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Yeah, got me there.
Maybe you are paid by ownership to shill their arguments in here.
If it was that bad, why did the Jazz make him the offer then?
Again, he was restricted and it was expected that the Spurs would match an offer for him. Not hard to understand.
Yeah, got me there.
Maybe you are paid by ownership to shill their arguments in here.
Wow, good one.I think the Spurs' front office is one the best, actually. You either have a juvenile sense of irony or a serious learning disability. From the quality of your arguments and grammar, I assume it's the latter.
Devin Brown = Championships
Fortunately, the Spurs retained Sean Marks, or they would have really been in trouble.
Yeah, it's not hard to make ownership's argument: milking the arena deal and the lux tax program with Tim Duncan's presence guaranteeing that we will have at least 2nd round playoff appearances is all we need.
A learning disability? Dude, are you serious? C'mon. You couldn't think of anything better? You have to use my grammar as a way to try and cut on me? Very nice.Wow, good one.
Yeah, that was in bad taste.A learning disability? Dude, are you serious? C'mon. You couldn't think of anything better? You have to use my grammar as a way to try and cut on me? Very nice.
I understand the outrage, but I think it disregards certain facts that make the decision understandable.
In the immediate term, Finley over Devin makes perfect sense. The Spurs proved last season, even without Devin, that they had plenty of defense. They lacked offense, and particularly, lacked consistent offensive punch off the bench. That problem was so pronounced that Pop had almost no choice but to make Manu the 6th man if his team was to have any chance to knock out the Nuggets. Why continue with the periodic benching of Manu when you can add a guy right now who will offer you that consistent scoring from the bench?
Another reason to not match and luxuirate with a plethora of wings is money. It's not just about ownership having to pay out the luxury tax; it's about ownership not being able to participate in the distribution of luxury tax proceeds. Without making this overly complex, the Spurs decision to stay below the tax threshold not only ensures that the franchise won't have to pay dollar-for-dollar for that excess (whomever you wish to allocate as the excess salary), but also ensures that the Spurs will take a full share of the distribution of the tax money, plus some portion of the league's escrow money, plus a share of whatever surplus exists. It's not an insigificant amount of money. Paying Devin Brown to linger as an insurance policy might have cost the Spurs in the neighborhood of $10 million in 2005-06. We can be as frivolous as we want in a forum with Holt Cat money, but I'm not sure I'd fell real comfortable discounting the importance of $10 million extra dollars to a small-market franchise.
I understand, though, that this isn't so much about next season as it is about 2006-07. That's fair. But I also think there is some hyperbole in the lament about the Spurs wings going forward. It's not as if the Spurs have struggled to identify talented wings/perimeter players and develop them through the Popovich years. I mean, they did find Antonio Daniels for the price of Felipe Lopez and Carl Herrera. They convinced Derek Anderson to give it a shot and got the best year of his career out of him. They identified guys like Charles Smith and Ira Newble, who could at least contribute in the NBA. They found and developed Steven Jackson well enough to win a le with him. They traded John Salmons and Mark Bryant for Speedy Claxton, then turned around and gave an NBA career to Jason Hart after he had been discarded elsewhere. And, oh yeah, they stole Tony Parker and Beno Udrih late in 1st rounds, and Manu Ginobili in the 2nd Round of the NBA draft. And, of course, there's Devin Brown. For the last 6-8 years, it's not as if this franchise has had a hard time finding perimeter players who can come in, develop, and successfully play roles in the system.
The sky isn't falling.
Yeah, that was in bad taste.
Marcus, please listen. The Spurs released Brown in part
3. Back Injury
2. Luxary Tax
1. (The most important) Because they know they will have the opportunity to sign Brown in 2 years, if his potential devolpes into the success many originally invisioned.
The Spurs organization made an incredible manuver, which conicidentally, has gone un-noticed by the entire league. It was not the signing of NVE, or Finley, but the release of Devin Brown. What!?. Why? If the Spurs retain Brown, his growth would have become stagnant, due to his position in the rotation. So what does the Spurs front-office do? They allow Devin to walk, but knowing full well were he would end up, Utah. If he were unable to play under Popavich, what better coach then Jerry Sloan to teach Devin the necessary skills and responsibilties to mature into a successful player. Utah will be able to provide Devin with the attention he so rightly deserves, which in turn will allow his abilities to nurture over time.
Why would Devin return? Considering the money that will be offered, assuming that Devin's abilities continues to blossom, the question posed seems rather logical. Did anyone notice the deamnor of both Devin and the Spurs Organization? Both understood the other's position and parted with ways, not with bitterness, but with undauting respect for another. Devin is gone for now, but in 2 years?
Trust me. Marcus doesn't listen. He will find a way to argue and try to make it seem like he knows what he's talking about.
If he's that good, why didn't more teams offer him. How come other restricted FAs were made offers that their current teams that are more free spending than the Spurs did not match? It didn't scare away Detroit or Minny.
You are incredibly naive if you think a team in need of a SG would be afraid that the Spurs would absolutely match anybody not by the name of Ginobili regardless of an offer, especially the Spurs 3rd string SG.
The reality is, Devin was not a highly sought after RFA and it wasn't because other teams were scared the Spurs would match.
In 2 seasons the Jazz will have his Early-Bird rights. In 2 years, at best the Spurs will have the full MLE to offer him (which, yes, is the same amount as available under the Early-Bird rights). But it's not hard to see how the Spurs might be caught using that money to cover other parts of the team. At a minimum, the Spurs won't be able to outbid the Jazz for him.
Plus, you are assuming that Devin is cool with being cast aside like that.
I disagree that the Spurs had such an idea in mind in making this decision.
It's not as if the Spurs will just be able to say, "You know, we'd really like to bring that Devin fellow back to our team." Two years from now, unless they make some major moves, the Spurs will be substantially over the salary cap, particularly if they choose to lock up Nazr. If they're over the cap, they're going to have to do some major manuevering to acquire Devin, who will likely be offered only a backup role.
1. Offer Devin the MLE or some part of it, assuming the Spurs have an MLE to use, that they have no more pressing needs to fill, and that there aren't better players already on the market.
2. Work a sign-and-trade for Devin.
3. Trade a big contract (Manu, Parker, Barry, Nesterovic) for a big expiring contract to gain some cap space before that summer.
4. Hope that Devin will take substantially less than market value for the chance to come back to SA.
There is no certainty to any of those scenarios, so I can't see that this decision is part of any bigger plan by the Spurs to get over on the league.
And you are assuming that Devin will command more than the MLE in 2 years which is highly unlikely.
The Spurs had his Early Bird rights. They could match any offer from those teams.
Detroit made Evans an offer that the Kings didn't have the cap room to match, from what I recall.
You are incredibly naive as you don't seem able to see how losing Brown for nothing was a bad basketball move. Saying that he would have cost the Spurs money does not suffice for an argument.You are incredibly naive if you think a team in need of a SG would be afraid that the Spurs would absolutely match anybody not by the name of Ginobili regardless of an offer, especially the Spurs 3rd string SG.
Most restricted free agents are not highly sought after, because of the difficulty luring away a restricted free agent entails.The reality is, Devin was not a highly sought after RFA and it wasn't because other teams were scared the Spurs would match.
Marcus you would know a little bit about assuming since that's all you seem to be doing a lot of it today. Just like you did right here :Plus, you are assuming that Devin is cool with being cast aside like that.Way to go! You just proved that all you do is assume. Give it up. Wait for the season to play out.But it's not hard to see how the Spurs might be caught using that money to cover other parts of the team. At a minimum, the Spurs won't be able to outbid the Jazz for him.
Why? Because you can't rebut it? Deciding who and who not to spend money on are part of the game. They are basketball moves. You can't separate the 2 like you are trying to do.
Why are you guys having the same exact arguments in two or three threads?
It's annoying as .
I'm locking the other ones. I don't mind the argument. I just mind the same argument in every thread I open.
Look, the Spurs made a smart financial move; I just don't think it was the right basketball move. They do not have any insurance for Bruce on the current roster.
I haven't had to assume. I've seen the Spurs:
- Lose a young, complete role player.
- Lose a valuable player for nothing.
- Lose flexibility next offseason.
- Lose depth at a position at which the Spurs have 4 guys to cover 5 spots this season.
I only care about seeing the team win. I don't care how ownership does and I certainly don't need any of you try to explain to me how a business operates. Given the publicly available info I've seen in regards to their EBITDA, valuation and balance sheet they are not anywhere close to being in financial trouble. Also, Holt Cat isn't the sole owner, as some of you don't seem to understand. There are a couple of Fortune 500 companies in that ownership group.
It was a ty basketball decision and seeing you apologists try to explain it as being something else is great entertainment.
Exactly. End of discussion.
Sure you can. Especially given the amount involved.
Next summer, when they presumably will have money to spend, they won't have the cap flexibility to make it happen. So you just handcuff yourself because you are afraid to spend a little bit more this summer. That move this summer will hurt them next summer and perhaps the one after that. Instead of having a solid, complete role player who you know is good enough to be your primary backup swingman, you will have nothing and will be constrained by the cap. That's a bad move all around.
Again. You assume all of the above. Give it up. PLEASE!!!! You have no idea what will happen and neither do I. Let the season start and play out. You don't know if the Spurs are done making moves. You have no idea if the Spurs might move this player or that player before mid-season. None of us KNOW so quit assuming Marcus. Its really old.
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