Brutally Honest Truths

[007nites]

So what you're saying is...we're are a season away from being the Detroit Pistons? !!!!

My first post on this forum was so hopeful, even if it was after we lost in the playoffs. I saw Timmy never giving up, even at the end and it stuck with me. There must be a way, some way to at least get us in a position where we aren't a total mess...let Timmy throw his punches, let Manu leave with dignity rather than just quietly in the off season! LET IT ALL BE FOR SOMETHING! There are 10 days left to make a change, right? If we're losing the house, let's throw a in party and wake the neighbors.

I say lets make a big trade involving Manu, RJ, and Splitter then let Duncan go all out playing 40 mins a game till the finals. If we don't win then rebuild.

[mountainballer]

the situation for the FO at this deadline is probably tougher than we can imagine.
while I don't think they are discussing to tank the season, they might very well admit that this last shot for a le (spending big for RJ and Dice) has failed and that from now on every move has to be done with the future (time past Tim) in mind.
this might also mean that they don't try to save the season, because they think that such a process is better started in the offseason.

on the other hand, the Spurs do have some assets to get something done, a desperation move, if they once more are willing to take back more money.
problem is, those moves almost never pay good dividends.
(I'm talking about something like all expirings for Dalembert, Jamison or Murphy for example. other teams would likely agree to such deals)

IMO the toughest question isn't about what to do with Manu, it's what to do with Tony.
TIMVP as most others blame Tony's weak season on his play for the French NT.
I think that's only half the truth!
yes, playing the summer didn't help to keep him frech, that for sure. but what if already happens, what some experts expected some time ago, when Tony looked to have made the step from good player to top tire franchise level.
fact is, no other player in this league has played so many NBA games, (and more important: NBA PO games) than Tony did till 27.
Tony just reached the nice number of 777 NBA games. I once read that 800 games might be the average turning point, when players start to show the wear, no matter how old they are.
Tony is a very very old 27.
and to make things worse, his major (probably only) superstar quality is his speed. if his speed is gone (this especially means that he can use his speed for a whole game and not only for a quarter) he will be a very average player.

Tony's trade value currently might be still high enough to get a top talent back (maybe plus a nice pick).
if the Spurs think about the future, this might be the best way. compared to this, the Manu question is almost secondary.

[mingus]

my last shred of hope for this team is that our guys aren't playing with a sense of urgency. their biggest "test" game so far this season was against LA in S.A. and they showed up and ripped them to shreds. they were hitting on all cylanders that night. yes, i know there were injuries, but that team that night looked pumped and ready to go, and i'm hoping that's the mindset that they carry into the playoffs.

[024]

spurs need a replacement all star for ginobili. better role players won't help. look at boston. they have a rising young point guard and a strong defensive post presence in perkins. their bench is solid yet none of it has prevented the fall of the celtics because their big 3 is broken beyond repair. it may have slowed down the decline of the celtics but they are trying to trade ray allen for a reason. they are getting old. they know their core is broken and even with such a good supporting cast of rondo, perkins, wallace, house, and tony allen can't prevent the inevitable decline.

[Manu-of-steel]

I believe the spurs problems cannot be fixed, unless pop takes a look at himself and ask what the he's done with the spurs team. They acquired Mcdyess to support timmy- he's not being utilized, especially now that he has shown flashes of his old (effective) self. Ian is also sitting on the bench, while the remains of fossilized finley is guarding big forward (odom). Duncan is old, but he can still be effective. Manu is old, but he's shown in the past few games that he's still capable of being that spark off the bench. Hill has continued to develop, and fast becoming an impact player for the spurs. Blair is a rookie who can give a team a boost in scoring and rebounding. TP can still be effective, though not as the TP last year. We have a good team, the problem is Pop still doesn't know how to harness and let this team work efficiently.

[Cherry]

Sadly... I'm officially signing off on trading Ginobili and/or Parker.

For who? (?)

Forget Manu´s trade. I started to think he wants to get out of here as FA.

[ShoogarBear]

I'm not too sure this is true. He's played much better as of late and I'm not ready to sell him so short based on tonight. Its also hard to get a read on him when Pop goes to midget ball instead of actually sticking with him when he has a bad night. If Pop treated his bigs the way he treats Finley we might see them play out of of their funks.

I agree with this. McDyess has shown more sustained flashes of what he could be contributing if he were getting consistent minutes. I'd like to see what would happen if Pop ensure that either he or Duncan were on the court at all times.

[kobyz]

i think now we need to take our chances and trade Manu for Amare, Amare will take care the offense and that will leave Tim to focus on being a defensive big.

[21_Blessings]

Not sure why you're blaming Pop for Richard Jefferson. He sucked last year in Milwaukee. He was the same dumb, scared, ineffective player. Which is why the Bucks gave him away for expirings.

[Danny.Zhu]

1000% agreed.

[bigfan]

Duncan is still damn good, Tony can be damn good (and needs to get his priorities straight) and sadly Manu is just good now. Hill and Blair have a future with the team (assuming Hill survives his recent dumbass photo escapades.) I thought I liked Mason and still think hes a good bench player, something has just not been clicking and its up to a good coach to diagnose the problem and fix it before the end of the season. Jefferson turns out to be a bust, sorry for Holt on this but sometimes happens. The rest of the team are either too old or just plain useless (including Ian).

[TheChillFactor]

-Tony Parker ruined himself by overworking with the French national team. Not only is he beat up physically, he doesn't have it mentally. Evidence of that is seen when he explodes for one half and then disappears for another half -- as he's done way too often this season. He used to have great focus and would stay in attack mode for weeks at a time. Now we're lucky if we see him in attack mode for an entire quarter. He plays like he's physically, mentally and emotionally drained..

"Ruined himself" is a little strong - I'm not worried about him long-term, he's just tired and overworked. I think he'll be fine next year.

-It's not gonna happen. Richard Jefferson won't fit on this team. It's not so much his skillset is incompatible, it's more to do with his fragile psyche. You really don't know how a player will fit on a championship level team until he's thrown into the fire. He's been thrown into the fire -- and has melted. He's an inconsistent offensive threat who does absolutely nothing positive when his shot isn't going in. And as the pressure mounts on him to perform, he's just going to become more and more inconsistent. I can't imagine a happy ending with Jefferson in San Antonio..

Does anyone besides me remember 2003 Game 6 vs. NJ when Ginobili poked the ball loose, RJ non-chalantly went back to get it, and Manu was already on the other side of him and got a dunk? One of my top 3 Spurs moments ever, and it perfectly illustrated to me the difference between a championship player and an average player. That half-ass mentality has come up again and again with RJ this season. You can't change it.

-When the Spurs signed Antonio McDyess, they hoped old age wouldn't catch up to him right away. Unfortunately, it did. He's already a s of what he was last season. He's getting better but he just isn't the defensive presence he used to be. He's no longer a championship quality player as a starter..

I didn't think he was big enough and I thought he was too old. But he did get 10/10 last year so I thought maybe the FO knew something I didn't. 1/2 a season in though it's obvious this guy isn't the answer. It goes back to this team's (read: Pop's) mentality that they don't really need to improve, they just need to tweak the pieces. TD REALLY needs someone next to him that can defend the paint and rebound. TD REALLY needs someone next to him that can defend the paint and rebound...I'm not kidding!

-God bless DeJuan Blair but when size is your weakness and the team you have to go through has length as their main strength ... that's a bad combination..

-George Hill has come up big lately but the bottom line is he's a 6-foot-2 tweener who loses his confidence at the drop of a hat. When he loses his confidence, he turns into an indecisive dribbling machine. There's hope he can remedy that flaw before the end of the season but that type of growth is measured in years, not games. And while he's solid in most other aspects, he's not good enough in any one category to overcome passive play..[/quote]

I love both of these guys but they are both "helpers". 7th and 8th guys, not starters. No EFFING WAY a team wins a le with either of these guys starting.

-Speaking of Pop, he has historically been a very good coach but he nowhere near Phil Jackson's level. If Phil Jackson is Michael Jordan, Pop is Craig Ehlo. Pop is great at coaching players with that innately have a huge amount of self confidence ... but when it comes to coaching players who aren't brimming with self assurance, he's just not very good. Jefferson is simply the latest example of an otherwise quality player who can't handle the pressure of Pop's coaching style and complex system. On top of that, Pop not selecting a rotation has the Spurs stuck in neutral. They can't gain any momentum because no one knows who is playing on a nightly basis. To date, this has by far been Pop's worst coaching job of his career; in fact, he's done more to hurt than help this team..

I always thought Pop was really intelligent and humble but it seems like he's either stupid or egotistical about this small-ball stuff...also his insistence on getting guys that "have gotten over themselves" seems self-serving. Who cares if you have to roll your eyes at someone? Get a guy that can play! We won les with guys that hadn't gotten over themselves - Stephen Jackson, Avery Johnson, etc.

We have these great character guys that can't do anything without Pop holding their hand out there...pathetic.

[DaBears]

Stop the bus, i watched the game last night against the Lakers, i saw no Signs Jefferson was even in the building.. He was MIA as he has been all year... i feel bad for Mason, cause the guy had everything going for him up to the last couple games when Pop decided to screw up the game by cutting his minutes... Maybe we should stop putting all the blame on the players and on the coach... To be quite honest i dont see POP out on the bench either, he is a s of his fomrner self.. He looks like he has given up hope..... I sure hope someone from the front Office or anyone with decision making power reads SPURSTALK over the last couple months and heeds the advice and critism the fans are giving....

I believe in the SPURS but not this roster of under acheivers.....

[TheManFromAcme]

Heck, I am baffled with the Pop of late. What's up with him? Those line-up out there make absolutely no sense. This is way beyond his CIA claim. More KGB double-agent.

[DaBears]

As an basketball player and a compe or.. I see jefferson and it hurts, almost feel sympothy for the guy... he has no confidence in his game...... He probably should traded or this team should be disasembaled and rebuilt...I would be be ok with watching the Spurs losing if they had a bunch of young guys out there trying to proof they belong and getting use to each other... ie. Minnesota, Portand, Hawks........ Sure we would lose for a bite but you can see the light at the end of the tunnel... But in the process you never would question the competiveness of the team, same cannot be said with this team SA puts on the floor....

[igruex]

Pop should be in Pop's doghouse. This time, the rebuilding starts with him. When a coach is getting less than the average from several players you'd need to change the head and bring someone who can re-motivate your assets. This is not another case of an spoiled rookie, there are currently proven good players playing like not-even-bench-players.

[Walton Buys Off Me]

Not a typical timvp post but I can't disagree with anything said here.

Pop's refusal to stick with a rotation is the biggest problem IMO.

[Ocotillo]

Paging Jeff Van Gundy.

How the would we ever sign Billy then?

[romsho]

Richard Jefferson hasn't earned anything. the contract. Sit him. Why Pop continues to play small ball, especially at the end of games, remains a mystery. He see these guys in practice...he obviously feels the smaller lineup is a better option than what he has in his bigs. Certainly doesn't look like it in game situations. What does he have to lose at his point-bring Malik Hairston up, give him some of Jeffersons minutes, go with big lineups instead of small...I would rather lose that way than stay mired in mediocrity.

[bigzak25]

Pop should step aside, get Avery as coach, and trade for some ballers to put with TD, Manu, Hill, and Blair...

the time is NOW!

[SpurNation]

EGO got in the way of sound decisions and what would have been best.

[Flux451]

Damn, you just hurt my feelings.

We need a miracle this season. A blockbuster trade with a magical chemistry turn around is the only thing I see helping us. Otherwise its definitely over. One thing that comes to mind is SJAX (not saying gonna happen). I have shyed away from getting myself involved with conversations about him on this board, but man he is looking sharp and well behaved recently...moving on.

Your write up...Sad, but true. I agree with almost all except Mcdyess. I see him improving, especially after last night. I have never seen hiim more aggressively rebounding this season. Didn't understand the low PT either. Pop and his small balls.

Time for the ostrich to put his head in the ground.

[Old School 44]

To me it's all on Pop. Say what you will about the poor play of Jefferson and others, but Pop has been the biggest disappointment this year. He needs to get off of small ball and the three ball. I don't know how many times I cringed at the sight of players standing around the 3-pt line and launching. Where's the ball movement? A lot of times it's one and done. Next thing you know Tim's going to be launching threes just because he's ticked off at not getting any touches.

[elbamba]

You keep hoping that something will happen, something will turn this team around. They have lost about 12 winable games this year. But losing to Portland without their star player and several key injuries and then losing to LA without Kobe and Bynum will make any rational fan question this team.

[urunobili]

AJ would coach this team tot he NBA Finals... Pop's reign is over after this season....