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Too
ing
Easy.
http://www.webmd.com/brain/tc/Trauma...ssion-Overview
http://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/concussion?page=5On rare occasions, concussions cause more serious problems. Repeated concussions or a severe concussion may require surgery or lead to long-lasting problems with movement, learning, or speaking. Because of the small chance of permanent brain problems, it is important to contact a doctor if you or someone you know has symptoms of a concussion.
A person with a single, isolated concussion generally has a very good outcome with few long-term side effects.
Too
ing
Easy.
It can't be that easy me donkey.
The prosecution and defense has to prove wether, the six wanted to cause more harm than they did. Outcome, is not necassary in judging attempted murder. Otherwise, it'd be murder we're dealing with.
Yep, easy for you to focus on one point. Just because the concussion likely was no big deal doesn't mitigate the fact that he was beaten after already being unconscious. Have to look at the whole situation, not just one or two parts that ban be picked apart. This was a very aggressive act. Not one of self defense. The actions against Bailey by any of the students can all be seen as reasonable, except the noose.
Let’s say the concussion is not big deal. How about that animalistic manner in which he received it.
Struck from behind being knocked unconscious. Beaten by a few black students when down. No mercy.
Should these black students be shown mercy?
How can anyone rationalize their actions?
Here in my state, as second degree assault is a mandated minimum of 70 months.
From links within:From the 1998 Criminal Code of Oregon:
163.175 Assault in the second degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of assault in the second degree if the person:
(a) Intentionally or knowingly causes serious physical injury to another; or
(b) Intentionally or knowingly causes physical injury to another by means of a deadly or dangerous weapon; or
(c) Recklessly causes serious physical injury to another by means of a deadly or dangerous weapon under cir stances manifesting extreme indifference to the value of human life.
(2) Assault in the second degree is a Class B felony.
Measure 11 Crime Seriousness
Bailey might get off easy in racist Louisiana. If that happened here in Oregon, if convicted, and that is likely… He would get that minimum 70 months!
What kind of students were they again?
BTW, I've made no posts regarding the charges so I don't know why after I owned you you started down that path. I'm not sure why Gculo has started down that path. I'm not sure why Yoni started down that path.
Shouldn't you all know what you're arguing against before you start arguing?
That's right, pick just one small segment and dwell on it rather than the whole issue. That's a losers way out.
Things you can establish from my posts in this thread;
1. I don't believe concussions are big deals
2. I don't believe 3 hours in the emergency room is a big deal
3. MannyIsGod > Wild Cobra
Anything else and you're just guessing.
This is necessary because it has become a race thing. That does not mean normal criminal proceedures should follow.
Funny thing, is like I said before, this all seems to be a personal issue between Barker and Bailey. It might not really be about race. And you know what... Bailey instigated at least three of the incidents!
Did you ever think maybe I never came in here to argue with your viewpoint on teh subject becaue mine isn't very different from yours? Seriously man, for someone who sat there and spouted off how smart they claimed to be you sure miss simple concepts.
I came into this thread and pointed out that I hadn't read most of it but the onloy thing I wanted to say was that 3 hours in an emergency room wasn't much. Then you went off on concussions and I said they were no big deal. You then provided links which you failed to read fully to prove your point and they ended up proving mine on the minor subject that we split off on a tangent. Then, compeltely on your own and probably as in a straw grasping attempt to save some face you started arguing with me on a subject I had never even made my views clear on.
Good, ing, game.
4. Manny doesn't know the truth when it bites him in the ass.
What truth would that be?
You should read more. Sure, a concussion is normally no big deal, but you said it wasn't a big deal... impling 100%. I linked material showing otherwise.
I have not said it always was a big deal, you seem to ficus on absolutes that are unimportant.
Let me ask you this. Russian Roulette gives you a one in six chance of getting shot. Would you play the game saying it's no big deal because there is a 5/6 chance of no damage?
Right, you didn't make your views clear except you were dismissing a key fact as irrelavant. What am I suppose to assume?
Grasping for straws? LOL... You just don't get it. I am arguing the whole case. Not just one silly point. If one point is all you can handle, then go away.
How can you argue the whole case with someone when you don't even know their stance?
Wild Cobra, how you are able to function with such limited brain power simply amazes me.
LOL... You couldn't read past noose, and you claim I have limited brain power?
I get tired of these attacks, and yes, I can return attacks. What I don't understand is why people like you, Manny, Chump, etc. have to start attacks. Is it a way of countering a lack of being able to have an intellegent debate? Or is it that you have such low self-esyteem that it's your way of feeling better?
Why do people like you attack others instead of offering valuable material to debate? Have you offered any yet, or are you just a flamer?
Okay WC Lets Rock!!!
Purposely pushing issues. You mean being to uppity? How dare they not follow the rules and allow their white overlords to have their tree. Tell me, are you the type of person who views the civil rights movement as when America started to go wrong? Burden of proof? Seriously, a ing noose is hanging from a tree what more proof do you need. As far as nobody reporting it to the police, maybe the people there were to scared/intimidated to do so. That's the way it is in the Deep South. Even the school board then overturned the principal's recommendation that the boys who were responsible for the nooses be expelled.The noose can be prosecuted as a hate crime. However, you must show in the burden of proof that it was meant to racially intimidate. Under the cir stances and history of the events, it appears the black students were purposely pushing issues. If they were the initial troublemakers, then the noose could be a statement to anger then and even intimidate them. However, can it be proved it wasn't just a prank? Some blame the school officials for not reporting it as a crime to the police. Even a black teacher, Anthony Jackson, is quoted as jokingly saying "I jokingly said to another teacher, 'One's for you, one's for me. Who's the other one for?'" Why didn't the parents report this incident to the police? Apparently, nobody really took it real serious other than the recommended expulsion.
I find it funny that the one person you say that actually speaks out against the noose , you try to discredit as some person trying to start trouble. Tell me, why do you think that, and what the else is a noose hanging from a tree in the deep south supposed to mean?Now probably the biggest thing that escalated this whole thing came from a black activist, Caseptla Bailey, Robert Bailey Jr's mother! She said "It meant the KKK, it meant '######s we're going to kill you, we're gonna hang you 'til you die'." I find these activists that like to keep the racial tensions going. Look at the way she must have raised her son. Always someone else’s fault.
Tension between these people, no . You seem to be excusing the people who assaulted Bailey. I've crashed many parties in my day and I was never assaulted for doing so.As for the nooses, it is said that that really wasn't the catalyst. There seems to be tension between these people anyway. The night of the party seems to be the starting point. This was a invitation only party prior to the Ring Ceremony. Robert Bailey decided to crash it. Nobody was letting him in, and after he managed to get inside somehow. He was assaulted by others. He was unwelcome, and in essence, broke in. It was not on school grounds, and again, a private event. Another fight broke out, just outside, where one white adult was charged.
The next day, a Barker and Bailey had an altercation outside a convenience store. They each told police the other was the aggressor, but an eye witness said Bailey and his friends were the instigators. That is why Bailey was charged with the theft of the gun, and no charges for Barker protecting himself. Bailey was not arrested after bringing the weapon to the police. He took it home with him, effectively stealing it.
I'd like to know from what source or sources you found that said that eyewitnesses stated that Bailey and his friends are the one who started this.
The incident where Barker is beaten has eye witnesses saying he was attacked from behind and fell. He was unconscious at this point and they continued to beat him. Testimony has the following:
From what I have been hearing this Barker kid isn't all that innocent. I heard that he was screaming racial slurs to the boys. All I have to say is scream racial slurs to me and see what ing happens. Cause and effect my friend. The same way you appear to be defending the people at the party for assaulting Bailey when he crashed it I'm thinking if this is true and this Barker kid was screaming racial then maybe what happened to him doesn't deserve so much sympathy.
This paragraph is so stupid I'm not even going to comment on it.Now I really get pissed at the way the media says things. "All white jury." You know why? None of the blacks called for jury duty showed up! "White Tree" Was it actually designated this, or was it dubbed that for this story? We all had our own circle of friends we hung out with. That doesn't make it a racial thing. We all had our preferred places to congregate. That doesn't mean ownership. This is why I go back and think that the incident at the tree was first perpetrated by the blacks. We don't know for sure, but they probably set out to intentionally harass the whites there. I believe that because of the facts that followed the incident.
It's the UV RAY ! HEy UV ray! how come you don't awnser gtown's post?
Tell me, do you believe that racism no longer exists? That America is this racial utopia. Also and sadly, most of the white folks in Jena probably do think like that.
Nice stuff TL....too many times we tend see things through our own eyes...so caucasions who don't practice racism think that it does not exist anymore....after all, it's not them being racists....but they don't walk around being black, or hispanic, or any other minority...they don't know that there are still some racist people out there and the system is set up so minorities receive a inferior education ....
...that's my main problem with all these well-off kids who cry about being stuck next to some minority who doesn't measure up thanks to affirmative action in schools.....if you don't want affirmative action, then lets start sending some of the kids from Edgewood and South San to Churchill and Reagan and vice-versa....
I hope that we would be at the point where the state could take care of this without the feds getting involved, but maybe not.
Look, I read over 30 sources of information and I am olny bringing up points from all of them. If you wish to call that uppity, then why should I care. It makes it more obvious of your viewpoint by using a term that came out of the 1800's slave states.
I never implied that. I'm sorry your skills of deciphering plain English are not up to par. If you read all my thoughts on the issue, and compare it with other actions by Bailey, it is obvious he forced his way to places he was unwelcome. The question is, which I did not try to answer, is... Is it because he is black, or because he just wasn’t part of this particular group. I could have easily implied it was just because he is not part of a particular circle of friends, in fact, I do make mention of circles of people. I am just not willing to state as fact that it was something I don't have knowledge of. This does go to my experience in life that what I have seen about prejudice is the incorrect perception by blacks, so they keep the real hatred alive.
This also goes to Baileys mother. I really wonder what influence she had for Bailey to act like he did. When he and his friends went to the tree, was it to hang out and stay cool, or was it to harass the students already there? This is a question that needs to be asked. By the other things Bailey involved himself in, I believe it was the Blacks who first started the harassment!
Absolutely not. The civil rights movement was great. It has now been hijacked by race-baiters. They continue keeping racism alive rather than bringing up the black community.
There are several different possible angles on this, and I did state that I believe the noose was for intimidation, and therefore subject to hate crime laws. Again, that is my believe, and the burden of proof, like it or not, is part of our justice system. Now I bring this up again. Were they really nooses, or were they lassos? Maybe that's why the suggested expulsion was reduced to suspension, and the statements that no crime was committed! Again, only a guess, but it would have been an easily prosecuted crime if they were actual nooses! If I recall, it was the state attorney generals office that made that call, so go ask the governor. What really makes sense to me is students with lassos daring one another to hang them like nooses to see if people are so ignorant to think they are nooses… I see that as a very real possibility!
If people were scared, or intimidated, then what can we do? Someone has to come forward. Someone has to make the legal claim. Without going through the legal system, things will not change. I acknowledge that it may be the case. If so, the black community there can always be expected to remain in their current condition, until someone is brave enough, and not move to the back of the bus. I doubt there is a case though. Wouldn’t Mrs. Bailey have done so? As the local civil rights leader there, she definitely has enough clout!
Now will you acknowledge the possibility that there was no actual crime to report? Biased media accounts don't tell us everything, and the facts are difficult to find.
Again, burden of proof. Let's say they were nooses, and subject to hate crime laws. Now, the burden of proof has to prove they were purposely intimidating someone. That might not have been their state of mind. Take that, alone with Bailey being shown to be the perpetrator of reported incidents three time... Who's trying to intimidate, or antagonize who?
Don't you find it coincidental that Bailey started instigating troubling events after the noose, and it was his mother that made statements of what it meant? Sure, that's what it means to her, but could it have been nothing more than a harmless prank in the eyes of those placing it? If she had just blown it off like the black teacher did, maybe her son wouldn't have instigated those crimes?
Everyone should take responsibility to end racism. Forget the past. Let harmless things slide into oblivion.
Someone unwelcome crashes an event I hold, I will use what ever force it takes to remove them, even if I have to hurt them!
Yes! I believe the people who forcefully removed him had every right to.
It was in several web sites. Between Alta Vista searches, and articles at the botton of the wiki page, I read over 30. I'm not going back over them to find it, but it was sourced multiple times. The wiki page currently has 43 links at the bottom, the specific Alta Vista search yields 28.
Maybe he was. That's no reason for assault. Still, some of the stories deny he said any such thing too. We don't know for sure, because we were not there. I will assume he did, but I'm sure it likely went both ways.
Are you saying that words are reasons to attack from behind and beat an unconscious person who called you a ######? What a pussy to have to attack from behind anyway!
Sure, if Barker crashed Bailey's party. Otherwise, it's not the same now, is it?
Why is pointing out that the words portrayed in the media for sensationalism might not be the actual truth?
Did the kids in the school call it "the white tree" or did a particular group of kids, who just happen to be white, normally associate there?
Now consider if the kids broke up into approximate equal size groups, and we can safely assume that most groups would be black or white. Each group is going to have a normal place they hang out. At least we all did when I was in school. The geeks had the library, the smokers were at the wall by the tennis courts, etc... With about 1 in 6 being black and about 5 in 6 being white, would some smartass just be calling 5 in 6 places, white places?
Stop jumping to conclusions and look into the possibilities of situation. If you really consider that paragraph stupid, then you really have a closed mind...
Both of you prove my point. TLW especially, I have noNBA Dan Said: Nice stuff TL....too many times we tend see things through our own eyes...so caucasions who don't practice racism think that it does not exist anymore....after all, it's not them being racists....but they don't walk around being black, or hispanic, or any other minority...they don't know that there are still some racist people out there and the system is set up so minorities receive a inferior education ....
idea if he is really black or pretending to be one, and
really don't care. But obviously he is a racist, but would
call you one if you dared to state something about a
so called minority. Even if true.
And Dan, in San Antonio, I am the minority. But it
doesn't really bother me one way or the other. I have
had black neighbors several times, some of them were
great, others were not. Same with some of my white
neighbors. Some were great some weren't. I have worked
with blacks all my adult life, for them and had them
work for me. I had no problem with them one way or
the other. I felt extremely sorry for one, who had worked
and studied damn hard for a promotion and got it, only
to have a damn liberal paper make such a big deal
out of it that it appeared he got it because he was black
and filling a quota. I told him how I felt and that it
damn sure wasn't fair. He deserved the promotion
because he worked for it. So you two folks go suck a
lemon and TLW take the damn chip off your shoulder.
Folks may like you just a little bit more. Don't hunt
for trouble. Because I can guarantee you one thing,
you will find enough in life without seeking it out.
Someone ask about gtspur post, why I didn't respon
respond to what?
Added:
TLW if you are going to post stuff about people, at
least learn how to spell their race: It is "Caucasian"
and "Hispanic".
Also, TLW, I am posting a link to an interview with
Dr. Walter E. Williams, a person I admire very much.
Him and Dr. Sowell are two of the most down to earth
treachers I have ever had the pleasure of listening to
and reading. I hope you read the interview this link
points to. I wish the kids in Jenna had been pointed
in this direction. Anyhow, enjoy. I know I enjoyed
the interview. By the way both of these Gentlemen
are black.
http://www.objectivistcenter.org/ct-1750-.aspx
Last edited by xrayzebra; 09-23-2007 at 08:41 AM.
I'm asking this next question w/o having read anything in this thread...
It appears to me that thre MAJORITY of blacks only become angry about injustices against them, like the one that's happening right now w/ the Jena 6. That is fine.
But where are all these blacks standing up for what is right when it comes to all of the blacks in gangs, all of the blacks in jail, high teen pregnancy rates, low SAT test scores, AIDS etc?
I think its both and that is what is sad. Kids who do that and think its a prank grow up believing that its ok to do that. I applaud the fact that the kids who did that were expelled but it sucks that the expulsion was reduced to a suspension. Watching this story on Outside The Lines this morning the football coach and one of the school board were interviewed and they both condemned the nooses which tells me there is hope but then seeing the DA talk about this case and only mention the beating and not the nooses lessened that hope.I stopped reading this when you said that the noose incident was nothing more than a prank. Anyone who tries to rationalize the hanging of a damn noose in a tree, especially in the south as a prank, has to be A. one of the most ignorant people alive or B. an apoligist for racists.
Some people on both sides (including posters here) are so quick to point the other side as racists that they are ignoring the same behavior on their own side.
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