Well, it didn't take the two...

[ElNono]

Hamas is not THAT group. THAT group (the group?) I was referring to was, simply, Muslims.

I called a spade a spade originally when a poster claimed that Muslims, because of "blowing each other up weekly", or some such thing, could NEVER enjoy freedom and democracy. I disagree. The poster was a bigot (by definition, frankly).

You missed to quote where I referred to Muslims. Oh, wait. I never did.
There's plenty of muslims all over the world, and they don't go all blowing themselves up. I singled out a bunch of countries that have absolutely no interest in detaching themselves from religion and/or intolerance.

I'm actually going to quote you, since you seem short in memory and back then you never talked about the fruits of freedom or democracy:

OR; if it turns out, eventually, that because of the invasion and overthrow, a reasonably stable, non-religious, relatively tolerant, democratic government is established in the ME - does that not help our cause?

The only country that I can think of in that area that fits what you describe there is Israel, and that's by a big stretch in the 'non-religious' portion. Feel free to name me any other that fit that criteria and I might be missing.

The Hamas case is interesting because the political party they backed actually won the elections, which confirms that the vast majority of Palestinians (they wouldn't have won the elections otherwise) support their cause. This is a fact. Wether this is in your or the US best interests is irrelevant.

History shows that what you're looking for is utopian. And that was my point.

But hey, don't let reality get in the way of your argument...

[Wild Cobra]

look skippy the entire board knows that yoni , in the past, has given the impression that he passed other's writings as his own.. when you get up to speed let me know..

I have never noticed that. You know, sometimes in a rush, comments are not completed. Could it have been that he simply forgot to source material?

Still, I am one that chooses to strive for accuracy. I don't take people seriously who speak with a 3rd grade understanding of words. If you wish people to actually consider your words, you should choose them more correct.

I understand, you use the word play as a personal attack. I attack people sometimes too, but not just to attack. That too ruins a persons credibility to attack with little or no basis. How do you wish to be seen by people?

[George Gervin's Afro]

I have never noticed that. You know, sometimes in a rush, comments are not completed. Could it have been that he simply forgot to source material?

Still, I am one that chooses to strive for accuracy. I don't take people seriously who speak with a 3rd grade understanding of words. If you wish people to actually consider your words, you should choose them more correct.

I understand, you use the word play as a personal attack. I attack people sometimes too, but not just to attack. That too ruins a persons credibility to attack with little or no basis. How do you wish to be seen by people?

I don't like hypocrites. I want people to be consistent with their criticisms. For whatever reason I am interested in argument structure more than the argument itself. For example, if yoni doesn't like dems doing something and he critcizes them I am ok with that. However if the republicans/ bush did the exact same thing previously and he was silent on it to me that is a hypocrite. I don't ever criticize the republicans or posters here for doing something to then turn around and do it myslef. you may not like me but i am consistent and I am never a hypocrite..


For the record yoni seems like a decent fellow and i just used him as an example..

[clambake]

well, 9 US soldiers killed (not likely from karma) and 1 al Qaeda killed and 18 captured.

that means there is only 181 left.

[Yonivore]

For the record yoni seems like a decent fellow...

OMFG!