Ludden: Parker delivering for Popovich

[fred33]

if he plays like that 10 more years with the spurs the number 9 will be retired

[timvp]

I'm not willing to say Tony Parker is the best point guard in Spurs history yet (*cough*James Silas*cough*), but I can state that without a doubt Tony Parker gets dumped on by Spurs fans more than any great player in Spurs history.

I knew you'd pull out the Silas card when I made that post

Silas averaged fewer assists in his best year than Parker averages this season ... and that was with Silas averaging five more minutes per game on a Spurs team that averaged ten more points per game. Not to mention he had a couple guys named Gervin and Kenon to pass to. Even Mark Olberding averaged over 4 assists that year.

Silas led the Spurs in assists only twice in his entire career (both while in the ABA). Parker is going to pass him this season in career assists. Silas only had one year in which he averaged more points that Parker is averaging this season.

I respect Silas and have watched games in which his Captain Late nickname is appropriate, but Parker is already better than him. You could argue Silas had the best season (1975-76) but career wise, Parker has already passed him.

[whottt]

I'm not willing to say Tony Parker is the best point guard in Spurs history yet (*cough*James Silas*cough*), but I can state that without a doubt Tony Parker gets dumped on by Spurs fans more than any great player in Spurs history.

Yeah but Parker is the best since fire was invented.

[ShoogarBear]

I knew you'd pull out the Silas card when I made that post

Silas averaged fewer assists in his best year than Parker averages this season ... and that was with Silas averaging five more minutes per game on a Spurs team that averaged ten more points per game. Not to mention he had a couple guys named Gervin and Kenon to pass to. Even Mark Olberding averaged over 4 assists that year.

Silas led the Spurs in assists only twice in his entire career (both while in the ABA). Parker is going to pass him this season in career assists. Silas only had one year in which he averaged more points that Parker is averaging this season.

I respect Silas and have watched games in which his Captain Late nickname is appropriate, but Parker is already better than him. You could argue Silas had the best season (1975-76) but career wise, Parker has already passed him.

I will go whottt-like on your ass upon my return from the game.

[timvp]

I will go whottt-like on your ass upon my return from the game.

I'll be waiting

[diego]

KJ has no rings. Coaches don't set up their defenses to stop him.

if youre going to knock him, do it right. coaches did set up their defenses to stop him, but he was injury prone and that ultimately did him in. tony on the other hand is very resilient (knock on wood!)

[Bruno]

I mean use the Hakeem argument for Parker...

Post season records:
VS Payton - 1-0

I don't think so.

[whottt]

Oh yeah..but putting Payton from that year is like saying Fisher is 3-1 against him...and Fisher had more to do with loss that than Payton. Tony destoyed Payton in games 1 and 2 of that series to the degree that Payton actually had to beg for help against him.

Kidd and Payton admitting they need help against Tony in the media = PWNT 100%. And they had no alternative to admitting it because Tony was kicking their asses when they tried to defend him man on man. Period.

[RC's Boss]

if youre going to knock him, do it right. coaches did set up their defenses to stop him, but he was injury prone and that ultimately did him in. tony on the other hand is very resilient (knock on wood!)

I'm not knocking I just think Tony is better

[George Gervin's Afro]

Well enough to know that Alvin Robertson was a shooting guard?

So a shooting guard who played in the worst five year stretch in franchise history is the Spurs' best point guard of all-time?

Got it.

Thanks.

Well the "shooting guard" has better stats in his 4th yr to TP's.considering TP's cast was far superior AR was a better point/shooting guard than TP

AR 19.6
6.7 assists
2.9 steals

TP
18.8 ppg
5.7 assists
1.03 steals


So by your account AR was not a better point guard yet avged more assists with a team that was in the midst of horrible 5 yr stretch..

Y'up I'd take AR over TP for point guard

[timvp]

Well the "shooting guard" has better stats in his 4th yr to TP's.considering TP's cast was far superior AR was a better point/shooting guard than TP

AR 19.6
6.7 assists
2.9 steals

TP
18.8 ppg
5.7 assists
1.03 steals


So by your account AR was not a better point guard yet avged more assists with a team that was in the midst of horrible 5 yr stretch..

Y'up I'd take AR over TP for point guard

Johnny Dawkins was the point guard of that 31-51 team. Robertson averaged one more assist even though that Spurs team averaged 15 more points a game than this Spurs team.

And the fact that Robertson had a worse supporting cast made it easier for him to put up stats.

I find it pretty funny that you say Parker doesn't pass enough and then you point to a shooting guard as a player that is better than Parker. Especially one that had a career record as a Spur of 100 games under .500.

But yeah, whatever. I guess there has to be Spurs fans from all angles out there. Parker sucks. Too bad the Spurs don't have Brevin Knight as their starting point guard.

[T Park]

amazing.

Kids a two time all star, and fans want him out.

Genius. Absolute genius.

[nkdlunch]

Parker is AMAZING. He not only got a consistent shot in less than 2 years. He learned how to play D!!!!

He is top 5 PG in my book. I would not trade him for anyone, including Iverson/Nash/Billups because of his age.

[phxspurfan]

parker will be competing with the likes of wade, ridnour, deron williams, marcus williams and chris paul when duncan and manu are gone, and that's when he will taste quite a bit of defeat.

[RC's Boss]

parker will be competing with the likes of wade, ridnour, deron williams, marcus williams and chris paul when duncan and manu are gone, and that's when he will taste quite a bit of defeat.

No he won't... Pop and RC will draft syphyllitis ghonnoreasich and amea indanusouch both now 16 year old's playing in the under 18 and virgin league and mold them into the next Jordan and pippen

[ducks]

Pop has been on Duncan to stop trying to draw fouls and just try to score for years. Pop has been on Manu about stop forcing dumb passes for years.

How much have they listened?

And when the Golden Boy Manu Ginobili joined the Spurs and Pop asked him to try to fit more into the team's style of play, Manu responded with the classic line: "This is how I play. I'm not going to change."

But then again, Spurs fan who joined the bandwagon in 2005 wouldn't know that.

yeah but that is tp fault
manu said this is the way I play I AM NOT GOING TO CHANGE
tp does what the team needs shoot pass
manu does not like to but will but will not change his style of play

[nkdlunch]

ducks u are the !(I don't know what u truly said though)

but u're right(I think) timvp, learn from ducks basically he is saying Pop ordered TP to play the way he does and ordered Manu to play the way he does too. If you got complaints, talk to Pop.

[RC's Boss]

Parker is AMAZING. He not only got a consistent shot in less than 2 years. He learned how to play D!!!!

He is top 5 PG in my book. I would not trade him for anyone, including Iverson/Nash/Billups because of his age.

[ShoogarBear]

I'll be waiting

First, comparing absolute assist numbers from the 70s to today is a fallacy. Just about everyone who has seen both eras agrees that statisticians were much tougher about giving out assists back then. Bascially, if the receiver did anything except go up immediately into the shot after the pass, you wouldn't get credited for the assist. When Magic and Bird came in the league, assists became a glamor stat, which eventually led to ridiculousness like Stockton's home stat-padding and Scott Skiles getting 30 assists in a game.

Second, the idea of a one-guard and a two-guard specialization is much more regimented these days than 30 years ago, so ballhandling duties and assists tended to be spread out more. Yes, you had a sprinkling of high-assist guys, but 6 APG would easily get you into the top ten almost any year.

A better comparison is the fact that Silas ranked 14th in assists the ABA in 1975 and 6th in 1975. He was also secon-team all-league in 1975 and first-team in 1976.

The mark against Silas was the fact that his career was shortened by two huge injuries in consecutive years, which happened at the age of 27, just as he was hitting his peak. Despite that he still managed to come back to put up respectable numbers for a few years, even thought he had nowhere near the same explosiveness.

And the Church of Ice never complained that he didn't pass the ball to Gervin enough.

[BgT]

First, comparing absolute assist numbers from the 70s to today is a fallacy. Just about everyone who has seen both eras agrees that statisticians were much tougher about giving out assists back then. Bascially, if the receiver did anything except go up immediately into the shot after the pass, you wouldn't get credited for the assist. When Magic and Bird came in the league, assists became a glamor stat, which eventually led to ridiculousness like Stockton's home stat-padding and Scott Skiles getting 30 assists in a game.

Second, the idea of a one-guard and a two-guard specialization is much more regimented these days than 30 years ago, so ballhandling duties and assists tended to be spread out more. Yes, you had a sprinkling of high-assist guys, but 6 APG would easily get you into the top ten almost any year.

A better comparison is the fact that Silas ranked 14th in assists the ABA in 1975 and 6th in 1975. He was also secon-team all-league in 1975 and first-team in 1976.

The mark against Silas was the fact that his career was shortened by two huge injuries in consecutive years, which happened at the age of 27, just as he was hitting his peak. Despite that he still managed to come back to put up respectable numbers for a few years, even thought he had nowhere near the same explosiveness.

And the Church of Ice never complained that he didn't pass the ball to Gervin enough.

Thanks for the post.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Johnny Dawkins was the point guard of that 31-51 team. Robertson averaged one more assist even though that Spurs team averaged 15 more points a game than this Spurs team.

And the fact that Robertson had a worse supporting cast made it easier for him to put up stats.

I find it pretty funny that you say Parker doesn't pass enough and then you point to a shooting guard as a player that is better than Parker. Especially one that had a career record as a Spur of 100 games under .500.

But yeah, whatever. I guess there has to be Spurs fans from all angles out there. Parker sucks. Too bad the Spurs don't have Brevin Knight as their starting point guard.

He didn't pass enough until the past few weeks. I have on more than one occasion have mentioned that he is getting better at looking for his teammates more. I have criticized the guy fro a couple of years for not passing it enough so Im' not just making that up. Whether Pop told him to pass more or not our team is better when he does not force things and looks to involve his teammates. For the past few weeks I have not criticized him once on shot selection or whether he is forcing his shots. In fact his numbers have steadied even after Pop asked him to alter his game. I have no doubt that the guy can become a perennial all star but he will never be able to carry a team like some here assume he can. In the end I just want to win and I feel, apparentyl Pop does also, that TP must let the game come to him rather than he feeling the need to 'taking a game over'


At this point in their respective careers I would take AR because he was an all-star as well and was a lockdown defender on a very bad team. To me ALvin Robertson was a guy who could dominate a game offensively or defensively in his prime and at this point we cannot say that about TP. TP deserves to be an all-star and I am happy that he is being recognized.