Kobe pulls a Shaq. Speaks on Kwame and Smush!

[DazedAndConfused]

THe Lakers have flat out UNDERACHIEVED that past three seasons. And how does Kobe, the leader, handle the situation? He asks to be traded!!

This debate is over. You have clearly exposed yourself as a complete fraud and tool with that statement.

[Gino]

This debate is over. You have clearly exposed yourself as a complete fraud and tool with that statement.

Thats all you got?

So you believe the Lakers shouldn't have made the playoffs in 05, shouldn't have defeated Phoenix in 06 after having a 3-1 series lead, and shouldn't have done any better than a seven seed last year?

Because if thats true, I got to tell you that Pau Gasol and Derek Fisher aren't miracle workers.

[DazedAndConfused]

Yes that's all I have. Nothing more needs to be said, you've done the damage all by yourself.

[O-Factor]

Kobe said nothing of the caliber of what Shaq has said about former teammates and coaches. ing Shaq.

[balli]

The fact is that in 2005, the Lakers had Odom, Butler, Mihm, Kobe, Deven George and Walton and couldn't even make the playoffs (and the west wasn't
nearly as good as it is now). They dramatically underachieved down the stretch where they lost something like 19 of their last 21.

Listen to what you're saying? Mihm? George? A rookie Walton? You didn't even mention Tierre Brown, Kareem Rush and Jumaine Jones. Yeah, how could a team like that miss the playoffs? Jesus ing christ. That 04-05 Lakers squad was one of the tiest supporting casts in recent NBA history and you throw Kobe under the bus for it. I could care less if Odom and Butler were there. That's a team built to go nowhere. Time to get real man.

[kingmalaki]

Listen to what you're saying? Mihm? George? A rookie Walton? You didn't even mention Tierre Brown, Kareem Rush and Jumaine Jones. Yeah, how could a team like that miss the playoffs? Jesus ing christ. That 04-05 Lakers squad was one of the tiest supporting casts in recent NBA history and you throw Kobe under the bus for it. I could care less if Odom and Butler were there. That's a team built to go nowhere. Time to get real man.

The Memphis Grizz made the playoffs that season, with Gasol missing 26 games. Their overall team wasn't much better, especially considering Kobe is a superstar and none of the players on that team were considered to be one.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MEM/2005.html

Butler and Odom is enough quality help. I can think of dozens of other greats that have carried worse teams to the postseason.

[Findog]

What Nash did that season Amare was out was amazing, but the cupboard wasn't as bare as JMark is making it out to be. That team still had some really good players. Diaw was awesome that year, whereas he hasn't been the same since because he couldn't find a role or a groove with Amare back and then with the addition of Hill. Barbosa really came into his own as that season went along, and gave them another weapon in the open court with his speed. Thomas was the perfect fit for that offense, he helped stretched opposing defenses with his 3-point shooting ability. Avery had to bench Dampier in the conference Finals and negate some of our rebounding advantage because there was nobody for him to guard with Thomas in there. Marion was still Marion. Raja Bell had "only" worked himself into an elite perimeter defender along with developing a reliable 3-point shot.

[Gino]

Listen to what you're saying? Mihm? George? A rookie Walton? You didn't even mention Tierre Brown, Kareem Rush and Jumaine Jones. Yeah, how could a team like that miss the playoffs? Jesus ing christ. That 04-05 Lakers squad was one of the tiest supporting casts in recent NBA history and you throw Kobe under the bus for it. I could care less if Odom and Butler were there. That's a team built to go nowhere. Time to get real man.

Walton wasn't a rookie. Man, if youre going to accuse me of being inaccurate, maybe you should check your facts more before posting.

Are you suuuuure youre not DazedAndConfused in disguise? He's the only other person who posts misinformation so quickly.

[Medvedenko]

The 04 and 05 season Lamar missed the last 20 games.....also Caron missed some time as well as Kobe....that team was going nowhere and had Tomojonovich and a different system as well. Oh and Brian Grant was hurt as well.

[DazedAndConfused]

At this point I couldn't give two s about the past 3 Laker seasons. Kobe is winning that MVP trophy, Lakers are #1 in the WC, and we have HCA all the way until the Finals (assuming BOS or DET makes it). Things are looking up for the Lakers......

[TDMVPDPOY]

dont forget derek fisher, he also says hi at the end of the tunnel...

seriously, they have players who have played together for a few seasons now, compared to CP3 who had 2 seasons where it looked like they were on paced to be in teh playoffs, only to be hampered by injuries to players in there starting 5 who were either borderline 1 demensional players...

[Medvedenko]

I forgot how CP3 plays defense for all of those players. He's definitely the truth.

[JMarkJohns]

What Nash did that season Amare was out was amazing, but the cupboard wasn't as bare as JMark is making it out to be. That team still had some really good players. Diaw was awesome that year, whereas he hasn't been the same since because he couldn't find a role or a groove with Amare back and then with the addition of Hill. Barbosa really came into his own as that season went along, and gave them another weapon in the open court with his speed. Thomas was the perfect fit for that offense, he helped stretched opposing defenses with his 3-point shooting ability. Avery had to bench Dampier in the conference Finals and negate some of our rebounding advantage because there was nobody for him to guard with Thomas in there. Marion was still Marion. Raja Bell had "only" worked himself into an elite perimeter defender along with developing a reliable 3-point shot.

I was never saying there wasn't talent, only that it was largely troubled, unproven or unreliable entering each talents tenure with the Suns. Many had career years. A few others had renaissance seasons. Nobody can dispute that they had some talent, but I'm saying Nash was the one who pulled it together, and, that if you would have seen the roster in the preseason, you'd have suspected 45ish wins and a first-round exit. True, players stepped up, but Nash helped them learn now. That's the biggest difference between any of the sans-Shaq, Kobe-led Lakers and the 05-06 Suns. Whereas Kobe couldn't quite maximize potential, and he had plenty the year they wound up in the lottery, Nash always seems to get the most out of his teammates.