Spurs To Retire Avery Johnson's Number 6

[SRJ]

what about Malik?

I'm a big Malik Rose fan; I would enjoy seeing his jersey retired, but even I don't think he deserves it.

[SenorSpur]

Both...

#1. He's always had a mouth on him and had a kind of an at ude of...everyone on this team is a scrub but me. It's never his fault...even thought it usually was.


Other examples...


Intimidating young and rookie players on the team with his, "it's my team" at ude...lead to him getting into a fight with Malik Rose, getting called out on the bus by Steve Kerr.


When asked about the Spurs chances with Parker, he responded, "they're sending a boy to do a man's job". A statement which Parker then promptly shoved straight up his ass.


When Manu was first signed, AJ's # 6 was directly handed to Manu by Pop and RC...at which point Don Harris raised a big stink and got all the AJ homers to call in and about giving AJ's jersey to Manu.


The Spurs then took the jersey back from Manu...at which point AJ gave his opinion on the subject, "let him make his own number".

A statement which Manu then shoved up his ass, as a rookie, much like Parker did as a 20 year old.


There are other things he's done...AJ was flat out cancerous his final season here, ing about losing his starting job in midseason among other things...






Point blank...winning the 99 le and the media latching on to the cute, "little general" nick name...went straight to AJ's head.


Then he went from a pushy bossy guard, to being an unjustifiably arrogant, pushy and bossy guard.






AJ had a fiery demeanor and underdog qualities that endeared him to a lot of fans...however, he's been ting on the franchise for a long time and these people have let their AJ fandom over-ride the Spurs fandom to the detriment of our retired jerseys.

Plain and simple.


AJ could have stayed a guy you pulled for after Stoudamire ran his mouth and AJ owned him...if he'd just kept his mouth shut. Insteading he started thinking he was a HOF caliber PG.



I personally wouldn't care if he was getting in based on his mascot value..., it's just that, for a guy getting in on mascot value, he sure has been a head....it's evem worse when people try to argue he was a great point guard. '

He was not a great point guard....has was good enough to be a barely passable weakest link on an NBA chamoion featuring one of the greatest bigmen tandem's and defenses in history...that's the extent of his greatness.


He could not shoot.
He could not defend.
He could not get the FT line.
He could not shoot FT's when he got there.
He did not get steals.
He did not rebound.
And his biggest crime...He was useless to pass it to out of a double team.

And unlike Parker, who worked his butt off and improved his game...AJ's game never improved much...he did get a little bit better at hitting his wide open 15 footer, and he did become slightly more willing to take it...but that's about it. He was a liability in every other aspect of the game.


What he did...was use his quickness to get easy layups when David Robinon and later Robinson and Duncan were getting assraped in the post and AJ was the guy being dared to shoot....he wouldn't shoot it...he'd take it to the basket...and he was a complete and total liability in fourth quarters of big games, becuase he couldn't shoot, and he usually wouldn't even try.

The other thing he did was be bossy and tell everyone they were playing like crap when he was the guy least deserving of being on the court...




AJ could not even shoot FT's worth a flip...



Forgot the most important thing he did and his one true meaningful contribution to a Spurs le...and that was recruiting Mario Elie to play for the Spurs.

He was the leader of that 99 team...


I think his jersey is more deserving of retirment than AJ's...AJ should maybe get an asterisk on Mario's jersey or something...that's about it.



Mario Elie was the guy who taught this team to win les...like AJ he was bossy and would get in guys faces...unlike AJ, Mario stepped up when the pressure was at it's greatest, with more than just his mouth, and made the jobs of Robison and Duncan easier with on court contributions, punishing teams that tried to clog the paint...AJ never punished anyone when they attempted double teams and clogged the paint.

Wow! These are really stinging claims against The General.

Since I live in Dallas, I hear a lot of his Avery's coaching philosophies and soundbites on the radio. Many of which you would expect from a former Spurs player who honed his skills at the University of CIAPop. I remember him repeatingly telling his Mavs team about how he was an undrafted, unheralded, free agent PG, who could only drive left. He went onto say that "even though they knew I was driving left, they still couldn't stop me". Are you kidding me? Since when were you ever on the NBA All-Star ballot?

I sensed that Avery had sort of an asshole factor to him, but I wasn't aware that he was that much of an arrogant prick. And for what? Michael Jordan could afford to be an asshole if he wanted because his game, compe ive drive and wills were unparalleled.

Avery, on the other hand, was a scrub who fell into to the perfect situation. As many have stated, he developed his game just enough to parlay that into a prolonged career. He also demonstrated himself as a capable leader, for the most part, and he made good professional contacts. That said, he has NO PLATFORM to think he was better than a mere average player in this league. There's no doubt that he drove the mindset of that team, but is also sounds like he was equally as much a cancer as he was proclaimed a leader.

All that said, I'm really starting to struggle with this jersey retirement thing.

[Whisky Dog]

AJ reminds me of one of those religious evangelists that are often on television. They talk a big game and come off like they're the greatest thing with all the wisdom, but behind the words there isn't much substance. I hear all of his rants here in the Dallas media too, and the funny thing is that people ate it up. I think that's starting to change since his teams are being exposed as chokers two years in a row.

One funny thing to see if you can find it is his speech to the New Orleans Saints last season. He made it this grand spectacle about how he raised himself up from his bootstraps to have a great career and lead the Mavs to the finals as a coach, but he omitted the giant choke job that took place once they got there.

[saporvida]

god i cant stand aj... screw that little bas !

[FuzzyLumpkins]

johnson is the most overrated player in the history of Spurs basketball.

I wold rather us retire Mario Elies or Jaren JAckson's number then Johnson.

Everyone wants to talk about how he made that shot in 99 against NY but want to forget that other than that one spot on the floor he couldnt hit anywhere else for his entire career and that single spot for about a 100 game stretch from 98 to 99.

He was a liability on defense as he was too slow to keep up with quicker PGs and too weak to muscle anyone in the game up short of Bogues.

His leadership was exemplified by attacking Malik in the showers after Rose had called him out in 2000 when the team wasnt playing well in no small part due to Johnson's substandard play.

Basically Johnson didnt turn the ball over much and was better at point then Vinn Del Negro and for that people think he was a agift from god. Johnson reminds me of Trent 'Just Dont Screw It Up' Dilfer.

The fact that Johnson is getting his number retired is just demonstrative of how stupid people can be.

[whottt]

Avery was clutch his entire career.

OMGGGGGGGGGG


That's just soooo...........wrong.


It's like the most wrong and inaccurate statement in history.


It's like saying the Japanese nuked us in WWII...only, more wrong.

[whottt]

The Wright brothers invented the sumbarmine.[/2cents]

[samikeyp]

johnson is the most overrated player in the history of Spurs basketball.

I would still put Alfredrick Hughes ahead of him.

One clutch moment does not a clutch player make.

[whottt]

There's no grade for mascot appeal...IMO, that's the only criteria for which a case can be made for his jersey retirement....now that's he's stopped acting like a head it doesn't bother me near as much as it did.


It's just sad that stupid people are going to take this to mean he was a great point guard...despite the planet of evidence to the contrary. He wasn't a great point guard....in fact, I'd say he's inarguably the worst point guard to ever start for an NBA champion.

[Bruno]

They should show this video when they will raise his jersey :
http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=DTsu--pVxVY

[FuzzyLumpkins]

There's no grade for mascot appeal...IMO, that's the only criteria for which a case can be made for his jersey retirement....now that's he's stopped acting like a head it doesn't bother me near as much as it did.


It's just sad that stupid people are going to take this to mean he was a great point guard...despite the planet of evidence to the contrary. He wasn't a great point guard....in fact, I'd say he's inarguably the worst point guard to ever start for an NBA champion.

well then retire the coyotes number. 2! up in the rafters sounds more appealing than Johnson.

[SenorSpur]

AJ reminds me of one of those religious evangelists that are often on television. They talk a big game and come off like they're the greatest thing with all the wisdom, but behind the words there isn't much substance. I hear all of his rants here in the Dallas media too, and the funny thing is that people ate it up. I think that's starting to change since his teams are being exposed as chokers two years in a row.

One funny thing to see if you can find it is his speech to the New Orleans Saints last season. He made it this grand spectacle about how he raised himself up from his bootstraps to have a great career and lead the Mavs to the finals as a coach, but he omitted the giant choke job that took place once they got there.

AJ is certainly a stubborn bas . Perhaps even a bit dellusioinal when it comes to his abilities as both a player and a coach. While his coaching record is impressive, his playoff track record SUCKS! He doesn't dwell on this much during interviews either.

A personal top 10 list of Avery's coaching and personnel blunders include the following:

1. Burning his team out through an 82-game schedule and a first-round loss during last season's playoffs.

2. Allowing his team and himself to become consumed with their arrogance after going up 2-0 in the NBA Finals versus Miami.

3. Moving his team to a different hotel after Game 4 loss to the Heat in the 2006 NBA Finals, thinking this would get them off South Beach and force them to refocus. Too late. The meltdown starting in the 4th quarter of Game 3.

4. Investing time and money into Erick Dampier. Thinking he could inspire this guy.

5. Not turning the PG position over to Devin Harris two seasons ago. Again showing his disdain for rookies and their mistakes. Instead, trusting Jason Terry to run the PG position.

6. Not taking input from his assistance coaches, who have expressed a desire to run an occassional zone defense set. Apparently AJ doesn't believe in zone defense.

7. Doug Christie experiment - nuff said.

8. Antonie Walker experiment - nuff said

9. Not taking the Golden State Warriors seriously in last season's playoffs. Basically underestimating the edge and motivation of Warriors coach Don Nelson

10. Thinking that he'll ever beat the Spurs in a 7-game playoff series ever again during the Duncan tenure!

I've always rooted hard against the Mavs - mainly because of Cuban. I've never bought into this about rooting for the Mavs because of Avery. All these revelations make me spew some venom against Avery too.

[Walter Craparita]

Let's send it up on game 7 of the WCF when he knocks the Spurs out of the playoffs.

Honoring the enemy during the dynasty run. WTF.

[urunobili]

AJ was certainly the a huge part of the mental fabric of that 1999 championship squad. Having Mario Elie at his side was also a tremendous asset - along with D-Rob, TD and others.

That 1999 championship is the only one AJ will sniff. Because he certainly will not, as a head coach - at least not during the Duncan era.

Anybody care to see AJ come back to the organization as head coach once Pop retires?

he will have his first championship as a coach with us!
i'm not really sure how to feel about this...

[SenorSpur]

johnson is the most overrated player in the history of Spurs basketball.

I wold rather us retire Mario Elies or Jaren JAckson's number then Johnson.

Everyone wants to talk about how he made that shot in 99 against NY but want to forget that other than that one spot on the floor he couldnt hit anywhere else for his entire career and that single spot for about a 100 game stretch from 98 to 99.

Funny you should bring this up. I recently watched a replay of that entire series-clinching victory versus the Knicks. Duncan, Elie and D-Rob were stellar. Avery missed a few shots until he hit that most famous last shot. What I remember most, is one sequence during which he made a bad pass that resulted in a turnover. Pop calls timeout. AJ goes to the bench and starts to chastize a teammate.

[SRJ]

johnson is the most overrated player in the history of Spurs basketball.

I wold rather us retire Mario Elies or Jaren JAckson's number then Johnson.

Everyone wants to talk about how he made that shot in 99 against NY but want to forget that other than that one spot on the floor he couldnt hit anywhere else for his entire career and that single spot for about a 100 game stretch from 98 to 99.

He was a liability on defense as he was too slow to keep up with quicker PGs and too weak to muscle anyone in the game up short of Bogues.

His leadership was exemplified by attacking Malik in the showers after Rose had called him out in 2000 when the team wasnt playing well in no small part due to Johnson's substandard play.

Basically Johnson didnt turn the ball over much and was better at point then Vinn Del Negro and for that people think he was a agift from god. Johnson reminds me of Trent 'Just Dont Screw It Up' Dilfer.

The fact that Johnson is getting his number retired is just demonstrative of how stupid people can be.

I love how someone can make a post like this and then call out other people for being stupid. Here, let's take it point by point:

I wold rather us retire Mario Elies or Jaren JAckson's number then Johnson.

Mario Elie was a better player than Avery. He was also a Spur for two seasons. And Jaren Jackson sucked balls except for the 1999 playoffs. Don't rely on your obviously faulty memory to tell you that - go to www.basketball-reference.com and compare Avery Johnson and Jaren Jackson. After you see the results for yourself (assuming you can interpret them correctly), go outside and slap yourself in the face with a salmon for being as slow-witted as you are.

Everyone wants to talk about how he made that shot in 99 against NY but want to forget that other than that one spot on the floor he couldnt hit anywhere else for his entire career and that single spot for about a 100 game stretch from 98 to 99.

That's why AJ routinely shot 48% per season.

He was a liability on defense as he was too slow to keep up with quicker PGs and too weak to muscle anyone in the game up short of Bogues.

Too slow? One of Avery's few physical assets was his speed. Not strong? Avery benched 400+.

His defensive liabilities were his height and his hands. You could post up Avery Johnson, but for some reason very few teams actually did.

His leadership was exemplified by attacking Malik in the showers after Rose had called him out in 2000 when the team wasnt playing well in no small part due to Johnson's substandard play.

Yes, Avery did fight Malik Rose in the shower once. Jeez, you act like this is TO crapping on Donovan McNabb. One incident does not define a player.

Basically Johnson didnt turn the ball over much and was better at point then Vinn Del Negro and for that people think he was a agift from god. Johnson reminds me of Trent 'Just Dont Screw It Up' Dilfer.

And you know what? You can win with those type of QBs, and you can win with those type of PGs. Believe it or not, you don't need an All-Star at every position!

People who like Avery Johnson appreciate the fact that the guy worked his ass off to improve every single year and his professionalism.

The fact that Johnson is getting his number retired is just demonstrative of how stupid people can be.

The attendants down at the home will be tracking you down soon, so you may not get to read this response for a few days.

[whottt]

10. Thinking that he'll ever beat the Spurs in a 7-game playoff series ever again during the Duncan tenure!

Ehhh....Pop has some kind of guilt complex concerning AJ...he's going to suck as a coach against AJ and force his team to choke. Dunno why...

Maybe after the jersey retriement Pop won't feel obligated to tank against AJ...one can hope.

[SenorSpur]

Ehhh....Pop has some kind of guilt complex concerning AJ...he's going to suck as a coach against AJ and force his team to choke. Dunno why...

In the back of my mind, I always thought that.

[whottt]

I


That's why AJ routinely shot 48% per season.
.

AJ didn't routinely "shoot" anything.

If you mean he laid it up when possible and forced it in to a triple teamed Drob the rest of the time, especially in the fourth quarters of playoff games...then yeah, I guess that's shooting.


AJ didn't shoot...period.

And there's a reason he couldn't hold a job as a 3rd stringer on any team that didn't have an All Time Great NBA bigman.




AJ is Jacque Vaughn...only Vaughn has a better shot...and defense.

[SRJ]

Yeah...Pop wants to take it easy on AJ. Good thing he didn't coach in the Finals against his best friend or anything, or we would have lost the 2005 NBA Finals.

Good thing Pop's not good friends with Don Nelson, or we would have lost to the Mavericks in 2001 and 2003.

Come the on!

[SenorSpur]

I still have nightmares watching opponents "sag off" AJ, while packing the paint to prevent D-Rob from shooting. Teams practically dared AJ to shoot the ball.

[SRJ]

AJ didn't routinely "shoot" anything.

If you mean he laid it up when possible and forced it in to a triple teamed Drob the rest of the time, especially in the fourth quarters of playoff games...then yeah, I guess that's shooting.


AJ didn't shoot...period.

I guess if you have to manufacture a crap argument to contend with a substantial body of evidence, go ahead. We can't verify anything you say, and I suppose that's what you rely on.

And there's a reason he couldn't hold a job as a 3rd stringer on any team that didn't have an All Time Great NBA bigman.

Yeah, the 1994 Warriors were loaded with great bigs.

AJ is Jacque Vaughn...only Vaughn has a better shot...and defense.

Vaughn has a better shot

[ducks]

I think it is time people here email the spurs on how they feel
postive or negative
I think they can also email the sa paper

put up or shut up

[whottt]

Anyone that thinks AJ could shoot should have to spend eternity playing C as the best interior scoring option on 's hoop team big, with AJ as their point guard...

[ducks]

Is Aj As Overrated As Scola?