Reply With Quote
I get what you are saying but honestly, if it means bringing Bin Laden and his cronies to justice....I really don't care about being better than them and would be willing to get dirty doing it. Probably a good thing I am not in charge.
I'm not gonna argue with that....I agree with you. But us using the same barbaric tactics that they use doesn't at all make us above them.
I get what you are saying but honestly, if it means bringing Bin Laden and his cronies to justice....I really don't care about being better than them and would be willing to get dirty doing it. Probably a good thing I am not in charge.
You know it's not always about where you end up, it's the path you take that's also important.I get what you are saying but honestly, if it means bringing Bin Laden and his cronies to justice....I really don't care about being better than them and would be willing to get dirty doing it. Probably a good thing I am not in charge.
Honestly, if catching Osama Bin Laden means we have to bomb 100 innocent civilians is it worth it? Not saying we do that but just a hypothetical question...where do you draw the line?
well let me cranck up Jimi Hendricks up and have at it.......
first thing i would do is seperate the the military, the administration, the ACLU and all the non-profit organiszations who throw their influence around...... 1) let the military fight the damn war ! from start to finish, keep the damn politicians out the damn way. if you want to complain then pick up a piece and stand a post otherwise STFU...... the enemy kills a troop of mine, then i kill the same number of theirs..... this reduces the number in the holding pens.....2) keep all the religiuos ers tending their own flocks. man has been killing man since the begining of time and example of this is all in the books of faith you may want to read. don't let some little short fat fool make you believe otherwise..... edify the people of your house........3) as for the adminstration, i just got two words for you........ TERM LIMITS !!!!!! this is how you eliminate the career politician who does nothing but collect a paycheck. but you would also help prevent them from gaining so much weight... look at Ted Kennedy..... if that er didn't spend all his life in office, maybe he wouldn't be the oversized fat er that he is.......of course all the above could happen, but as long as the lifer politician is around...... forget it.......
Here's a very interesting 4 Corners story on 9/11 - take 15 minutes out of your life and read the whole transcript, seriously. Jackson gets a little rabid at one point, but otherwise it's pretty balanced, and what Richard Clarke has to say is fascinating:
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/conte...6/s1738419.htm
I've also got a few suggestions of my own.
On one hand, stop waging war on countries like Iraq without justification (there were no WMDs, there was no link to 9/11), then on the other hand ignoring real humanitarian tragedies like Mugabe in Zimbabwe or the genocide in Sudan.
Stop sending people you SUSPECT of terrorist involvement (as yet unproven), like that poor Canadian professor, to "friendly" regimes for torture.
Stop pretending that things like "waterboarding" aren't torture.
Dismantle Guantanamo Bay and actually follow the precepts of your own legal system by trying the people you accuse of terroism.
Stop manipulating the World Bank to make even more money for you and your allies at the expense of the world's poor.
Stop tying your aid to the world to ideological furphies (like the sex education money that is only given to programs that promote abstinence, and where any mention of condoms is forbidden).
Stop using your massive market and political power to rape the third world, and start trading fairly.
In short, stop being massive freakin' hypocrites!!! Your government talks about the rule of law then ignores its own, talks about free trade then uses subsidies and other trade barriers to protect the US economy, talks about peace and democracy but kills more people than any other government on the planet.
Or you could roll out the neutron bombs and pave the Middle East. On second thoughts, that's far more likely...
(edited to add an "e" to hypocrite")
Last edited by RuffnReadyOzStyle; 09-11-2006 at 09:39 PM.
normally I would agree....to me though, 100 is less than 3000. again....just my personal feelings...not a suggested course of action.You know it's not always about where you end up, it's the path you take that's also important.
Honestly, if catching Osama Bin Laden means we have to bomb 100 innocent civilians is it worth it? Not saying we do that but just a hypothetical question...where do you draw the line?
I would agree with that....I would rather see our resources going to people like this. In actuality, I would rather see our resources go to fixing our own problems first.On one hand, stop waging war on countries like Iraq without justification (there were no WMDs, there was no link to 9/11), then on the other hand ignoring real humanitarian tragedies like Mugabe in Zimbabwe or the genocide in Sudan.
Absolutely.
How much has the US spent on this bullshiiit war? $600bil? More? Imagine what that could have done to your health and education systems, or to development of alternative fuels or renewable energy, or 100 other things...
Instead, it's gone into killing 150,000 people, producing a "new democratic state" so unstable that it is a breeding ground for the next wave of terrorists, and lining the pockets of the defence infrastructure companies. Well done indeed!
yep, that's the beauty of this country...... opinions are like assholes, everyone has one......we allow people to express their opinions without fear of reprisial. we allow people to persue whatever dream they may have with support from the goverment, you can pretty much do what you damn well please without much hassel. in this "COUNTRY".... now you talk of being the world police... sure why not. we'll be the big boy on the block.. but that carries it's rewards as well as it's consiquences... are you prepared to do it ? how bout the Africans, or the South Americans, better yet why not the Australians........
"WMD" why do people always bring this up...... i start shooting your ass with a BB gun and you send your big brother after me, you think i will still have my BB gun here when your big brother gets here? what a dumbass you must be......talk all the recteric you want post all the articles you wish, unless you have had to defend your country or take that stand knowing you may have to give your life.... then stand tall and believe you can change the world or support your country's beliefs.......
SEMPER FI, SEMPER FI, SEMPER FI.........
Well, I am Australian, not American, and we are involved in your sham wars, buddy boy. I am appalled that our PM has his tongue so far up GW's arse that we've wasted $8bil on your most recent military adventures, and then given you an extremely loaded free-trade agreement to boot. , we aren't even cleaning up on the oil or the rebuilding contracts, so why exactly are we involved again? Why do we continue to bend over for America when even your neighbours, the Canadians, won't? I have no idea.
BTW, who are these "Africans" and "South Americans" you speak of? Oh, you mean the hundreds of diverse cultural, social and political systems that inhabit those continents! Nah, let's just pretend they are all the same
As for the rest of your post, what jingoistic claptrap. You fail to address even one of the points I make. And then you fall back on your military's slogan "semper fi". My, what an intellect you have!
Why do people mention WMDs? Because they were trotted out time and again by your govt., and the Brits, and my own govt., as the main reason for invading Iraq, and guess what, IT WAS ALL A LIE. There were no WMDs, and Iraq did not pose an "imminent threat" to the US or anyone else, another LIE from the vaunted "leader of the free world."
Okay, I'll just pick two points, maybe you can set me straight...
Please explain to me why you aren't trying the terrorists as is required by your hallowed legal system?
Please explain to me why your govt subsidises your farmers more than any other organisation on the planet ($24bil last year) while spewing free-trade rhetoric and punishing anyone else in the world who does what you do?
Two points that should be very easy to clear up if I am incorrect... but you see, I'm not. The world sees America as a massive hypocrite, and until you start doing what you say, rather than saying one thing and doing the complete opposite, that view won't change.
Oh, and I should point out that I am actually a FRIEND of America. A lot of wonderful people there, and what your nation has achieved in terms of progress is quite remarkable. Just realise that when your friends are pointing these things out, there can be little surprise at why the hatred of your enemies continues to build...
We must stay the course until the job is done and we must, at all costs, keep the White House, the Senate and the House in Republican hands!!!
ah, a "FRIEND" from the land down under......had to cut it off early last nite so here we go. i take it when you refer to "WE" you must be talking bout y'all down there and not include us up here.... i can not answer your questions as to why you folks do the things you do, nor will i pretend to want to try. you see when i vote for my leaders in this country i do it with a conviction that they are the people i want running my country's business. be it right in other people's eyes or not.... we as a country do not have to meet your expectations, better yey we meet our own..... you so willingly give all this feedback about how screwed up we are and how we don't do this and don't do that but fail to accept any responsibility for the action of the world and how they( other goverments) respond to actions that counter one's own belief.... how quick you point the finger..... what a shame, what a shame.....
but since you are the world's spoke person, how would you suggest we venture off into the wild blue yonder? perhaps just say the with everyone else and just conquer their ass and make it a state...... hey, now there's a thought, ever play the game RISK?
hey if you want to solve the world's problems and assign blame be my guess.... join the politicians of the world where all is wrong and everyone is to blame and no one has the answers... why is that?????
we don't claim to be perfect nor are our laws, but they must be better than yours.... we live in a time where one does not know who the enemy is, it could be you it could be the preacher man down the street, who do you trust...... our laws are meant to be argued, thus we have courts, and so on and so on........Terrorist, now that's a new one on us... we're working on that one and you should hear the commontion....
WMDs, now this will be the last time i comment on this issue... does the word"KURDS" mean anything to you??????
look "BUDDY BOY", you don't like how my country is behaving, that's cool, i'm not going to lose any sleep over it, better yet just stay away.....the leader of my country is a person i helped put in office and i support his actions !!!!! sadly we do have idiots in office as well, i'm working on getting them the out....
so you see, i trust all is well in your house and thus the reason you attack mine.... oh please, please show me the way......
Your incredibly defensive and nonsensical posts once again fail to address anything I've said.
Here is the OP for this thread, that is, what my first post was responding to:
"Alright, I've been reading this political part of the website for a while now, thrown in my two cents, made fun of people, been made fun of but now I want to know, what should America's foreign policy consist of from here on out? Not what should we have done, but rather what should we do from here? How do we stop terrorism? How do we win the hearts and minds of the world? How do we become the good guys again?How do we fix our economy etc? What's done is done, now what?
I would also like to ask that no articles be copied and pasted into this thread, I want opinions of your own, not someone elses. I would also like to ask RG to wait for a few opinions before posting his own, I ask this because people like Boutons will just use someone smarter then himself and their opinions to form his own "opinion" and that is usually whatever Randomguy says (I mean this as a compliment to RG by the way).
So let's hear it. Everyone that is always so open to publicly criticize, I want to know the solution."
So, my solution - start behving the way your government claims it behaves rather than bullying and manipulating the world to America's advantage while claimimg to be the good guy. Stop being hypocrites. Or, stop pretending you are the good guys and just be the acknowledged bad guys - at least then your govt wouldn't be hypocritical.
This is not a blame game, this is a legitimate response to the question "what can America do to win the hearts and minds of the world?" Leadership means doing what you say, and over the last 6 years America has been particularly poor at that - no trial for the terrorists, no free trade for the world, no WMDs in Iraq, no response to the world's other tyrannical regimes...
You still haven't bothered to address even one of my points, or if you did, I couldn't understand your logic through the babble. Anyone else have a go?
Short answer. You dont. Its impossible. War on Drugs = War on Terrorism. Hows the former working out in comparison to the latter?
Its all relative, really. We can pursue this course of action or another...it doesnt change the fact that this world is full of evil people who are set in their minds that Western culture must be destoyed (ie America).
With that in mind, knowing there is no quarter, no solution, no alternative, you go down the path MOST traveled....war. Do I agree? Eh, I say, does my opinion matter? It obviously doesnt.
There is no light at the end of the tunnel. There is no end to the War on Terror. It will never end. Youre fighting an idea, not a country or outfit. Everyone makes such a big deal about Al Qaeda, maybe rightfully so. But then those same people are going to be in celebration when that bas Bin Laden is captured/killed full well knowing that there is a mul ude of people to take his place.
Lets go out on a extreme limb here and say one day all of Al Qaeda will neutralized. Welcome to the forefront different-name-terrorist-organization. It never ends. Those people hate us with the true meaning of the word.
There isnt a solution. There never will be. Unless of course you think turning the Middle East into glass is a solution. Even then there will be another corner of the world that despises us and wants what we have or wants to detroy what we stand for.
All in all, my point is, we are in this for the long haul. More exactly, forever. Your country(s) either will or will not help. Me personally, I say if you dont help, then when you are inevitably attacked, dont expect any help from us. America has the luxury of being able to wage an endless war (not by current standards of course), most do not.
Notice I never mentioned Iraq. Iraq is a ing mistake. Such a big mistake that we no longer can do anything about it. We have to stay, probably for years to come and beyond. Not to save face or "win hearts and minds" (what complete bull , btw), but to save the civilians who never asked us to come in the first place. If we pull out now, better get used to seeing genocide on a Darfur scale everyday on CNN/Fox. Iran will control western Iraq which means they will hold sway on world oil. The ramifications for leaving would be FAR worse than staying. So, we stay.
I dont hope or pray for anything. The machinations of a power hungry politician no longer scare me or surprise. After the past 6 years, Im not inclined to believe anyone or anything. Its all agenda and favors. If you arent in the loop, then youre just a drone, spouting whatever party-line youre beholden to. Ive always thought myself a true independant thinker. Posting here and listening to the ravings of both sides, combined with the state of the globe and the people within, I personally see no hope at all. Maybe thats just a biased, Big Dumb American opinion, but it is what it is. I dont think the USA will lose, I think the whole world will. What that means, I am not sure. But a world without America is worse than one with, that is a fact no one with half-a- ing brain can deny.
Arrrgh. I wish I had the time to address this one. I share DarkReign's sense of frustration, if not his pessimism.
This is a very worthwhile question to ask tho'.
Well said.
Is the US soley responsible for dealing with these other regimes? You're ing about the handling of Iraq but you then state we are not doing anything about Iran/NK. Why should the US do anything else? So you can have more to complain about?
There is a price for being the sole superpower.Is the US soley responsible for dealing with these other regimes?That is perhaps an issue of priorities. Saddam turned out to be much less of a threat than he was thought/made out to be, and everything reason given for intervening in Iraq seems to be alot more pressing in other areas. Our ability to act/react in those areas is now severely limited by the situation in Iraq.You're ing about the handling of Iraq but you then state we are not doing anything about Iran/NK. Why should the US do anything else?
I see your point but its so annoying to hear people from other countries constantly badmouth the US (not just on Iraq) about EVERYTHING we do in the world then turn around and want to us get involved in every problem that comes up.
and here i thought the folks from Detroit were all lame.... amillion apologies... i am impressed at your stated opinion mr. DarkReign, very impressed. i did some time in the motor city back in the 60's but that's another story......
onward to the "FRIEND's" comment.....perhaps no obviously i have not made myself clear so i'll just take one point and hope you can understand what i am saying...and if that does not work maybe i can paint you a picture..
so your solution is for my goverment to stop behaving the way it does.... hmmmmmm i thought perhaps you had something more you could own as your own thought. something that would be workable instead of placing blame, but that is okay i will relay that to my elected officials... i was thinking more in line of combining the world's resourses in an effort to "EDUCATE" on means of how to co-exsist with one another. now that would mean every country would own their part with the help of others. those that chose not to be a part of the common effort would eventually suffer the ignorance and embarassement of being left behind... i believe if we as a society can get on the same page, this would be a better place to live..... the sad thing is that we live in a country that has the responsibility to protect it's people, cover our borders and then listen to all the bs of those who question how we do what we do... you ask the impossible questions, those that had been asked the days of Cain and Able...i don't have your answers, all i can hope for is that the elected officials do what is right for this country......
one last thing there Mr. Ruff...... if you do not understand what my "MILITARY SLOGAN" signifies, then i suggest you learn before you belittle that way of life again...
Agreed
Not really key for the US to be loved around the world.
The US should be able to get rough when interrogating suspects.
Tough point when you prisoners are terrorists.
This I don't understand. Please expand.
Is this really the case?
Here we totally agree. It's so hypocritical when the US pushes the "free trade" agenda elsewhere in the world while they subsidize their inneficient farmers, steele producers and other industries which cannot compete with other countries, or they build trade barriers which are ridiculous.
There is a key in your keyboard called enter.
Use it!
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
