Celtics and Lakers Fixed?

[Purple & Gold]

Ignorant people don't understand why the Lakers are always relevant. And good post Allanon. Hopefully some people might understand, but I doubt it.

[21_Blessings]

Let's just say he hit the big shots when he needed to, but he took a uva lot of shots.

Kobe shot 53% for the series and single handedly won games 1 and 5 in the 4th. You're embarrasing yourself now. It's hilarious.

[v2freak]

Kobe shot 53% for the series and single handedly won games 1 and 5 in the 4th. You're embarrasing yourself now. It's hilarious.

I'm not sure what was so embarassing about what I said. I simply matched two obvious statements in a diplomatic attempt to solve a dispute between Spurs da champs and you. I understand there is no way to prove "he hit the big shots and took a lot of shots" as they are subjective in nature, but I can show you statistics. He shot over 50% as you are so keen to claim, but he also took 120 shots in 5 games. He is also not like Duncan, who may take 2 or 3 shots in 1 possession due to his own offensive rebounding. If you took any time off from jerking off to Kobe's picture to watch the game, you'd realize that the Spurs essentially made him a jumpshooter, as other Spurs fans have said. Hence, one of his shots often used up an entire Lakers' possession. This is also a good explanation for why he did not parade to the free throw line. I do not know what you consider to be a lot of shots, but in my book, that is plenty. I can completely understand why people would a.) not like playing with him and b.) consider him a ballhog.

I don't know what your deal is, or why you laugh at things that are not even funny, but you should really try to analyze things at face value. Before this post, I had not said anything about whether he was a ballhog or whether he was a great player. I simply said that he hit a lot of big shots (probably something that you, me and Purple & Gold can agree on) and that he took a lot of shots. But apparently you and Purple & Gold cannot even agree with me on such a middle ground-like statement.

[Tacker]

The NBA shares profit between the rich and poor teams. The poor teams don't bring in much revenue because their team sucks. If they could make the poor teams better, every team in the NBA makes more money.

Sure the Big Market teams make more money but there are alot more small market teams.

It's good for the league accountants to have alot of compe ive teams, it increases ratings across every game, not just the big market ones thereby increasing league ratings, dispersed fandoms and lots more money.

This is why the lottery always goes to the poorest teams, they have to get better in order for the league to make more money.

this thread fails so badly.... last years celtics team is much different than this year.... this year lakers has a new allstar and future hall of famer in Pau Gasol.....

[Purple & Gold]

I'm not sure what was so embarassing about what I said. I simply matched two obvious statements in a diplomatic attempt to solve a dispute between Spurs da champs and you. I understand there is no way to prove "he hit the big shots and took a lot of shots" as they are subjective in nature, but I can show you statistics. He shot over 50% as you are so keen to claim, but he also took 120 shots in 5 games. He is also not like Duncan, who may take 2 or 3 shots in 1 possession due to his own offensive rebounding. If you took any time off from jerking off to Kobe's picture to watch the game, you'd realize that the Spurs essentially made him a jumpshooter, as other Spurs fans have said. Hence, one of his shots often used up an entire Lakers' possession. This is also a good explanation for why he did not parade to the free throw line. I do not know what you consider to be a lot of shots, but in my book, that is plenty. I can completely understand why people would a.) not like playing with him and b.) consider him a ballhog.

I don't know what your deal is, or why you laugh at things that are not even funny, but you should really try to analyze things at face value. Before this post, I had not said anything about whether he was a ballhog or whether he was a great player. I simply said that he hit a lot of big shots (probably something that you, me and Purple & Gold can agree on) and that he took a lot of shots. But apparently you and Purple & Gold cannot even agree with me on such a middle ground-like statement.

So it's OK for Duncan to take a lot of shots, but not Kobe

Does he take a lot of shots? Yes, but all great scorers do. So I really don't know what you're trying to say. I'm sure any scorer would take a lot of shots if he was shooting 53% and winning games. Just a weak attempt at you guys to try to paint him as a ballhog. But I forgot, it's ok if Duncan takes a lot of shots because they're all from his own misses

[v2freak]

So it's OK for Duncan to take a lot of shots, but not Kobe

Does he take a lot of shots? Yes, but all great scorers do. So I really don't know what you're trying to say. I'm sure any scorer would take a lot of shots if he was shooting 53% and winning games. Just a weak attempt at you guys to try to paint him as a ballhog. But I forgot, it's ok if Duncan takes a lot of shots because they're all from his own misses

Unsurprisingly, you've missed everything from my post. I'm interested to see how you derived that from what I said. Alas, it is my own fault. I am not explaining things very well, it seems.

You completely ignored my point on used possessions. Unfortunately, there is no "used possessions" statistic that I know of, but I know that a lot of Duncan's "shot attempts" are really him trying to tip the ball away from opponents. Due to the nature of Duncan's position, many of his misses allow him a chance to rebound the ball in the event that he misses (an event that occurs only about 50% of the time overall). That may explain his high rebounding numbers.

I am also amused by the fact that you do not distinguish between a ball hog and a good scorer. A person on a team that shoots 80 times and makes 40 shots while the rest of his team gets 1 shot attempt total is a good scorer and definitely not a ball hog, right?

[Purple & Gold]

Unsurprisingly, you've missed everything from my post. I'm interested to see how you derived that from what I said. Alas, it is my own fault. I am not explaining things very well, it seems.

You completely ignored my point on used possessions. Unfortunately, there is no "used possessions" statistic that I know of, but I know that a lot of Duncan's "shot attempts" are really him trying to tip the ball away from opponents. Due to the nature of Duncan's position, many of his misses allow him a chance to rebound the ball in the event that he misses (an event that occurs only about 50% of the time overall). That may explain his high rebounding numbers.

I am also amused by the fact that you do not distinguish between a ball hog and a good scorer. A person on a team that shoots 80 times and makes 40 shots while the rest of his team gets 1 shot attempt total is a good scorer and definitely not a ball hog, right?

Well at least your honest now and admit you are trying to call him a ballhog. Fact is if you are winning and you are shooting a high % you are not a ballhog. You're doing what it takes for your team to win. This is a fact that for whatever reason you have missed.

I know all about Duncan getting his own rebounds But you act like he's Moses Malone missing his shots on purpose. If you watched the Lakers at all you would realize that they share the ball and get everybody involved. This is not some Allen Iverson team, where 1 player dominates the ball for 4 quarters.

The only reason you think the Lakers are all Kobe is because during each 4th quarter he ripped your guys heart out. That's what is called being a clutch player and stomping on your opponent when they are down. Instead of being a whiny like so many of your fellow spurs fans, why don't you just admit that the Lakers were better this year and that Kobe personally ed slapped your team. Some spur fans here have really sank to new lows.

[Allanon]

this thread fails so badly.... last years celtics team is much different than this year.... this year lakers has a new allstar and future hall of famer in Pau Gasol.....

What the are you talking about. Who's on this team?

Even with Pau, the Lakers wouldn't be anything if they hadn't picked up Kobe Bryant on a draft day trade at #13. Jerry West setup the Lakers legacy by trading one of the best NBA Centers (Vlade Divac) for some high school kid named Kobe Bryant. 24 other teams could have done the same thing but didn't cuz nobody had the cajones. This could have set the Lakers back for years if it was the wrong choice.

Paul Pierce, the leading scorer and an MVP candidate with KG was the #10 Celtic draft pick. Where would the Celtics be without Paul Pierce this year? That was an excellent draft pick, only Dirk Nirwitzki picked 1 spot before him is playing better right now.

The Clippers had the #1 pick that year, they grabbed the Kandi Man, they sure setup their team for the next decade! Could you imagine how good Paul Pierce or Dirk or Vince Carter, Elton Brand, Corey Maggette would have been for the last 5 years?

How would the Celtics have gotten KG without Al Jefferson, the Celtics #15 draft pick?

Ray Allen was gotten primarily for draft choice Jeff Green who is kicking ass on the Sonics.

Celtics are good now because they drafted very well, they picked up very good young talent Al Jefferson and Jeff Green (draft rights), those are 2 damn good players. You think they could have gotten KG if they had drafted Kirk Snyder or Luke Jackson instead?

This team may be different but it was created via trading excellent draft picks. It's easy to look at the NBA with a shallow view of conspiracies. There ain't no conspiracy, just stupid GMs and bad draft picks.

[lefty]

Vos gueules

[21_Blessings]

I'm not sure what was so embarassing about what I said. I simply matched two obvious statements in a diplomatic attempt to solve a dispute between Spurs da champs and you. I understand there is no way to prove "he hit the big shots and took a lot of shots" as they are subjective in nature, but I can show you statistics. He shot over 50% as you are so keen to claim, but he also took 120 shots in 5 games. He is also not like Duncan, who may take 2 or 3 shots in 1 possession due to his own offensive rebounding. If you took any time off from jerking off to Kobe's picture to watch the game, you'd realize that the Spurs essentially made him a jumpshooter, as other Spurs fans have said. Hence, one of his shots often used up an entire Lakers' possession. This is also a good explanation for why he did not parade to the free throw line. I do not know what you consider to be a lot of shots, but in my book, that is plenty. I can completely understand why people would a.) not like playing with him and b.) consider him a ballhog.

Kobe got plenty of lay ups that series, including 3 crucial ones in game 5 with one coming in Duncan's face during the 4th quarter. Kobe has one of the best mid-range jump shots in the game, Spurs didn't 'make him a jumpshooter' Kobe just torched the out of him. Besides that, Kobe was being mauled all series and he never got any calls. It was utterly obvious.

Kobe shot 53% on the series. He torched the Spurs. When you are shooting 53% you should be the one shooting the ball especially when you are the best scorer on the planet. Get a clue.

[v2freak]

Well at least your honest now and admit you are trying to call him a ballhog. Fact is if you are winning and you are shooting a high % you are not a ballhog. You're doing what it takes for your team to win. This is a fact that for whatever reason you have missed.

I know all about Duncan getting his own rebounds But you act like he's Moses Malone missing his shots on purpose. If you watched the Lakers at all you would realize that they share the ball and get everybody involved. This is not some Allen Iverson team, where 1 player dominates the ball for 4 quarters.

The only reason you think the Lakers are all Kobe is because during each 4th quarter he ripped your guys heart out. That's what is called being a clutch player and stomping on your opponent when they are down. Instead of being a whiny like so many of your fellow spurs fans, why don't you just admit that the Lakers were better this year and that Kobe personally ed slapped your team. Some spur fans here have really sank to new lows.

Obviously we have very different ideas on ballhogging. That is pretty much where this little game is going. And I never implied that he misses his shots on purpose. WTF? I doubt he would sacrifice FG% for rebounding.

And I have already conceded that the Lakers were a better team. In fact, I've done so many times, be it in this thread or in other "OMG LAKERZ R DA BEST" threads.

Kobe got plenty of lay ups that series, including 3 crucial ones in game 5 with one coming in Duncan's face during the 4th quarter. Kobe has one of the best mid-range jump shots in the game, Spurs didn't 'make him a jumpshooter' Kobe just torched the out of him. Besides that, Kobe was being mauled all series and he never got any calls. It was utterly obvious.

Kobe shot 53% on the series. He torched the Spurs. When you are shooting 53% you should be the one shooting the ball especially when you are the best scorer on the planet. Get a clue.

He may have gotten "plenty of lay ups" but from what I saw, most of his shots came from the perimeter. And yes, he made a lot of them because his is a great mid-range jump shooter. What's your point? The Spurs made him a jumpshooter because they didn't want him slashing, drawing fouls and making stupid faces, which he tends to do after a dunk.

You are so eager to defend every one of Kobe's actions, it is disgusting. Even if he were shooting 80% on the season but in one game, he was 1-25 with 5 minutes to go in the 4th, you would probably want him to keep firing them. [Insert childish comment like "you're embarassing yourself" or "get a clue"]

[Reggie Miller]

Because the draft is so susceptible to a bad pick and 1 good player can dominate an entire team. One bad pick and you're screwed. The NBA has the fewest team members of any major professional sport so the individual is more important.

Case in point are the Detroit Pistons who had the #2 pick with that young stud Darko Milicic. They'd be the NBA champs if they had gone with DWade instead.

The Spurs got Tim Duncan and that setup the franchise for a decade.

Portland picked Sam Bowie instead of #23. Everybody knows how that went for both franchises.

In 2006, the Bobcats blew their wad on Adam Morrison instead of Rudy Gay. So they still suck.

2005, Milwaukee picked up the super Andrew Bogut. Atlanta who desperately needed a point guard decided to get a shooting guard in Marvin Williams. Meanwhile, the Jazz picked up leftover Deron Williams and the Hornets picked up that Chris Paul guy. Atlanta would be a top 10 team right now if they had just picked up a point guard they knew they desperately needed.

2004, went pretty much OK, except the Lakers picked up Vujacic at #27. Half the guys before Sasha aren't even in the NBA anymore.

Kobe Bean Bryant was a #13 pick that the Lakers only got on a draft day deal for Vlade to the Hornets. Why didn't the 12 teams before choose him? If the Hawks had Kobe, they'd be dominating the league right now. The Lakers would be a loser team without that lucky #13 pick.

The Pacers are a worst case scenario, they're always good enough to make the Playoffs but not good enough to win it all. So they never end up with good lottery picks. Let's see what they do with theirs this year.

Stupid-ass draft picks make for bad parity.... The NBA, where one man happens.

Thank you for answering the question. I actually agree with you, by the way.

You forgot to mention that most guys would rather live in L.A. or Miami than Minneapolis or Milwaukee. That's huge, too.

I still think people are missing my whole point, though. The NBA has to deal with perception, not necessarily reality. The officiating has to get a LOT better and soon, or the conspiracy talk will just keep gaining momentum. It seems to gain more momentum every year here lately.

Also, L.A. fans, let's get real for a minute. I'm not saying the Lakers are succesful because of Herr Stern. However, you would have to be a complete fool not to realize the advantages your team enjoys. You get two extra home games every year. Your team pretty much rules the roost locally, because for some unknown reason, L.A. still doesn't have an NFL franchise. Perfect weather and future media contacts out the whazoo for veteran players. It's nothing to be ashamed of, but just admit it IS a compe ive advantage, OK?

[v2freak]

I don't see this series going fewer than 6 games.

[Lakers08Champs]

Stop crying because we defeated your spurs in 5. yeah I know the truth hurts sometimes.

[v2freak]

My comment has a dual purpose: I believe the NBA would want it to go further because it means more revenue and exposure, and because it shows that the teams are evenly matched. Speaking of which, I also think a reason the series will go at least 6 games is because both teams are very good.

I don't see how that is crying. There are ridiculously stupid inferences being made in this thread.

[MadDog73]

The only thing that is questionable are the trades.

The Lakers beat the Spurs, foul or no foul.

The Celtics beat the Pistons.

But, how those teams both got Gasol and KG for nothing... that's a trick I want the Spurs to learn!