Top Ten Coaches in NBA history

[scanry]

Any list that has Larry Brown and Don Nelson over Pop is seriously flawed.

Mikan, Russell, KAJ, Magic, Bird, MJ, Shaq, Duncan & Kobe.

All the teams that won multiple championships needed the above players and they were the league best over an extended period of time (Lebron should join that list pretty soon).

Coaches wouldn't win squat without the greatest of players, but some coaches like Brown, PJ, Riley & Pop can bring a little more to the table than others. Case in point, Phili . With Lebron on his side, it actually looked like he out-coached Scott Brooks in the Finals.

[Galileo]

I don't know what you did different. Still looks just as sucky.

I didn't change the point system, I just added some new stats to look at.

[Galileo]

Championships need to be given much more weight. Give 200 pts for a championship and see where the coaches are ranked.

If you win the championship, you not only get the 100 points, you get 32 points for the playoff wins and probably at least 55 points for regular season wins and probably another 25 for the division win. So if you win a ring, you probably got 200 points, worth about 5 seasons of a .500 coach.

[Galileo]

Where's Rick Adleman?

He just missed out on the top 10, he was in the top 15 I think.

[Galileo]

The biggest glaring problem with this approach is that you need to find a way to normalize the variant amounts of years coached (for example points per year) in order for anyone to take this even a quarter of the way seriously.

The longer a coach is around, the greater is his impact. You don't become a legendary coach in a short number of years, except maybe in the rare case of an early and unexpected death (like Knute Rockne in college football).

[Galileo]

The fact that COY winners are almost always fired at the most 3-4 years after winning the award shows how meaningless and stupid it is. It's the award given to a coach who burns his starters out playing 40 MPG during the regular season so he gets the award because everyone says, "Wow! He really got them to over achieve!" Then a few years later people realize that the coach will never lead a serious playoff run because he doesn't manage minutes or integrate the bench. Tom Thibodeau is the latest example of this.

Jerry Sloan is also one of the most overrated coaches of all time. His teams have always been mediocre defensively, his offense consists of whoring the 1 4 pick and roll with 3 point shooters to space. That offense is great at racking up wins and maybe a few lucky playoff runs when the team's conference has a really down year (like the 1997 or 1998 Western Conference) but it'll never win a championship especially with the mediocre defense Sloan's teams played. He's a glorified Mike D'antoni, the difference being he actually expects some kind of discipline and intelligence from his players.

The COY is the coaches equivalent of the MVP.

[Galileo]

IMO, Larry Brown is still the best coach in NBA history at getting the most out of his teams. His weakness is the fact he always seems to abruptly burn bridges and leave his team on bad terms and there are certain players he gives up on way too quickly and refuses to even try developing. The way his teams always played defense is why I put him near or at the top.

Larry Brown is also one of the few on this list who was a successful college coach.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The COY is the coaches equivalent of the MVP.

If that was the case, we wouldn't see mediocre coaches like Sam Mitc , Mike D'antoni, and Byron Scott winning it as frequently as they do.

[DMC]

Something people keep forgetting, tbh. Can't win when you can't keep the egos happy

Underhanded Phil Jackson lobbying.

[DMC]

The COY is the coaches equivalent of the MVP.

I disagree. The MVP has never been a ty player. It's never going to happen.

CotY is the coaches equivalent to Adam Morrison's rings.


Multiple Winners
6 - Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
5 - Michael Jordan
5 - Bill Russell
4 - Wilt Chamberlain
3 - Larry Bird
3 - Magic Johnson
3 - Moses Malone
2 - LeBron James
2 - Tim Duncan
2 - Karl Malone
2 - Steve Nash
2 - Bob Pet



2010-11 Tom Thibodeau Chicago
2009-10 Scott Brooks Oklahoma City
2008-09Mike BrownCleveland
2007-08Byron ScottNew Orleans
2006-07Sam Mitc Toronto
2005-06Avery JohnsonDallas
2004-05Mike D'AntoniPhoenix
2003-04Hubie BrownMemphis
2002-03Gregg PopovichSan Antonio
2001-02Rick CarlisleDetroit
2000-01Larry BrownPhiladelphia
1999-00Doc RiversOrlando
1998-99Mike DunleavyPortland
1997-98Larry BirdIndiana
1996-97Pat RileyMiami
1995-96Phil JacksonChicago
1994-95Del HarrisLos Angeles Lakers
1993-94Lenny WilkensAtlanta
1992-93Pat RileyNew York
1991-92Don NelsonGolden State
1990-91Don ChaneyHouston
1989-90Pat RileyLos Angeles Lakers
1988-89Cotton FitzsimmonsPhoenix
1987-88Doug MoeDenver
1986-87Mike SchulerPortland
985-86Mike FratelloAtlanta
1984-85Don NelsonMilwaukee
1983-84Frank LaydenUtah
1982-83Don NelsonMilwaukee
1981-82Gene ShueWashington
1980-81Jack McKinneyIndiana
1979-80Bill FitchBoston
1978-79Cotton FitzsimmonsKansas City

[Galileo]

That is a good question, I always thought he was a solid coach...13, 14?

Chuck Daly has to be in the mix at 11 or 12.

Daly did not coach all that long and just missed the top 10.

[Galileo]

If that was the case, we wouldn't see mediocre coaches like Sam Mitc , Mike D'antoni, and Byron Scott winning it as frequently as they do.

It is more difficult to quantify the value of a coach than a player. That's one reason why long service is a must for the all time great coaches.

[racm]

The fact that COY winners are almost always fired at the most 3-4 years after winning the award shows how meaningless and stupid it is. It's the award given to a coach who burns his starters out playing 40 MPG during the regular season so he gets the award because everyone says, "Wow! He really got them to over achieve!" Then a few years later people realize that the coach will never lead a serious playoff run because he doesn't manage minutes or integrate the bench. Tom Thibodeau is the latest example of this.

Jerry Sloan is also one of the most overrated coaches of all time. His teams have always been mediocre defensively, his offense consists of whoring the 1 4 pick and roll with 3 point shooters to space. That offense is great at racking up wins and maybe a few lucky playoff runs when the team's conference has a really down year (like the 1997 or 1998 Western Conference) but it'll never win a championship especially with the mediocre defense Sloan's teams played. He's a glorified Mike D'antoni, the difference being he actually expects some kind of discipline and intelligence from his players.

Didn't Pop get COY for doing the exact opposite?

[DMC]

Didn't Pop get COY for doing the exact opposite?

There was no big turn around team this year, otherwise Pop gets nothing.

Collins was a shoo-in except he the bed late in the season but a timely injury in Chicago made him look better than he is, but he's not a bad coach.

[Galileo]

There was no big turn around team this year, otherwise Pop gets nothing.

Collins was a shoo-in except he the bed late in the season but a timely injury in Chicago made him look better than he is, but he's not a bad coach.

iffa coulda woulda shoulda, blah, blah....

[Kidd K]

Sort of fits, but:

Too much stock in longevity. Simply coach for 40 years, never win a le, you can be "best coach ever" under those standards.

No inclusion of penalty for coaches leaving teams when they're in rebuilding phase and joining one that's on the upswing with a huge ceiling (Riley, Jackson). Which inflates their stats significantly.

No bonus for ratio of good seasons to bad. Example: Popovich has had 0 losing seasons, 0 sub .500 seasons, and 0 sub .600 seasons. Never missed playoffs. Worst season: .610%. There's no props for that? Because last time I checked, a guy who's never worse than .610 is better than a guy who's .500+ for 15 seasons out of 20, but under .500 for 5, but his total wins exceed the total wins of the 15 season coach so he's listed higher. Kinda dropped the ball with that, but I appreciate the time put into the list, and the coming up with a system.

I just personally don't see how Pop can be any worse than 4th. Don Nelson ranked higher because he coaches twice as long? He has less playoff wins, less division les, and 0 les to 4 despite playing twice as long, and is ranked higher.

Definitely need to change the standards a little imo. But again, making a system and whatnot was a good idea. It's just a bit flawed.

[DMC]

iffa coulda woulda shoulda, blah, blah....

I don't think you get it.

Pop did great, the team did better than expected, but the award almost always goes to a turn around team and Philly was right there with it until late season.

That's why the anomaly of selecting a coach based on a different criteria other than "hottest team vs last year".

Who got it last year? Thibs. Why? Bulls finished top of the league and vs previous year, better overall improvement than any other team.

It's not a coulda, woulda wtf ever. It's not even about Collins. It's about the CotY award system.

[DMC]

Sort of fits, but:

Too much stock in longevity. Simply coach for 40 years, never win a le, you can be "best coach ever" under those standards.

[racm]

Pop had a losing record in 1996-97, though I'll give you that he's never had a full losing season.

Also, I think Pop got the award this season because of how the Spurs would go on a tear every now and then. Finishing with a better regular season record with a single All-Star, an old Duncan, and missing Ginobili for half of the season than the eventual champion probably merited it.

[DMC]

Pop had a losing record in 1996-97, though I'll give you that he's never had a full losing season.

Also, I think Pop got the award this season because of how the Spurs would go on a tear every now and then. Finishing with a better regular season record with a single All-Star, an old Duncan, and missing Ginobili for half of the season than the eventual champion probably merited it.

And because no other coach/team stood out.

With all Phil's success, he's won 1 CotY to go with Kobe's 1 season MVP. Shows their truth worth.

[racm]

The only time Phil won COY was when the Bulls went on their 72 win season.

And true. Every other contender rode their stars into the ground.

[Girasuck]

Jerry Sloan is also one of the most overrated coaches of all time. His teams have always been mediocre defensively, his offense consists of whoring the 1 4 pick and roll with 3 point shooters to space. That offense is great at racking up wins and maybe a few lucky playoff runs when the team's conference has a really down year (like the 1997 or 1998 Western Conference) but it'll never win a championship especially with the mediocre defense Sloan's teams played. He's a glorified Mike D'antoni, the difference being he actually expects some kind of discipline and intelligence from his players.

Agree for the most part. Utah's really never used 3 point shooters to space, just bodies around the perimeter. Mark Eaton's biggest role in the offense was to stand 35 feet away, then dive into the lane for offensive rebounds.

The 90's Jazz teams actually were pretty good defensively, so that's really the only thing I disagree with you on.

[Galileo]

Sort of fits, but:

Too much stock in longevity. Simply coach for 40 years, never win a le, you can be "best coach ever" under those standards.

No inclusion of penalty for coaches leaving teams when they're in rebuilding phase and joining one that's on the upswing with a huge ceiling (Riley, Jackson). Which inflates their stats significantly.

No bonus for ratio of good seasons to bad. Example: Popovich has had 0 losing seasons, 0 sub .500 seasons, and 0 sub .600 seasons. Never missed playoffs. Worst season: .610%. There's no props for that? Because last time I checked, a guy who's never worse than .610 is better than a guy who's .500+ for 15 seasons out of 20, but under .500 for 5, but his total wins exceed the total wins of the 15 season coach so he's listed higher. Kinda dropped the ball with that, but I appreciate the time put into the list, and the coming up with a system.

I just personally don't see how Pop can be any worse than 4th. Don Nelson ranked higher because he coaches twice as long? He has less playoff wins, less division les, and 0 les to 4 despite playing twice as long, and is ranked higher.

Definitely need to change the standards a little imo. But again, making a system and whatnot was a good idea. It's just a bit flawed.

No one has ever coached 40 years in the NBA. Even if they did, and won a couple les, they'd be hard pressed to catch Jackson in points.

[Galileo]

Top Ten Coaches in NBA history

Galileo's Point system:

win = 1 point
playoff win = 2 points
division le = 25 points
conference championship = 50 points
NBA championship = 100 points
coach of year = 100 points

ABA & BAA stats count 1/2

1. Phil Jackson; 20 years, 3238 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...acksph01c.html

1155 wins
229 playoff wins
13 division les
2 conference champs
11 NBA champs
1 coach of year

2. Pat Riley; 24 years, 2977 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...ileypa01c.html

1210 wins
171 playoff wins
17 division les
4 conference champs
5 NBA champs
3 coach of year

3. Red Auerbach; 20 years, 2435.5 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...uerbre99c.html

995.5 wins
95 playoff wins
10 division les
9 NBA champs
1 coach of year

4. Larry Brown; 30 years, 2029 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...rownla01c.html

1212.5 wins
110 playoff wins
8.5 division les
2 conference champs
1 NBA champ
2.5 coach of year

5. Don Nelson; 31 years, 1960 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...elsodo01c.html

1335 wins
75 playoff wins
7 division les
3 coach of year

6. Greg Popovich; 16 years, 1908 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...opovgr99c.html

847 wins
118 playoffs wins
9 division les
4 NBA champs
2 coach of year

UPDATE:

Since this post, Pop has racked up;

120 regular season wins = 120 points
16 playoff wins = 32 points (not counting tonight's game)
2 division les = 50 points
1 conference championship = 50 points
1 coach of year award = 100 points

352 news points

new total 2260 points for Pop.

Pop now moves into 4th of all time, passes Nelson and Brown.

Trails only Auerbach, Riley and Jackson. Auerbach within sight.

Go CIA Pop!

[Galileo]

Top Ten Coaches in NBA history

Galileo's Point system:

win = 1 point
playoff win = 2 points
division le = 25 points
conference championship = 50 points
NBA championship = 100 points
coach of year = 100 points

ABA & BAA stats count 1/2

1. Phil Jackson; 20 years, 3238 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...acksph01c.html

1155 wins
229 playoff wins
13 division les
2 conference champs
11 NBA champs
1 coach of year

2. Pat Riley; 24 years, 2977 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...ileypa01c.html

1210 wins
171 playoff wins
17 division les
4 conference champs
5 NBA champs
3 coach of year

3. Red Auerbach; 20 years, 2435.5 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...uerbre99c.html

995.5 wins
95 playoff wins
10 division les
9 NBA champs
1 coach of year

4. Larry Brown; 30 years, 2029 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...rownla01c.html

1212.5 wins
110 playoff wins
8.5 division les
2 conference champs
1 NBA champ
2.5 coach of year

5. Don Nelson; 31 years, 1960 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...elsodo01c.html

1335 wins
75 playoff wins
7 division les
3 coach of year

6. Greg Popovich; 16 years, 1908 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...opovgr99c.html

847 wins
118 playoffs wins
9 division les
4 NBA champs
2 coach of year

7. Lenny Wilkens; 32 years, 1792 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...ilkele01c.html

1332 wins
80 playoff wins
2 division les
1 conference champ
1 NBA champ
1 coach of year

8. Jerry Sloan; 26 years, 1692 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...loanje01c.html

1221 wins
98 playoff wins
7 division les
2 conference champs

9. Bill Fitch; 25 years, 1529 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...itchbi99c.html

944 wins
55 playoff wins
5 division les
1 conference champ
1 NBA champ
2 coach of year

10. George Karl; 24 years, 1480 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...karlge01c.html

1074 wins
78 playoff wins
8 division les
1 conference champ

BONUS STATS ON THE TOP 10:

50-win seasons:

Jackson 17
Riley 17
Popovich 14
Nelson 13
Sloan 13
Karl 11
Brown 9.5 (3 ABA counts as 1.5)
Wilkens 9
Auerbach 8
Fitch 5

Made playoffs:

Riley 21
Karl 21
Jackson 20
Brown 20 (4 ABA counts as 2)
Wilkens 20
Sloan 20
Nelson 18
Auerbach 18 (2 BAA counts as 1)
Popovich 15
Fitch 13

.500+ record:

Sloan 23
Brown 22 (4 ABA counts as 2)
Riley 21
Nelson 21
Wilkens 21
Karl 21
Jackson 20
Auerbach 17.5 (3 BAA counts as 1.5)
Popovich 15
Fitch 11

UPDATE:

4. Greg Popovich; 18 years, 2390 points

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...opovgr99c.html

967 wins
149 playoffs wins
11 division les
5 NBA champs
1 conference champ
3 coach of year