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lol cobbler, his takes are some of the worst in ST history.
cobbler everybody realizes that you were talking out of your ass, even you. Just accept it and live to fight another war.
lol cobbler, his takes are some of the worst in ST history.
LOL trying to be/catch Jordan while only 2/5 rings resulted in finals MVP.
All Bryant is concerned with is the raw number of rings. If he can catch & overcome Jordan at that number he'll sit back and watch the hum of debate.
Can't debate much when the finals MVP of his championships was not Kobe for the majority of them. MJ was obviously the Man for all 6 of his, and still holds that finals MVP record, to go along with 5 regular season MVPs.
There won't ever be much debating going on, save for ESPN re s.
gasol plays well + kobe sucking = game 7 win against boston
gasol sucking + kobe playing well = swept by mavs
Fixed
swept by mavs
No I simply said Wade has been the best closer over the 90 games this season. I still conted that is true as do many others not sucking brons .
No I always said it was close and LBJ would be a lot better if he drove more and settled for 3's less. Been said many times over the year by plenty of people.
Glad to amuse you.
So, let's review:
No. I never said it was ridiculous. Again, I simply said Wade has been the best closer over the 90 games this season.
No, I acknowledged that Lebron has superior numbers in some areas and inferior in others with respect to Wade. You are the one that said LBJ is better with the main reason being he scores more point on better % shooting. I showed you that just isnt true if you include 3pt shooting. I ignored nothing even stating the areas were they both trump the other and that they are very close in many of those.
Again, just pointing out that your chart was sorted by pts and I could sort it in other areas showing Wade on top. In the last 5 mins of a game all those stats are factors. I even contend that steals, turnovers, and blocks in clutch situations are every bit as important as a pass, rebound, or basket. Go figure. I guess we just differ on whats more important. To me I would rather have the ball in the hands of the more versitle player that requires less assisting than the other. Oh well, live with it.
I showed you that he doesnt have superior numbers when you include 3pt shooting. If you want to use that argument, Bosh and Anthony are the best closers cause they shoot a MUCH higher %. It's a combination of skills that make a closer. All the stats! ANd IMO Wade is the better across the board.
I belive I mentiond several times the biggest difference bewtween the two is FT's. You are the one focusing on a single comment amoung many. Again, If LBJ drove mare than shooting the long range and 3 pointers. It wouldnt be close. He doesn't. It is. And I give the nod to Wade because I have watched the games and seen with my own two eyes who has done a better overall job closing OVER THE 90 games of the season.
And I show you the 3pt% more than makes up for the FT's. Again, apples and oranges. They both are great, they both are very good closers, I would have the ball in Wades hands. Again, many many have agreed with me no matter how much you ignore it.
NO, as I said earlier, I brought up Kobe because your list that you highlighted to show that LBJ was so much better than Wade has the hated Kobe at the top of the list. We all know that Kobe wasnt close to being the best closer. Just proof that you can sort and make stats fit just about any argument. They do not and never have told the true story of what goes on in a game. Anybody with half a brain knows this.
Shooting from the field they are very similiar. I showed that. LBJ gets to the line more. I have commented on that several times. I have also see the absurd calls he gets too. Don't act like thats not a factor.
Because even though he may have numbers in some stats that are lower than Brons by a slim margin he has others that are higher and there is no one stat that defines who the best player in the last 5 mins of a game are. ANd with all that said, I would rather have the ball in the hands of a guy who makes smarter decisions and can create a shot for himself both inside and outside.
You dont have to agree. I know there are plenty of basketball people that would agree with both of us. Bottom line, they are both great players and closers. It's my opinion that Wade has the edge. If that bothers you, so be it.
Last edited by cobbler; 05-12-2011 at 05:33 PM.
Those who actually care about facts say otherwise.
It isn't close.No I always said it was close and LBJ would be a lot better if he drove more and settled for 3's less. Been said many times over the year by plenty of people.
You definitely implied that it was ridiculous when you posted "Really?"No. I never said it was ridiculous. Again, I simply said Wade has been the best closer over the 90 games this season.
THAT IS ONLY ONE PART OF IT.No, I acknowledged that Lebron has superior numbers in some areas and inferior in others with respect to Wade. You are the one that said LBJ is better with the main reason being he scores more point on better % shooting. I showed you that just isnt true if you include 3pt shooting. I ignored nothing even stating the areas were they both trump the other and that they are very close in many of those.
Oh ing bull . You would not want somebody like Trevor Ariza on the court closing out instead of Carmelo Anthony. I'm talking about closing.Again, just pointing out that your chart was sorted by pts and I could sort it in other areas showing Wade on top. In the last 5 mins of a game all those stats are factors. I even contend that steals, turnovers, and blocks in clutch situations are every bit as important as a pass, rebound, or basket. Go figure. I guess we just differ on whats more important. To me I would rather have the ball in the hands of the more versitle player that requires less assisting than the other. Oh well, live with it.
If you really want to say that more steals and fewer turnovers completely cancels out LeBron's better production, go ahead. But nobody will take you seriously.
How is Wade better across the board? How?I showed you that he doesnt have superior numbers when you include 3pt shooting. If you want to use that argument, Bosh and Anthony are the best closers cause they shoot a MUCH higher %. It's a combination of skills that make a closer. All the stats! ANd IMO Wade is the better across the board.
Prove it.I belive I mentiond several times the biggest difference bewtween the two is FT's. You are the one focusing on a single comment amoung many. Again, If LBJ drove mare than shooting the long range and 3 pointers. It wouldnt be close. He doesn't. It is. And I give the nod to Wade because I have watched the games and seen with my own two eyes who has done a better overall job closing OVER THE 90 games of the season.
NO IT DOES NOT.And I show you the 3pt% more than makes up for the FT's. Again, apples and oranges. They both are great, they both are very good closers, I would have the ball in Wades hands. Again, many many have agreed with me no matter how much you ignore it.
LEBRON JAMES:
7.3 3PA x .238 3P% = 1.7374 3PM
1.7374 EPM x 3 = 5.2122 POINTS OFF 3-POINTERS
DWYANE WADE:
5.3 3PA x .429 3P% = 2.2737 3PM
2.2737 3PM x 3 = 6.8211 POINTS OFF 3-POINTERS
WADE SCORES 1.6089 MORE POINTS OFF 3-POINTERS
NOW, LET'S DO POINTS OFF FREE THROWS.
LEBRON JAMES:
23.8 FTA x .84 FT% = 19.992 POINTS OFF FREE THROWS
DWYANE WADE:
14.4 FTA x .73 FT% = 10.512 POINTS OFF FREE THROWS
LEBRON SCORES 9.48 MORE POINTS OFF FREE THROWS THAN WADE
9.48 - 1.6089 = 7.8711
LEBRON SCORES 7.8711 MORE POINTS THAN WADE WHEN FACTORING ONLY 3-POINTERS AND FREE THROWS. THAT IS NOT A WASH.
DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THAT?
I agree. When choosing only one stat, like you have with points scored, one does not get the entire story.NO, as I said earlier, I brought up Kobe because your list that you highlighted to show that LBJ was so much better than Wade has the hated Kobe at the top of the list. We all know that Kobe wasnt close to being the best closer. Just proof that you can sort and make stats fit just about any argument. They do not and never have told the true story of what goes on in a game. Anybody with half a brain knows this.
So, let me get this straight:Shooting from the field they are very similiar. I showed that. LBJ gets to the line more. I have commented on that several times. I have also see the absurd calls he gets too. Don't act like thats not a factor.
You want LeBron James to drive to the rim more, but when he does, you about the calls that he gets?
Ridiculous.
And again, LeBron shoots more free throws than Wade because he drives to the rim.
Both of them can create shots for themselves. LeBron scored more points largely because he got to the line more. Is there anything more efficient than getting to the line?Because even though he may have numbers in some stats that are lower than Brons by a slim margin he has others that are higher and there is no one stat that defines who the best player in the last 5 mins of a game are. ANd with all that said, I would rather have the ball in the hands of a guy who makes smarter decisions and can create a shot for himself both inside and outside.
It bothers me because your reasoning is re ed.You dont have to agree. I know there are plenty of basketball people that would agree with both of us. Bottom line, they are both great players and closers. It's my opinion that Wade has the edge. If that bothers you, so be it.
I feel like I'm being trolled right now.
Somebody is upset.
Even HoBoy, who hates me, the biggest Lebron homer and stat boy on ST agrees with me.
You are en led to your opinion on whats more important and I am en led to mine. It's just stats.
Move along...
lol ignoring my response because you have no argument.
Again, do you not understand that LeBron scores more points more efficiently, or do I have to show you why again?
That was never the issue but just one of the arguments. I think Wade is the better closer and I showed you why. Several times I might add. How many times do I have to show you why I think the more versatile player is the better person to be handling the ball. It's my opinion and can easily be argured as your points. I choose not to repeat myself any more.
I stand by my comments. Wade is the better closer of the two.
What have you shown me? That Wade gets more blocks, steals and fewer turnovers? That's why he is a better closer?
Goddamn
ohhh geez. blocks, steals, turnovers, better perimeter shooter, creates own shot easier, close to lebron in all others except gifts, and most importanty proven winner and not a quitter.
Ill say no more... I stand by my opinion and it's arguable.
Have a great evening.
Kobe simply doesn't care about any of his individual accolades anymore. That may have been a different story immediately after Shaq left, but he has a singular purpose now.
To win more rings than Jordan. It's that simple, he doesn't give two s how it happens so long as it does.
Hey re , winning more rings than Jordan IS an individual accolade
Which are good, but unless he has some otherworldly numbers, those alone don't make him better.
Which is negated by LeBron being better at getting to the line. I already did the math for you. Stop using this as proof that Wade is a better closer.numbers better perimeter shooter
Look at the ast'd percentages of players on that list. Durant's is 57%, Carmelo's is 59%, and Dirk's is 39%. Are you honestly making a big deal out of a 5% difference?creates own shot easier
LeBron is better in those areas.close to lebron in all others except gifts
I'm sorry, isn't this argument about who has been a better closer this season? Why are you throwing around insults instead of making points?and most importanty proven winner and not a quitter.
Learn to admit you were wrong.Have a great evening.
What you now have is a better turnover rate, a better block rate, and a better steal rate.
I already showed you that LeBron scores more points more efficiently. Please, do not bring that up again.
Now tell me how Wade was a better closer than LeBron this season. Please, show me.
It's sad because you have no argument at this point, yet you still keep coming back for more while ignoring my points.
Last edited by redzero; 05-12-2011 at 09:28 PM.
that's one of the funniest things I've ever read.
Kobe definitely didn't care about winning All Star Game MVP.
Every NBA player cares about individual accolades..everybody on the planet cares about getting some kind of recognition for their profession or talent, whether they admit it or not..
Like DOK said, using Kobe as an example is beyond ridiculous..the king of giving effort in the All-Star game
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