Mvp Race

[1Parker1]

My ballot has not changed since December:

1. Kobe Bryant - His game is well-rounded, and although it would be unprecedented because the best teams usually have the MVP on their roster, his numbers do justify the belief he's the best offensive player in the NBA.

2. Chauncey Billups - Forget the player - I tell you the 3rd pick in the draft will have a career year of 19, 9, and 4 for the best team in the NBA after already winning the Finals MVP. He'll hit all the big shots for a team that is poised for its 4th consecutive Conference Finals, and 3rd straight NBA Finals Appearance while having the best regular season in a 49-year-old franchise. Does that not sound like a legitimate MVP candidate? Then stop looking for the flash and remembering that he was traded 4 times, playing for 6 different teams. He is having a career-year and the Pistons have been the best team in the league that season. Tim Duncan in 2003, Shaquille O'Neal in 2000, Michael Jordan in 1996, and Larry Bird in 1986 - Billups is the best player on the best team, and that usually equals MVP.

3. Steve Nash - He's the best passer and penetrator in the game, but he's a manador on defense, and as brilliant as he's been, it wasn't worthy of being mentioned as a two-time MVP when Shaquille O'Neal hasn't even done that.

4. Elton Brand - There's a difference between the best player on the team and a great player in the league and being the difference between winning and losing. The best player can be in place and the team still lose. Brand is the lesson on that this season.

5. Dirk Nowitzki - An outside candidate who has put together his best season, but has fallen out of favor because of his disappearance down the stretch of the season.

December 16, 2005 - That's when I originally wrote up this list (albeit without the comments).

Wade and Shaq are 6 and 7.

Completely agree with that list. Except I'd probably put Lebron and Wade at 6 and 7.

[pking]

I just don't think that you guys watch Mavs games judging on how you say Dirk has disappeared at the end of this season.

Not that I'm saying he deserves the MVP (I think he does, but that's beside the point) but Dirk has stepped up late. He played much better in March than any other time in the season. 30 points and just over 10 boards for the month. I think you assume Dirk hasn't played well because the Mavs lost quite a bit in March. The Mavs were also out 4 of their top 8 guys, obviously things aren't as easy in that situation. Dirk's been phenomenal though.

[v2000]

I just don't think that you guys watch Mavs games judging on how you say Dirk has disappeared at the end of this season.

Not that I'm saying he deserves the MVP (I think he does, but that's beside the point) but Dirk has stepped up late. He played much better in March than any other time in the season. 30 points and just over 10 boards for the month. I think you assume Dirk hasn't played well because the Mavs lost quite a bit in March. The Mavs were also out 4 of their top 8 guys, obviously things aren't as easy in that situation. Dirk's been phenomenal though.

agreed. some of these people are simply ignorant to say that Dirk has fallen off, and that he isnt a top MVP candidate.

[JamStone]

Dirk is definitely a top MVP candidate. I don't think he's the frontrunner, but I certainly think he's a top 5 candidate. It doesn't help that Dallas has lost a few games recently, but Dirk has still been playing well and putting up great numbers. The only two really subpar games (subpar for him anyway) last month were against San Antonio and Detroit, two of the better if not best defensive teams in the league. And, he still put up decent numbers.

Dirk deserves every bit of consideration he's getting. It might not be enough to win the award, but he's a top 5 candidate easily.

[Trainwreck2100]

A loss to the Knicks should automatically disqualify you as an MVP candidate

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

A loss to the Knicks should automatically disqualify you as an MVP candidate

That takes Chauncey, Dirk, Lebron and Nash off the list...

[Banks91]

A loss to the Knicks should automatically disqualify you as an MVP candidate

Dude, i don't really follow your posts, so i don't know whether you're serious or not. But if you are, i don't know how anyone can take you serious here.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i see dirk gettin it, i dont care if his rebs n ass are down this season, his backin that up with his team record....

[mavsfan1000]

My ballot has not changed since December:

1. Kobe Bryant - His game is well-rounded, and although it would be unprecedented because the best teams usually have the MVP on their roster, his numbers do justify the belief he's the best offensive player in the NBA.

2. Chauncey Billups - Forget the player - I tell you the 3rd pick in the draft will have a career year of 19, 9, and 4 for the best team in the NBA after already winning the Finals MVP. He'll hit all the big shots for a team that is poised for its 4th consecutive Conference Finals, and 3rd straight NBA Finals Appearance while having the best regular season in a 49-year-old franchise. Does that not sound like a legitimate MVP candidate? Then stop looking for the flash and remembering that he was traded 4 times, playing for 6 different teams. He is having a career-year and the Pistons have been the best team in the league that season. Tim Duncan in 2003, Shaquille O'Neal in 2000, Michael Jordan in 1996, and Larry Bird in 1986 - Billups is the best player on the best team, and that usually equals MVP.

3. Steve Nash - He's the best passer and penetrator in the game, but he's a manador on defense, and as brilliant as he's been, it wasn't worthy of being mentioned as a two-time MVP when Shaquille O'Neal hasn't even done that.

4. Elton Brand - There's a difference between the best player on the team and a great player in the league and being the difference between winning and losing. The best player can be in place and the team still lose. Brand is the lesson on that this season.

5. Dirk Nowitzki - An outside candidate who has put together his best season, but has fallen out of favor because of his disappearance down the stretch of the season.

December 16, 2005 - That's when I originally wrote up this list (albeit without the comments).

Wade and Shaq are 6 and 7.

You are very uninformed if you think that Dirk is disappearing down the stretch. Dirk was awesome in March but the rest of the team dropped off considerably due to the injuries.

[JamStone]

You are very uninformed if you think that Dirk is disappearing down the stretch. Dirk was awesome in March but the rest of the team dropped off considerably due to the injuries.

You have to admit that Dirk had poor games in March against Detroit (9-23 FG, 4 TO) and San Antonio (6-15 FG, 1-5 3PT), two very important games not only record-wise, but for the psyche of the Dallas Mavericks team as a whole. And, Dirk was outplayed in both those games by other MVP candidates, Tony Parker and Chauncey Billups. Not only that, but Dirk was locked up in fourth quarters of that Spurs game and two others by Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, and Richard Jefferson ... all great defenders, but all considerably smaller than Dirk. Not very MVPish.

So, if in the two biggest games late in the season against the two teams with the best records in the league, Dirk does not play well, wouldn't that
be an indication that Dirk has lost some points with respect to the MVP race?

I still feel Dirk is in the MVP conversation. But, you can't just look at his numbers and say he hasn't slipped at all. Look at his performances against the top teams that actually play defense. Look at him being shut down by smaller wing players. Look at the Mavericks' March record of 9-8. Those all contribute to some tarnishing of the "MVP" rep he built through most of the season, despite still putting up very good numbers as a whole. You can't just look at stats, otherwise LeBron James would easily beat out every other player in the NBA for the League MVP.

[mavsfan1000]

You pick 2 random games to deter Dirk's chances for MVP? I would be interested in seeing how Nash, Kobe, and Lebron do against the best defenders at their position.

[Darrin]

You are very uninformed if you think that Dirk is disappearing down the stretch. Dirk was awesome in March but the rest of the team dropped off considerably due to the injuries.

Yeah, perhaps that was a cheap shot. I watched two games and thought I knew it all. I guess I can start working for ESPN.

[JamStone]

Not 2 random games. 2 games against the 2 best teams in the league. 2 all-important games in the race for the best record in the league. 2 MARCH games, when all the games are starting to matter in terms of playoff positioning and making a statement. Those are NOT 2 random games.

And, the thing is Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, and Richard Jeffesron are not the best defender's at DIRK'S POSITION. Dirk is a 7-foot perimeter power forward. All of those defenders are 6-7 small forwards. We're not talking about Kevin Garnett locking down Dirk. We're talking about guys who are used to playing mostly perimeter defense on guys about the same size. Dirk had the height advantage, the length advantage. That's why it's hard to understand why he would get locked up by those three in the FOURTH QUARTER when the game is on the line.

And, Steve Nash struggled against the Pistons in the second meeting. He played very well in the first meeting, but the Suns lost both games. I don't know how well he's played against San Antonio.

Kobe has lit up Ron Artest this year.

LeBron has lit up almost everybody this year. He may have had problems with Artest, but they're the same size. Dirk is better. Get the difference?

Plus, if you want to claim that Dirk has more MVP credibility because of his team's record, then you have to respond to the fact that Dallas was 9-8 in March and why you don't think that Dirk hasn't slipped in the MVP race.

[LEONARD]

Dirk lit up Artest on Tuesday...

We'll see about a new gameplan on Bowen tomorrow...

[mavsfan1000]

Bowen has incredible reaction time and Artest doesn't. Bowen is relentless and I could see why that bothers Dirk as well as everyone else in the league. As for the Pistons game Dirk should've done better. Rasheed isn't a bad defender but definitely one Dirk should have a speed advantage over. Ben Wallace guarded Dirk well though. The mavs were very depleted and they were on the road. We'll see about the MVP race but those 2 games shouldn't decide the MVP considering most teams struggle against those 2 teams.

[JamStone]

I didn't say those two games should "DECIDE" the MVP race. The direction of the discussion was that Dirk had slipped in the MVP race recently. He's absolutely still in the race. I don't go so far as to saying he's dropped out of the MVP race. But, if you can't see that he lost some of MVP luster, then you're not being objective enough.

The Mavs went 9-8 in the month of March. That HAS to be taken into consdieration, despite the injuries to the Mavericks team. Steve Nash is starting to wear down and the Suns are losing more games, and that's going to hurt his chances. Same thing for Dirk. Most of his stats were still great throughout March. But, against San Antonio and Detroit, and against defenders like Richard Jefferson and Ron Artest (not last Tuesday's game obviously, but the previous meeting) should tell you that Dirk is not the frontrunner for the MVP.

In fact, a lot of the MVP leading candidates have had some rough games recently ... Dirk, Nash, LeBron last night through most of the game and then the last play of the game. But, all three are still top contenders for the award.

And, as for struggling against Detroit and San Antonio, you're right. Most teams and most players struggle against their defenses. But, it's interesting to note that Kobe Bryant has lit up both those teams, and rather easily.

[mavsfan1000]

Well Kobe Bryant is probably the most talented individual player but his team has struggled all year. Does he get a pass for a average team and Dirk doesn't for 1 month of his team struggling? Dirk's team talent in the month of march is similar to Kobe if you take out Howard, Harris, and Griffin. Maybe slightly better but the schedule got much tougher. Also having 2 cba players (Powell and Marshall) including one starting didn't help.

[JamStone]

After the way the Mavs started the season, you hold a higher standard for Dallas. The Lakers were mediocre team all season long. That doesn't change for just one month, just as it doesn't change for Dirk for just won month that his team has been one of the top 5 teams all season long.

And ...

Jason Terry, Jerry Stackhouse, Marquis Daniels, Erick Dampier, Darrell Armstrong, Rawle Marshall, Josh Powell, and DeSagana Diop

is not just a little better than

Lamar Odom, Kwame Brown, Chris Mihm, Brian Cook, Smush Parker, Devean George, Sasha Vujacic, and Luke Walton


The Mavs without Howard, Harris, and Griffin are still miles ahead of the Lakers supporting cast, and you can't even be serious if you argue otherwise. Smush Parker has started for the Lakers all year long, and you want to mention Rawle Marshall and Josh Powell?

And, you're right about the fact Kobe shouldn't get a pass for his struggling team all year. He should not win the MVP either. I personally think he's up there and I'd vote for him myself, but I agree that because of his team's record, he shouldn't get it. And, thereby hurting your argument to give Dirk a pass for the month of March.

March is much more significant anyway. And, the Lakers went 10-7, including wins over Detroit and San Antonio. Kobe averaged 34 points in March himself.

Dirk is still a top candidate for MVP. I've just been saying he hasn't helped himself over the last month or so. Last year we saw that a team winning trumps all other stats with respect to the MVP race when Steve Nash won the MVP. Nash wasn't even one of the top 3 scorers on his team.

LeBron has better overall stats than any other player in the league. And, his team just reeled off 9 wins in a row recently. Dirk is putting up great numbers and has lost to teams like Cleveland and Orlando recently.

Sooner or later, no matter how much you love Dirk Nowitzki, you have to realize and admit that he is not an MVP favorite. I would still put him in the top 5. But, I still like Nash, LeBron, or Kobe ahead of him. And, in my own homer glasses, I see Chauncey Billups making some headway into the conversation because those other four have had some struggles recently when the games mean the most, and recently Chauncey has outplayed both Dirk and Nash in head-to-head meetings with Detroit against both Phoenix and Dallas.

[mavsfan1000]

I guess team records don't matter if Kobe and Lebron are ahead of Dirk. The records are not even close and Lebron got some players this offseason. Hughes, Marshall, and Damon Jones. They help spread the floor out so I wasn't surprised Lebron had such a good offensive season this year. Kobe Bryant has done great with less but that doesn't mean if you put him on the mavs instead of Dirk he'll do better or the same with the suns in place of Nash. Chemistry should matter also. Nash and Dirk seem to have the best chemistry with their team while Kobe and Lebron have the best individual stats.

[JamStone]

You do realize Larry Hughes missed 45 games this season, right? If Josh Howard misses 45 games this season, do you think the Mavs would have the record they have? We've already seen what Josh Howard missing 20 or so games has done to the Mavs over the last few weeks. Larry Hughes missed about 20 more games than Josh Howard and the Mavs have 11 more wins than the Cavs. You do the math.

I didn't say team records don't matter. The absolutely do. In fact, I think they matter very much. I think LeBron's overall statistics are just that impressive that it overrides the team record. And, the Cavs still have a pretty good record, at any rate.

As for Kobe, it is definitely a subjective opinion, but I think without Kobe, that Lakers team would have a similar record as the Knicks, if not worse. That's how valuable I think Kobe is to his team. Again, if you take things like that into consideration, you make your own decision as to who is deserving.

We can flip flop all you want. But, you want to credit Dirk with MVP consideration because of Dallas' record, but then you blow off the fact that Dallas was 9-8 in essentially the most important month of the NBA regular season. You want to talk about team records and say nothing of Chauncey Billups and Tony Parker.

So, you would go back to the argument that Dirk has better stats than Chauncey and Parker or that they have better teammates. Well, I guess you want the best of both worlds, and that's a fair assessment, to a certain degree. We all have to weigh what is most important, team success, individual success, and intangibles.

You want to talk about the chemistry that Nash and Dirk have with their team, and then you conveniently disregard Chauncey Billups in the conversation.

Also, Dirk has been very, very impressive this season. But, while he is shooting better and scoring more, you do realize that he's had significant drop-offs in his rebounding, blocked shots, and steals, right? In fact pretty significant drop-offs in the steals and blocked shots categories. Generally, MVP candidates are putting up career highs or close to career highs in most statistical categories.


We all know you love Dirk. We all know you think he's the best thing in Dallas since Emmitt Smith. Just temper your biased love a little bit. Dirk is a top 5 MVP candidate. He has a chance to win it. But, I don't think he will or he should. I think there are more valuable players in the league than him.

[1Parker1]

Alright damn, I'm changing my vote yet again:

Now it's down to Dirk or Lebron. I'm thinking Dirk may get it.

[jochhejaam]

Here's a Dirkless list by Ric Bucher

Let's see your valuables, sir
By Ric Bucher
ESPN The Magazine

Anybody else sick of the MVP race already? I haven't even filled out my ballot and I don't want to read, hear or say another word on the subject. Of course, being the kind of guy who finds certain kinds of self-inflicted pain interesting, I volunteered to write a column on the subject.
This year, it seems, the MVP conversation began two weeks into the season and has never let up. Remember when Elton Brand was a frontrunner back in December? Didn't even Andrei Kirilenko get a mention after the Jazz bolted to that 4-2 start? Or was that his wife after ESPN The Magazine revealed her once-a-year-freebie for Andrei?

My point being: All the fuss about who is deserving and who isn't and what makes for an MVP and what doesn't is akin to debating what length of skirt turns a girl from sexy to a . No one's ever defined it and know one ever will. You eyeball the evidence and decide based on your personal tastes.

From all the conversations I've had on the MVP subject -- and, trust me, I've had five for every comment I've made on air or online -- MVP has a variety of meanings. For some, it's MEP, or the league's Most Excellent Player. For others, it's MVPOAWT, or Most Valuable Player on a Winning Team. Here's a popular one: MSIPOATTWBTE or Most Statistically Impressive Player on a Team That Was Better Than Expected. Generally, the easiest and safest pick is MVPOTBT: Most Valuable Player on the Best Team. This year has brought a new one to the mix: MDPDTSOATTFS, or Most Dominant Player Down the Stretch on a Team that Finished Strong. And, finally, there's MIP, or Most Indispensable Player, as in the guy whose team would absolutely fall apart without him.

If there's a reason to be particularly fed up with all the Let-me-tell-you-who-the-MVP chatter is this season, other than it's been going on all season and continues to mutate, that's precisely it. Without first defining MVP, and acknowledging that it's your definition and not necessarily anyone else's, it's like raging at your friends for not agreeing with your choice of Air Jordans.

So, for what it's worth, here are my choices for all above. And, yes, here's the disclaimer: these are my definitions. Acronymites, feel free to create your own, order your own hardware and have your own happy little award ceremony. The guy who eventually wins the real deal will not feel slighted, I promise you.

MEP --Kobe Bryant.

MVPOAWT -- Dwyane Wade.

MSIPOATTWBTE -- Elton Brand.

MVPOTBT -- Chauncey Billups.

MDPDTSOATTFS -- LeBron James.

MIP -- Steve Nash.

Of course, I may just ask my three-year-old daughter Chance to draw five stick figures -- she just learned how -- and make my selections based on which NBA players they most resemble. The problem with that is, having seen her work, I might have to explain to the league office how Stromile Swift and Francisco Elson made my ballot.

And when it comes to self-inflicted pain, you have to draw the line somewhere.

[2centsworth]

Lebron!!!!!!!!!!

[Darrin]

Lebron!!!!!!!!!!

That was a great game last night!

I'm sticking with Kobe.

[v2000]

Dirk with another game winner last night, despite a poor shooting night... and he still found other ways to contribute by getting to the line and rebounding the ball well... the sign of a true MVP.