Hypothetical: If S.A. were interested, Could they cquire the #1 pick from the Cavs

[cd98]

It was Kawhi and Splitter or Green, not all three, but yeah.

I don't think Kawhi/Green/Splitter will hold more value anyway. Kawhi, as much as we all love him, is clearly not #1 pick quality under the terms we understand it (superstar). Splitter isn't any better than Varejao. But yeah I'd much rather have Green than Bennett right now. Definitely.

He's damn close. He'll be an all star as that crap is a popularity contest and he'll have plenty of that due to his finals performance. With his skill set and work ethic at his young age and what he's accomplished against the two best players in the NBA on the biggest stage, if be surprised if any GM preferred to gamble on Parker or Wiggins. They may have cheaper contracts, but who cares if they are busts, which could well happen. See their tournament performances.

[kobyz]

Most spurs fans wouldn't trade Kawhi even for Lebron!

[Kidd K]

No, it was all three. It was my proposal that even brought Danny and Tiago into this current part of the thread. Maybe I had a typo, but the intention was the three Spurs for the three Cavs.

I think we understand the value of the first-overall pick differently. I don't think of it as being a superstar, since it's usually not. I think the odds are good that whomever the Cavs draft will be worse than Leonard over the course of their careers. That's just the way or happens. Proven players are hard to find, especially 22-year-old fMVPs who play at a position of need. If Wiggins/Parker had Kawhi's career through three years, they will be worth their draft status.

Splitter's way better than Varejao, especially next to a PF like Thompson. Tiago is one of the top five all-round defensive bigs in the league. Anderson's health is even worse than Splitter's was when he first came into the league.

No in way is Kawhi "more likely to have a better career than the #1 pick.

Modern era #1 picks:

1979: Magic Johnson
1980: Joe Carrol
1981: Mark Aguire
1982: James Worthy
1983: Ralph Sampson
1984: Hakeem Olajuwon
1985: Patrick Ewing
1986: Brad Daugherty
1987: David Robinson
1988: Danny Manning
1989: Pervis Ellison
1990: Derrick Coleman
1991: Larry Johnson
1992: Shaquille O'Neal
1993: Chris Webber
1994: Glenn Robinson
1995: Joe Smith
1996: Allen Iverson
1997: Tim Duncan
1998: Michael Olowakandi
1999: Elton Brand
2000: Kenyon Martin
2001: Kwame Brown
2002: Yao Ming
2003: LeBron James
2004: Dwight Howard
2005: Andrew Bogut
2006: Andrea Bargnani
2007: Greg Oden
2008: Derrick Rose
2009: Blake Griffin
2010: John Wall
2011: Kyrie Irving
2012: Anthony Davis
2013: Anthony Bennett


You can argue 7 or so are worse than Leonard now (due to injury mostly, but some were busts). Like half of those dudes are superstars WAY above what Kawhi will ever be even if the planets align and he peaks to his peak potential. The remaining 10 or so are easily better than Kawhi has been so far.

So no. . .sorry, but it isn't "likely". It's just "possible", and unlikely.

You do not throw away that potential for two role players and a dude who maybe could make the all star team a few times. You just don't.

[cd98]

No in way is Kawhi "more likely to have a better career than the #1 pick.

Modern era #1 picks:

1979: Magic Johnson
1980: Joe Carrol
1981: Mark Aguire
1982: James Worthy
1983: Ralph Sampson
1984: Hakeem Olajuwon
1985: Patrick Ewing
1986: Brad Daugherty
1987: David Robinson
1988: Danny Manning
1989: Pervis Ellison
1990: Derrick Coleman
1991: Larry Johnson
1992: Shaquille O'Neal
1993: Chris Webber
1994: Glenn Robinson
1995: Joe Smith
1996: Allen Iverson
1997: Tim Duncan
1998: Michael Olowakandi
1999: Elton Brand
2000: Kenyon Martin
2001: Kwame Brown
2002: Yao Ming
2003: LeBron James
2004: Dwight Howard
2005: Andrew Bogut
2006: Andrea Bargnani
2007: Greg Oden
2008: Derrick Rose
2009: Blake Griffin
2010: John Wall
2011: Kyrie Irving
2012: Anthony Davis
2013: Anthony Bennett


You can argue 7 or so are worse than Leonard now (due to injury mostly, but some were busts). Like half of those dudes are superstars WAY above what Kawhi will ever be even if the planets align and he peaks to his peak potential. The remaining 10 or so are easily better than Kawhi has been so far.

So no. . .sorry, but it isn't "likely". It's just "possible", and unlikely.

You do not throw away that potential for two role players and a dude who maybe could make the all star team a few times. You just don't.

How many of those guys are finals MVPs?

[Chinook]

No in way is Kawhi "more likely to have a better career than the #1 pick.

Modern era #1 picks:

1979: Magic Johnson
1980: Joe Carrol
1981: Mark Aguire
1982: James Worthy
1983: Ralph Sampson
1984:Hakeem Olajuwon
1985: Patrick Ewing
1986: Brad Daugherty
1987: David Robinson
1988: Danny Manning
1989: Pervis Ellison
1990: Derrick Coleman
1991: Larry Johnson
1992: Shaquille O'Neal
1993: Chris Webber
1994: Glenn Robinson
1995: Joe Smith
1996: Allen Iverson
1997: Tim Duncan
1998: Michael Olowakandi
1999: Elton Brand
2000: Kenyon Martin
2001: Kwame Brown
2002: Yao Ming
2003: LeBron James
2004: Dwight Howard
2005: Andrew Bogut
2006: Andrea Bargnani
2007: Greg Oden
2008: Derrick Rose
2009: Blake Griffin
2010: John Wall
2011:Kyrie Irving
2012: Anthony Davis
2013: Anthony Bennett


You can argue 7 or so are worse than Leonard now (due to injury mostly, but some were busts). Like half of those dudes are superstars WAY above what Kawhi will ever be even if the planets align and he peaks to his peak potential. The remaining 10 or so are easily better than Kawhi has been so far.

So no. . .sorry, but it isn't "likely". It's just "possible", and unlikely.

You do not throw away that potential for two role players and a dude who maybe could make the all star team a few times. You just don't.

Over the last 10 years (including this one) , I'd only take two first picks over Leonard out of hand: Davis and Griffin. I could see taking Rose in a world were no one gets hurt. I'd take Kawhi over Wall and Irving and obviously so over the rest.

[Kidd K]

Over the last 10 years (including this one) , I'd only take two first picks over Leonard out of hand: Davis and Griffin. I could see taking Rose in a world were no one gets hurt. I'd take Kawhi over Wall and Irving and obviously so over the rest.

It's ridiculous you wouldn't take Dwight Howard, Wall, Irving, or Rose. Bogut is arguably better too. Bennett and Oden were busts, Bargs is all right but yeah worse than Leonard.

[cd021]

Here's the problem: Whoever trades for these players has to pay for them. . .and pay a lot more than they would for a rookie who has the very likely potential he will be better than Leonard. Look at the top 1-3 picks of just about every draft lately. Kyrie Irving, Kevin Durant, Unibrow, John Wall, etc.

Combine the fact that you barely have to pay for those players for years, and their value is a LOT higher. It isn't just the potential, which is greater.

As for last year's draft, it was notoriously poor and was expected to be weak going in. This one is the opposite.

The Cavs will not throw away their pick for a costly role player(s) and a guy who while good, has never made an all star team.

If the Cavs were offered Kawhi, Tiago or Green for the number #1 pick, I'd think they'd do it. My logic is similar to CD98s. All 3 of these players are proven talents with useful skills.

Leonards; defense,rebounding, & efficient scoring. Greens; defense, rebounding and elite 3 point shooting and Splitters versatility in defending the paint and stretch 4s along with passing and finishing. Neither Wiggins, Parker or any other in player comes with certainty at the next level.

Leonards production has been suppressed by minutes limitations and a balanced offense that but
Just because they have the talent to be taken with a top 3 pick doesn't ensure that they will be successes just based on recent drafts.

2010-Wall, Turner, and Favors
2011-Irving,Williams, Kantor
2012-Davis, MKG, Beal
2013-Bennett, Oladipo, Porter

only 3 of the 12 top 3 picks taken from '10-12 have been all-stars.

I thought Embiid was the closest thing to a sure thing in this draft but the rest seem far from a sure thing Wiggins and Parker could be all-stars or they could be very good but not great players.

Its like taking the mystery box or $1 million dollars. The mystery box could have $3 million in it or it could have enough for half a tank of gas.

With the Cavs recent underwhelming top 5 picks (Thompson, Waiters, Bennett) I'd think they take the proven commodities and avoid any further embarrassment to their organization.

[Kidd K]

How many of those guys are finals MVPs?

5. 13 Finals MVPs between them.

[Chinook]

It's ridiculous you wouldn't take Dwight Howard, Wall, Irving, or Rose. Bogut is arguably better too. Bennett and Oden were busts, Bargs is all right but yeah worse than Leonard.

Howard was 11 drafts ago. I'd take him, James and Yao, but leave the four before them.

It's not ridiculous to not take Rose, especially after what we know now. Irving is overrated, and Kawhi's definitely been more impactful so far. I like Wall, but he's only been playing at a high level for a year and a half, and even then, he sucked for most of the post-season.

[cd98]

5. 13 Finals MVPs between them.

Right. The number gets smaller. How Many of them won it at 22?

[Mel_13]

Low risk high reward that's cheap vs high risk medium reward that costs more.

That's what this hypothetical deal is. It's less of a risk and would not receive any backlash for making the pick instead of trading it. Imagine if they trade it and the top pick ends up being the next Hakeem. It would be heralded as the worst trade in NBA history.

We completely disagree on that risk assessment.

Moving on.