What a bad thread.
1) Devean George for the min is an ok signing but he will only play if injuries happen. If he plays, he won't be a factor against Spurs : too slow to guard Manu, too small to guard Duncan.
2) The offseason isn't finished, a lot of things can still happen.
3) Mavs fans who thinks that they will easily beat Spurs next year are dillusional : First Mavs aren't way better than last year and second Spurs aren't a worse team than last year against Mavs (don't forget that we have only lost NVE, Rasho and Nazr and that they were useless against Mavs).
4) Spurs fans who still say 3-0 are just trolling. We won't play next year wiht 99 Spurs or 03 Spurs but with 07 Spurs. Fact : Mavs beat us last year, they were the better team last year. It's up to Spurs to improve next year and beat Dallas, plain and simple.
Mavs are well over the luxury tax threshhold again.
Dirk - 15.1
Stack - 9.2
Damp - 8.6
Terry ~ 7
Croshere - 7.3
Bradley - 4.8
Eschmeyer 3.7
Harris - 3.1
Buckner ~ 3
Johnson - 2.6
MBenga ~ 1.7
Diop - 2.0
Abdul-Wahad - 2.0
Howard - 1.6
Pavel - 1.2
Ager - 865K
George - 1.4
That's over 75M.
Plus they have to pay Finley his 15M or whatever. I know that doesn't count toward the luxury tax, but the Mavs aren't really being thrifty.
I think Esch and TAW's deal might not count against the cap anymore due to their injury retirements. I'm not sure Bradley's was an official injury retirement.
TAW count against the cap : it was a buyout not a medical retirement.
I read TAW counts. I don't know about Eschmeyer or Bradley.
Actually, SA is slightly over the lux tax. They owed less than a million when it was calculated, likely more now that they signed those 2 big men.
Dallas owed $17.3 million going into the summer.
The tax level, btw, is $61.7 million.
Yeah, I know that but it doesn't effect tax for Mavs.
It's still money they have to pay.
Insurance would cover medical retirements.
Ok, not really what I meant as the Mavs are still paying for players not helping them anymore. I was talking about going forward. My bad.
Yeah, you're right. I was just talking about the money they're paying for the players currently on their roster and helping them win games. Technically, they're over the cap.
I know SA is over for this past year -- we had a big thread about it, they owe 900K if IIRC. And I also know they are trying to be under in the upcoming season. For 06-07, it's supposed to be around $65.4 M.
Even if you don't include Bradley, Eschmeyer, Abdul-Wahad, and Finley, they are still over the salary cap.
Well I must have been
when I thought they were right at the cap # w/o those players not on the roster now. Thanks for setting me straight. Regardless, they're doing much better than in past years when Cuban was throwing money around left and right. Finley's contract is prime example. He was my favorite Mav player but he in no should have received a contract that large. Raef Lafrenz had a ridiculous contract as well.
Yeah they are definitely improving.Well I must have beenCuban is obviously trying to find the balance of spending enough to win but not spending himself into tax debt.
I take that back TheHobbs, apparently it was me showing my ignorance on this. I apologize.
I don't think he cares that much about the money...I read somewhere where he said he just finally realized that it was "bad business" and it made him look kinda foolish.Yeah they are definitely improving.
Now if he could only figure that out about some of the other "foolish" things he does
The more wings the Mavs sign that Duncan or another big can guard, the better, imo. It could help them in the regular season if they have some injuries, but against SA in the playoffs George won't really change anything (if he's even on the playoff roster).
Nah, he cares about money, otherwise he never would've cut Finley.I don't think he cares that much about the money...I read somewhere where he said he just finally realized that it was "bad business" and it made him look kinda foolish.
Now if he could only figure that out about some of the other "foolish" things he does
He is fine with breaking even for now. He doesn't want to lose money.
Kori, the 75M is not entirely accurate.
The Mavs were under the tax threshold according to David Lord at http://www.dallasbasketball.com/info_page.asp. This was before the George signing (but after the Johnson trade) that he wrote this particular article, here is just part of the article dealing w/ the payroll:
Here was what Fish had to say on the topic as of today w/ the updated number after the signing of George.GUESS WHO IS PAYING LUXURY TAX AFTER ALL?
There are other consequences to this trade, however. One is that in making this trade the Mavs have stepped past the tax threshold this year. In so doing, they have affirmed openly their continued willingness to pay luxury tax in exchange for extra talent that may give them that next added edge in the chase for a le. Prior to this swap, the team was positioned to land just below the tax threshold this season, and could have easily remained there. Now - in a move for a player that gives more flexibility but that should end up 3rd on the depth chart at point guard - the Mavs are assured of being taxpayers.
We don’t see any benefit in having a high payroll when the money is being wasted, but the Mavs have now brought their individual contracts down to typical NBA levels. Yet they are showing that as long as the contracts are reasonable, they are still willing to maintain the commitment to obtain the best 15-man roster possible. At a time when other owners are almost unanimously taking bold steps to avoid the tax, Mark Cuban's willingness to go that extra step sets him apart from the crowd. We think he needs to be commended for his commitment to bring a le to Dallas.
Here is the new scorecard on Mavs spending for this season.
TAXABLE PAYROLL 15,101,626 -- Nowitzki
9,296,874 -- Stackhouse
9,625,000 -- Dampier
7,300,000 -- Croshere
6,600,000 -- Terry - his deal was reported as 6 yrs 50M and max raises put that at 6.6M - contract is not signed yet
3,200,000 -- Buckner
3,153,120 -- Harris
1,998,000 -- Diop
1,577,353 -- Howard
1,500,000 -- Mbenga estimated - no numbers reported, this just seems the proper range - contract was signed recently
1,221,240 -- Podkolzin
906,480 -- Ager
2,640.000 -- Anthony Johnson
1,968,750 -- Abdul-Wahad, final year was reportedly 25% guaranteed when waived
66,088,443 TOTAL for 13 players
Tax threshold - 65,420,000
Tax - 668,443
Forfeiture of league revenue - 1,500,000 (estimated)
Based on the analysis above, the team is already contributing over $2.1M to the other owners for the extra talent. The other consequence to this trade is that the Mavs now have two roster spots open. The payroll total will go up even farther before all is said and done.
Once the dust had settled Monday night on the Pacers deal, the Mavs let it be known that they now have a commitment for that empty backup SF opening our David Lord discusses at length here.
Ex-Laker Devean George has agreed to a deal for the veteran minimum of about $1.0 million. (If the deal is for only one year, the league will subsidize the contract and the Mavs will only pay and be taxed in the amount of $744,551.)
This brings the Mavs roster total to 14, with a total payroll (assuming a subsidized deal) of $66,832,994 (which is $1,412,994 above the tax threshold). There is still one roster slot remaining, which we still think will go to a developmental type forward as noted above.
We breakdown the so-far 14-man roster now as follows:
C - Diop, Dampier, Mbenga, Podkolzin
PF - Nowitzki, Croshere
SF -- Howard, George
SG - Buckner, Stackhouse, Ager
PG - Terry, Harris, Johnson
Dallas has to pay Eschmeyer 3.7 mil and Bradely 4.8 mil, which are not included in the list and does count against the cap. The only salary that does not count against the cap is Finley's 17.2 mil.
Players on the active roster at this time.
Harris (3.1), Terry (7.0), Howard (1.5), Nowitzki (15.1), Dampier (8.6), Johnson (2.6), Buckner (3.0), Stackhouse (9.2), Croshere (7.3), Diop (2.0), Mbenga (1.7), Pavel (1.2), Ager (0.8), George (1.4)
Total 64.5M for the players on the floor.
The Spurs (not counting this off-seasons moves) are at 61M
For all the "free spending", the team on the floor for the Mavs only costs 3.5M more a year then the Spurs. Now when Howard gets his contract redone those number will go up, but for now ... the two teams players on the floor are making close to the same amount.
Horrible way to see the payroll situation.
Example :
Spurs had to give up first round pick to get ride of Rose's contract.
Mavs had gave up nothing to get ride of Finley's contract.
The fact that Cuban was able to remove bad contracts (by losing $51M in Finley case) without giving up assets is a huge plus for Mavs.
Horrible way to see the payroll situation.
But true.
Only in Finleys case is a player that we are paying still in the NBA, all the others have retired or gotten injured or whatever in TAW's case.
The Spurs could have dumped the contract or Barry if they wanted ... but they didn't ... Thats not the Mavs fault.
The only thing seperating the two teams in dollars spent on the floor is 3.5M ... The Mavs are not as "Free-spending as alot of Spurs fans would like to think, as a matter of fact, if the Mavs are "spending hand over fist" then so are the Spurs, if the Spurs are "penny pinching" then so are the Mavs .. there is only a 3.5M differeance, that is only slightly more then halh the MLE
I hope you're not a business man.
A dollar is a dollar. The fact that he is spend for a player who plays or not doesn't change the fact that he is spend. Plain and simple. Cuban spend more money than Holt, numbers don't lie.
But the team numbers on the floor do not lie either. Is it Cubans fault that Bradley and ech retired? Or that TAW is a complete ^SS?
The Finley signing to a overloaded contract did what it was supposed to do ... It showed that the Mavs were serious about paying for players and that they were equaly serious about building a contending team. The effect on other teams and players perception of the Mavs franchise is different now then what it was before.
Now as Finley aged ... and the Mavs had his replacement in waiting a way to get out of the contract appeared and was taken. Again it was a good decision.
If Barry retired tomorrow guess what? He will still count on the cap, whether he plays or not. You take your chances with aging players.
Cuban is spending more money, but the teams on the floor cost close to the same amount .. but by looking at the talent level from top to bottom even die-hard Spurs fans should wonder "where is our bench?" and "why can't we sign players closer to their prime instead of the likes or Horry, Barry and Williams"
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