as calling someone a Yankee and I also doubt the descendants of Confederate soldiers have quite the same citizenship issues that Native Americans deal with as a result of that war.
The other funny part to this discussion is the fact that there isn't a strong representation of Native Americans in the media to counter/balance/offset the ignorant sybolisms of these people (I'm saying these people like I'm not 1/16 or so Native American myself) and their culture, so what you see is what you think you get unless you do more research on their history and current plight today to gain a better appreciation.
As I said earlier, there are people who's understanding of the symbolism causes them to want to go into action to make a to stomp the ignorance out and there are those that may have grown desensitized to it IMO. Hopefully, there are those here (active members or lurkers) that after reading through these threads take into consideration all of these perspectives and use them to plant seeds of change in the future.
First of all, I appreciate you being able to debate with me without getting defensive or making stupid jokes that are completely off the topic. It looks like we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. You make very valid points, but you're wishing for things that will never come to fruition because they're not a priority for our country (even though they probably should be). And I seriously doubt anyone is ignorant enough (unless they were purposely being stupid) to walk up to a Native American and say, "Hey, Mr. Redskin." PC and ignorance go hand in hand.
Back to the Yankee comment...I made an analogy in order to get the point across that both names are linked to extreme violence and death. Just because the majority of people killed in the Civil War were white men, it doesn't make it any less of a sensitive subject. All in all, there are so many high school, college and pro teams that would have to change their names if you dig deep enough to find a problem with that name. Native Americans have much bigger problems than worrying about if a professional sports team is using an offensive nickname.
I agree with you on the media comment....but seriously, we both know mainstream media (both left and right) is complete crap. They report biased news or anything that will get them ratings (can anyone here watch Bill O'Reilly or Charles Gibson without cringing?) I mean, I have to hear about what kind of dog the Obama family is getting for the White House for two weeks straight. Why do you think Americans are so uninformed about everything? They let biased media outlets do the thinking for them. You're never going to hear about the crappy lifestyle that most Native Americans have to handle on a daily basis unless you seek out info for yourself. It's not a media priority and never will be. I'm all for making positive change, but people have to pick their battles and this certain Native American group is just spinning their wheels with Redskin thing.
Even if the Redskins were to drop their name... it would not change the history of the Native American people, improve the oppressed lifestyle that they currently live or enlighten anyone (who may be ignorant of their situation) to that oppressed lifestyle. You can say it's a step in the direction towards "change," but we know it won't make a difference because people would forget about it just as quickly as they were informed.
Last edited by TFloss32; 06-03-2009 at 11:32 AM.
How much of a priority it is to change the name is irrelevant.
If it's offensive to a group of people and they have legitimate reasons why it should be changed, then it should be changed. That's pretty much it.
Calling someone a yankee is not derogatory. I don't know anyone that finds it offensive.
You're right Blake, it is irrelevant. But since it's NOT a priority to the national media (which can affect any and everything) or anyone else besides certain Native Americans, it won't change. I'm not saying it should or should not be changed. All I know is the Redskins retain the right to keep their name regardless if it's ignorant or not PC. There's a reason why there aren't any laws or precedents set for hurt feelings, because someone is always going to be ing about how something offends them (whether their argument holds water or not).
And I revert back to the Yankee comment because you, clearly, didn't read it all the way through. Yankee is not a derogatory term, but it is linked to extreme violence and the brutal history of our country. I bet that bothers some people (even though it shouldn't, because it's just a name). Should the Yankees change that if a group from the South is up in arms about it? And just because you don't know anyone that finds Yankee offensive, it doesn't mean they don't exist. I'm sure there's a hillbilly in Alabama somewhere that would love to get his hands on a "Yankee"because he wants to defend his great-great-great grandfather's honor. You never hear anyone say Redskin is offensive until a media outlet reports a story similar to this one and people all of a sudden want to take a stand on the issue (another good example of how the media controls most citizens' thinking). I'm sure you hadn't thought twice about it until you ran across this article. And, once again, I'm sure you don't really care.
Last edited by TFloss32; 06-03-2009 at 05:09 PM.
That's my whole point right there in a nuts . Doesn't sound too complimentary under normal cir stances but an exception is supposed to be made when it comes to sports apparently. As far as the PC and ignorance, I agree to a degree, but trying to be politically correct with terminology for a good number of people is done for the sake of simply not wanting to sound ignorant more so than a genuine desire to not want to be ignorant, that's why for me it goes a bit deeper than just political correctness.First of all, I appreciate you being able to debate with me without getting defensive or making stupid jokes that are completely off the topic
I have no problem with changing a name or group of names at the expense of promoting something ignorant or truly insensitive. Not sure Yankee quite carries the same racial tone as Redskin but I guess if it is offensive to those that still embrace the idea of a United States divided they have the right to push for a trade-off: the namesake for the Confederate flag I guess.
The reason I think it's a good battle is because, again, there isn't even enough of a presence in the media to even balance/offset the demeaning namesakes and symbolisms that represent Native Americans and their culture. People are primarily given their ideas of such things through pervasive mediums such as professional and semi-pro sports, so I feel it's a good place to start the education process by first throwing out the antiquated ideas of who these people are.
The name change itself likely wouldn't result in an immediate change regarding the plight of struggling Native American communities, but it opens the door for their iden ies to be reshaped within the eyes of the general public so they can climb out of the time warp they've been placed in/relegated to, be seen in more of a human light, and gain more of a voice with which to tell their current story.
EDIT: And agreeing to disagree is cool with me. The coolest thing in debating is having the opportunity to exchange ideas (as civilly as possible) with the potential to learn a new perspective (that may even make you sharpen yours that much more) as well as impart something that may help change someone else's in a positive way in the long run. Sounds corny, but it's the reason I don't have a problem discussing these things.
Last edited by NewJerSpur; 06-03-2009 at 03:58 PM.
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