The Counter Adjustment

[mullet]

It's not that simple with Nash. Sometimes Timmy gets stuck with Nash when Steve dribbles and weaves through the defense, baseline included and then comes back out the other side - Timmy being the closest defender. It's not a simple matter of going over or under a screen. It's sometimes a matter of Nash's primary defender getting hung up in all the trees.

That's why Timmy has to defend out on the floor sometimes and trust his help...that's the Spurs' system. 5 men, team D.

Otherwise, the Spurs would have to run something like a matchup zone that they have employed a few times.

yeah, you're right. its not that simple. nash likes to run along the baseline and draw a big man with him and then use him like a beat up old hag

tim just needs to stay out of foul trouble. id rather have him give up an open lay up to nash than to defend him hard, draw a foul, and then give up 10 power dunks to stoudemire because he has to play timid

[DarrinS]

I like the idea of making Amare and Nash play defense. I'm sick of seeing "superstars" get a free pass on the defensive end.

[DarrinS]

The Spurs have to share the basketball. The Suns defense can be very good if you give them stationary targets to defend and don't challenge their lack of a team defensive mindset; penetration, even if it doesn't lead to layups, should create ball movement opportunities that will force the Suns to do something more than just man-up. They'll have to switch and rotate, and I'm not sure it's in their team DNA at this point to do those things particularly well over 48 playoff minutes. If the Spurs attack the rim and move the ball, they should be able to create opportunities to find easy baskets, whether those be at the rim or beyond the arc.

[LEONARD]

Barry?? I thought the Amber Alert I heard a couple hrs ago was for him??

[Solid D]

Barry just needs some home cookin'....

and double-team help when posted up.

[spurster]

I don't think small ball is the answers except in short bursts.

What I would like to see:

On defense, we need to slow down Nash.

We have been showing the same look on Nash for 2 games. The bigs need to show on the pick and roll more often.

Bowen needs to give Nash different looks, too. Mostly, he backs off a bit, and Nash drives too easily around him because Nash knows what to expect. Bowen needs to get in his face more often and make Nash guess what he is going to do.

I think Manu on Nash might be something to try. I'd like to see if Manu can deflect or steal some passes.

Also, the Spurs need to try a zone more often. Ideally, I'd like to see a box-and-one a few times, but I don't recall the Spurs ever doing that.

On offense:

I'd like to see TD get the ball a little farther out so he can face up on Thomas and then shoot a bank shot or drive to the basket. It's clear from Game 2 that backing Thomas down is not so easy and the refs are calling few fouls in that situation.

I'd like to see Bowen post up on Nash.

I'd like to see Manu and Finley post up on Bell.

[Solid D]

Yeah, a Box-and-1 against the best 3-pt shooting team in the NBA would last about 1 trip.

[coachmac87]

why not try the small line up so we can just get thomas out of the game.....dantoni will get caught up in just goin small and then he never really puts thomas back in...spurs go back to old style of play and while phx just plays fast...before u kno it they cant put thomas in the game cause they need points to catch up with our game 3 halftime lead

[MavericksDynasty]

It's too bad you don't have a guy like Brad "White Lightning" Davis to tear up out there. He could help you against Phoenix:



Davis melted the Ice Man in his day.

Davis > Gervin

[rayray2k8]

Riiiiight.

[leemajors]

Here's why Gregg Popovich is the best coach in the league: Phoenix makes their big adjustment in Game 2 (playing Kurt Thomas so they can cover Duncan one-on-one), and it's clear from the beginning that it's just not San Antonio's night -- they're not getting any calls, they're missing free throws and threes, it's just not happening. So he lets the game unfold without a big counter move and Phoenix pulls away in the fourth quarter, which probably would have happened regardless of whatever Pop did. Now we're headed to Game 3 and Phoenix still has no idea how Pop will counter than Duncan/Thomas thing. Watch what happens in Game 3: The Spurs will counter (my prediction, they go small with Duncan and four perimeter guys, force Amare to guard Finley, Ginobili or Barry 20 feet from the basket, then pound the ball inside to Duncan) and Phoenix will take an entire game to adjust. If they had done this in Game 2, it wouldn't have mattered because Phoenix was winning the game, anyway. I swear, this will all make sense when you're watching Game 3.

Sports Guy's take. we'll see if it holds water. maybe he reads timvp's posts?

[timvp]

Sports Guy's take. we'll see if it holds water. maybe he reads timvp's posts?

WTF?

[FromWayDowntown]

timvp = The Sports Guy??

I'm not sure I've ever seen the two of them in the same room at the same time. (though I'm not sure that I've ever been in a room with either of them).

Maybe The Sports Guy is really ponky or something like that.

[Warlord23]

Several excellent points in this thread. My 2 cents ...

1. Don't go small, at least not all the time. The problem was that with Kurt Thomas in the line-up, the Suns were at one point in the game outrebounding us (although we evened it at the end). If the Suns outrebound us, it's over. Playing 4-down, Tim going 1-on-1 vs Thomas, taking difficult bank shots from 12 feet, everybody else standing still = us getting hurt in rebounding. We need more screen and roll, more dribble penetration from Manu and Tony. Tim can be freed up to attack the boards.

2. Start Manu over Finley. If we want less 4-down and more guard penetration, Manu needs to be on early.

3. Defensively, don't put Bowen on Nash. Put Bowen on Marion and neutralize him. Give Tony a shot vs Nash. I'm willing to bet that the increase in Nash's effectiveness will be less than the decrease in Marion's effectiveness.

4. Despite all that, if Tony can't get his jumper going, and Manu can't start making some shots, it's going to end in a Spurs loss. We need to get more from our starting guards, and that will force them to leave our role-players open.

[leemajors]

timvp = The Sports Guy's "Ghost Writer"??

[td4mvp3]

Several excellent points in this thread. My 2 cents ...

1. Don't go small, at least not all the time. The problem was that with Kurt Thomas in the line-up, the Suns were at one point in the game outrebounding us (although we evened it at the end). If the Suns outrebound us, it's over. Playing 4-down, Tim going 1-on-1 vs Thomas, taking difficult bank shots from 12 feet, everybody else standing still = us getting hurt in rebounding. We need more screen and roll, more dribble penetration from Manu and Tony. Tim can be freed up to attack the boards.

2. Start Manu over Finley. If we want less 4-down and more guard penetration, Manu needs to be on early.

3. Defensively, don't put Bowen on Nash. Put Bowen on Marion and neutralize him. Give Tony a shot vs Nash. I'm willing to bet that the increase in Nash's effectiveness will be less than the decrease in Marion's effectiveness.

4. Despite all that, if Tony can't get his jumper going, and Manu can't start making some shots, it's going to end in a Spurs loss. We need to get more from our starting guards, and that will force them to leave our role-players open.

from what i can tell, marion was neutralized. he only scored 5 points.

[Que Gee]

Barry?? I thought the Amber Alert I heard a couple hrs ago was for him??

Exactly...what makes anyone think Pop is going to let Barry play? Pop has been waiting for an excuse all year to bench him in favor of Finley...and he finally got that chance when Barry went out for a few games with "tightness" in his back. He's been banned from playing ever since.

Kudos to Fin for stepping up his play....but its a fact.

[Solid D]

Exactly...what makes anyone think Pop is going to let Barry play? Pop has been waiting for an excuse all year to bench him in favor of Finley...and he finally got that chance when Barry went out for a few games with "tightness" in his back. He's been banned from playing ever since.

Barry played at the beginning of the 2nd and 4th quarters in Game 2 (15 minutes).


.



.

[J.T.]

Bill Simmons, if you are reading this thread, can I get you to autograph my Peyton Manning jersey? Thanks.

[PhxDog]

my prediction, they go small with Duncan and four perimeter guys, force Amare to guard Finley, Ginobili or Barry 20 feet from the basket, then pound the ball inside to Duncan

Suns are waiting for that. Pick Duncan off Amare, post Amare on a small with Duncan caught 25 feet from the basket; if that doesn't work, Boris Diaw comes off the bench, does the same thing.


I still think the Spurs will try to use deep double screens to shake Marion off of TP. The key to beating Kurt Thomas (aside from the usual crying for fouls) is forcing him to switch onto a guard.

[J.T.]

Maybe The Sports Guy is really ponky or something like that.

You have a point there. ponky claims to be a woman but we have yet to see her playboy spread, let alone a bravatar or myspace link. I mean, if I wanted to infiltrate SpursTalk to gain access to timvp`s hoops know how, I would pretend to be a chick too.

[T Park]

Exactly...what makes anyone think Pop is going to let Barry play? Pop has been waiting for an excuse all year to bench him in favor of Finley...and he finally got that chance when Barry went out for a few games with "tightness" in his back. He's been banned from playing ever since.

Kudos to Fin for stepping up his play....but its a fact.

Oh for christ sake.

Now Barry's injury was fake?

Banned from playing?

[LavaLamp]

So what would you say are the chances that Pop would make any adjustment in the starting line-up at all? 100%, 75%, 0%?

[FromWayDowntown]

So what would you say are the chances that Pop would make any adjustment in the starting line-up at all? 100%, 75%, 0%?

At this point, I'd say it's only a small chance. Elson has played poorly enough to deserve demotion, but I'm not sure that there was anything in Game 2 that would have provoked that move as an adjustment to the Suns.

[ploto]

And here I thought Elson was the solution to never having to go small against a team like Phoenix.