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  1. #76
    Casper Ghost Writer's Avatar
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    The thing about Bowen's defense of Kobe that is most significant has little to do with points and everything to do with shots. If Kobe gets 35 on 16 shots, he hasn't been defended well; if Kobe gets 35 on 32 shots, he's been defended extremely well. The closer Bowen gets to keeping Kobe's points per shot to somewhere between 1.0 and 1.3, the more valuable his defensive effort is.

    In the last 6 matchups between the Spurs and Lakers, Bowen has accomplished that on 3 occasions, all Spurs wins -- the 3 times he hasn't done it, the Lakers have won:

    12/10/06 -- 34 points, 25 shots; 1.36 pps (Lakers win)
    1/17/07 -- 34 points, 19 shots; 1.79 pps (Lakers win)
    1/28/07 -- 31 points, 25 shots; 1.24 pps (Spurs win)
    11/13/07 -- 18 points, 19 shots; .95 pps (Spurs win)
    12/13/07 -- 30 points, 24 shots; 1.25 pps (Lakers win)
    1/23/08 -- 29 points, 27 shots; 1.07 pps (Spurs win)

    If you take it out over a longer period of time, the trend continues. Bowen's focus is on forcing Kobe to be a volume shooter to get his points. And Bowen has been fairly effective at accomplishing that goal over time.

    Obviously, there are other things that determine games, but defending Kobe is the primary focus for the Spurs in a matchup with LA and Bowen's ability to make Kobe work (not to keep Kobe from scoring) is a huge difference.
    Hogwash.

    All I see is Kobe averaging nearly 30 PPG game on Bowen and not having to guard Bowen on defense.

    Now add Bynum and Gasol to the mix.

    Kobe won't have to shoot as much.

  2. #77
    Purrrrrrrrrrrr Holt's Cat's Avatar
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    Hogwash.

    All I see is Kobe averaging nearly 30 PPG game on Bowen and not having to guard Bowen on defense.

    Now add Bynum and Gasol to the mix.

    Kobe won't have to shoot as much.

    So the Spurs take the ball out of the hands of their most capable offensive player. This is bad because...?

  3. #78
    Purrrrrrrrrrrr Holt's Cat's Avatar
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    Grant Hill guarding Manu =
    Exactly. Yet somehow Casper thinks it's 1997.

  4. #79
    Casper Ghost Writer's Avatar
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    ... they have 3-4 other options now.

  5. #80
    Veteran DazedAndConfused's Avatar
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    The less Kobe is shooting the better for the team overall. I think we are almost undefeated this season when Kobe scores under 20.

  6. #81
    Purrrrrrrrrrrr Holt's Cat's Avatar
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    ... they have 3-4 other options now.
    They added that many options with the Gasol trade?

  7. #82
    Purrrrrrrrrrrr Holt's Cat's Avatar
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    Bowen was the key to the Spurs' dropping the Lakers in '03 because then the Spurs could defend Bryant with one player and then save their double teams for Shaq. Now they defend the Lakers straight up because of that. Oh noes.

  8. #83
    My Cousin Kobe Medvedenko's Avatar
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    Bowen was the key to the Spurs' dropping the Lakers in '03 because then the Spurs could defend Bryant with one player and then save their double teams for Shaq. Now they defend the Lakers straight up because of that. Oh noes.

    Yeah, Bowen is better than he was in 03 and Kobe's worst.

  9. #84
    Damn You Commies T Park's Avatar
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    Bowen's offense is better no question.

  10. #85
    Purrrrrrrrrrrr Holt's Cat's Avatar
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    Yeah, Bowen is better than he was in 03 and Kobe's worst.

    Worst? New to the language?

    Kobe also has no teammate today comparable to Shaq in '03.

  11. #86
    Veteran DazedAndConfused's Avatar
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    Bowen's offense??? Please he has ZERO game outside of the corner 3.

  12. #87
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    Bowen's offense??? Please he has ZERO game outside of the corner 3.
    Hey, he's looked pretty decent with that drive and finger-rollish thing this year. Not that I really want him trying it....

  13. #88
    Get Refuel! FromWayDowntown's Avatar
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    I don't think the point is to compare Bowen and Kobe directly, except to say that Bowen's ability to make Kobe work for his points is a key to the Spurs' chances against LA (as it has been for years now). You can think that points per shot is insignificant if you want, but I'd venture a guess that Pop and the Gang look at that number moreso than Kobe's points to assess whether Bowen has done a good job or not. The point about Kobe shooting less is relevant to that analysis only inasmuch as if Bowen is able to make Kobe an inefficient scorer, a reduction in Kobe's shots will knock down Kobe's points. Like I said earlier, if Kobe gets 30 on 15 shots, the Lakers are going to win. If Kobe needs 30 shots to get 30, the Spurs' chances go up dramatically. If Kobe needs 15 shots to 15 points, the same holds. The more shots Kobe takes, the less his teammates are involved - and if Bowen can make Kobe throw up a lot of shots to get his points, the Spurs team defense will be relieved of the burdens imposed by the rest of the Lakers' scorers.

    If Bowen can score without taking a lot of shots to get his points, all the better -- of all opponents, he does that most against LA for some reason.

  14. #89
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    Well I agree...but the key to the series won't be the big 3 on each team, but the role players. I can see Odom being the tipping point.

  15. #90
    Veteran DazedAndConfused's Avatar
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    I don't think the Spur's role players this year are as good as they were last year. Horry is useless, Bonner/Elson get almost no playing time, and Barry is constantly injured. If the Spurs were 100% healthy I would be very afraid of them, but injuries and age have finally caught up with them this season.

  16. #91
    It is what it is. Mark in Austin's Avatar
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    Udoka seems to be able to handle taller players trying to post him up better than Bowen, so I could see Udoka spending time on Odom. Horry too. Even Finley from time to time. Manu will see some time on him. Bowen will be on Kobe as long as he's in the game.

    I think you'll see different looks all night in the front court. I can see Oberto, Horry, and Duncan all checking Gasol at different times. Same goes for Bynum, except I don't see Horry on him that often.

  17. #92
    Get Refuel! FromWayDowntown's Avatar
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    Well I agree...but the key to the series won't be the big 3 on each team, but the role players. I can see Odom being the tipping point.
    I actually think that in the Spurs case, their best (only?) chance to beat any team comes down to getting strong performances on both ends from their big three, but that's not usually a problem over the length of a 7 gamer.

    And, frankly, in my estimation, if a team is going to knock out the Spurs, it's going to do it on the boards.

  18. #93
    Stomping on Laker haters Purple & Gold's Avatar
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    Lakers will win Team of the Decade

  19. #94
    Basketball Expertise spurster's Avatar
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    It typically takes more than a season for star players to play well as a team. I would be worried more about next season rather than this season.
    I would worry more about the Spurs defense rather than any particular team. So far it has been well below the standard of previous years.
    Not true. The Lakers are already looking better with Gasol and they have enough time to get Bynum back.
    That's fool's gold. Championships require championship-level defense, and it would be amazing to obtain that in half a season.

  20. #95
    D.I.R.T.Y. till we die manufor3's Avatar
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    Not true. The Lakers are already looking better with Gasol and they have enough time to get Bynum back.
    whos side are you on?

  21. #96
    Casper Ghost Writer's Avatar
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    You homers are living in the past.

    If you are not the least bit intimidated by the new-look Lakers and Suns, coupled with the Spurs general atrophe this season, then you're fools.

  22. #97
    Get Refuel! FromWayDowntown's Avatar
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    You homers are living in the past.

    If you are not the least bit intimidated by the new-look Lakers and Suns, coupled with the Spurs general atrophe this season, then you're fools.
    So what should I do? Should I force the Spurs to make a trade? Should I give up on the Spurs if they don't make a trade? Should I just give up on the Spurs anyway? Should I just stop watching basketball altogether?

  23. #98
    Casper Ghost Writer's Avatar
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    No.

    But you should not demonstrate the false bravado, biased opinion and shortsighted assessments like Holt's Cat.

    Clearly, the Spurs have their work cut out for them, because the Suns and the Lakers have more options and more interior defense.

    Meanwhile, the Spurs are older and injured.

    To think we can just show up every year in playoffs and hope for the best is silly.

    I wish the front office knew what they have in Duncan, Manu and Parker.

  24. #99
    Get Refuel! FromWayDowntown's Avatar
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    No.

    But you should not demonstrate the false bravado, biased opinion and shortsighted assessments like Holt's Cat.

    Clearly, the Spurs have their work cut out for them, because the Suns and the Lakers have more options and more interior defense.

    Meanwhile, the Spurs are older and injured.

    To think we can just show up every year in playoffs and hope for the best is silly.

    I wish the front office knew what they have in Duncan, Manu and Parker.
    But what if I still believe that the Spurs can win the le? I realize that may be seen as a biased view because the Spurs refuse to make the sorts of splashy trades that real contenders make, but if I genuinely feel that way -- for whatever reasons -- am I somehow not en led to that viewpoint? I don't think I've ever disputed the idea that the Spurs path to a le will be difficult; but it was never going to be an easy path this year and I think it would have been foolish for anyone to think that it would be. At that, the fact that the path will be difficult doesn't make the task impossible.

    If your point is that Spurs fans should believe that there's no chance for a championship without major changes, I think you're wrong. If your point is that Spurs fans should temper their optimism because there are some formidable teams in the West, I would agree with you.

  25. #100
    Believe.
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    Bowen's offense??? Please he has ZERO game outside of the corner 3.
    He lights up KOBE and the Fakers son!

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