Spurs Decline to Match Jazz Offer

[Marcus Bryant]

To recap...

The Spurs lost a talented player for nothing. That alone should give some of you pause for concern.

Secondly, they lost a talented and relatively young player at a position which is by no means locked down past this upcoming season.

Lastly, ownership has set a precedent that it is more worried about squeezing as much $ out of the team instead of plowing a little bit back in to maximize the supporting cast around TD. TD isn't going to be young forever. This is more of a 'principle of the matter' argument than just a gripe about losing Devin Brown. I want to see the Spurs make great basketball decisions.

I don't know why so many of you care so much about Holt Cat raking in more $. Maybe he has his family posting up in here now.

[wildbill2u]

No one is saying that the Spurs are going to be old THIS season. But Finley and Van Exel signed ONE YEAR DEALS and Barry will be 35 next season. So the Spurs will definitley be short of young swingmen NEXT summer.

Would anyone rather have had the Spurs NOT make the deals with NVE and Finley in order to keep Devin? If not, that is a telling description of his value to the team this coming season, ie. he's not better than Finley and/or NVE and would have ridden the bench behind them at best.

There are always young 'tweeners' who have a certain value but probably can't move into regular rotations in this league on some teams and have to bounce around between teams and sometimes between leagues and even countries. LJIII and Sato are just two examples who came through here last year.

Based on past performance including this offseason, I'm inclined to trust Pop and the FO in providing for new backups after this year.

[Sense]

This thread is a classic. MB, timvp, and Kori whining that the Spurs are not signing a 12th man for $2.5M. I thought whining about such things was GW's job. When you look at how such elite teams like Miami and Phoenix turn over half their roster, complaining about how the Spurs fill in their 12th man is just ridiculous. The Spurs have also turned over a lot of their roster in past years. Almost by definition, non-rotation slots are unstable.

I agree.

[Marcus Bryant]

It doesn't matter if Brown would've been the 7th, 12th, or 15th man next season. The Spurs just lost a valuable piece for nothing in return. That's the primary issue here. That's not a good basketball decision.

[DesiSpur_21]

IMO, losing Devin (yes..even for nothing) isn't a big deal. Yes, Spurs should've kept Devin or signed an younger SF as a reserve. I honestly think the FO tried moving Barry/Rasho to make room for Devin, but it just didn't happen. It's not like it's the end of the world. Trading Barry/Rasho is still an option going into the season to get a younger SF.

[ducks]

what this means is that devin brown is not brown's replacement
atleast spurs brass did not think so
if they thought so they would have paid the tax



I do not think brown is special like manu or tp
their are money brown's out there
not the end of the world

[Vashner]

I'll take the 2.2 million and the plane tix to Utah....

Yea ... sufferage is horrible for that low pay..

[Sense]

It doesn't matter if Brown would've been the 7th, 12th, or 15th man next season. The Spurs just lost a valuable piece for nothing in return. That's the primary issue here. That's not a good basketball decision.

You're acting like most fans after losing Malik...



Anyways, you'll see you'll get over it.

[baseline bum]

Spurs fans quickly forget what happened between 1999 and 2003. The Spurs got old and slow on the perimeter and other teams in the league, namely the Lakers, used that flaw to embarrass the team. I remember Kobe hounding Terry Porter full court and Shaq bending over Danny Ferry.

The Spurs need a young athlete at the swing position to come off the bench. Devin fit the bill.

Now this year with the addition of Finley, they can probably survive without that. But sooner than Spurs fans realize, it will become a glaring hole if the Spurs don't plug it.

Remember 2001.

2001? In 2001 the Spurs had 3 starters over 35. Right now 4/5 of the starting lineup is on the right side of 30.

You gotta build to win now, while Duncan's in his prime. Finley cost us Devin, but he gives this team a much better shot at repeating. There's no way Devin is anywhere near the talent Finley is, and the Spurs are in excellent shape to win les until they have to replace Bowen. Devin Brown is no Bruce Bowen though, and I doubt he ever will be. The only way the team is going to get a viable replacement for Bruce when the time comes is to use their MLE.

[timvp]

This thread is a classic. MB, timvp, and Kori whining that the Spurs are not signing a 12th man for $2.5M. I thought whining about such things was GW's job. When you look at how such elite teams like Miami and Phoenix turn over half their roster, complaining about how the Spurs fill in their 12th man is just ridiculous. The Spurs have also turned over a lot of their roster in past years. Almost by definition, non-rotation slots are unstable.

Whining? It's called pointing out that it'd be wise for the Spurs to roll with more than four swingman ... especially considering that two of them will be 35 next season and one of them has an expiring contract.

So you're comfortable running four swingman and surviving the very real possibility that one could *gasp* get injured? In that scenario, that'd force a player that is currently not on the team into a spot in the rotation.

If the Spurs can fill that role with a Matt Barnes or a Theron Smith, then they'd most likely just be fine even in that worst case situation.

But whatever happened to the thinking man's Spurs fan? They've gotten y and think that the Spurs will win a championship in September no matter the possible twists the season may take.

[leemajors]

if "hot pursuit" of finley is sending pop to see him in chicago while other teams sent several players, maybe i misunderstood their pursuit of him.

[timvp]

2001? In 2001 the Spurs had 3 starters over 35. Right now 4/5 of the starting lineup is on the right side of 30.

True. Yet the top two bench players in 2001 were 25 and 26 years old.

No one else is slightly worried that the Spurs have the very real possibility of having Brent Barry with a cane as the only back viable backup after this season? It's always easy to say the Spurs can go out and find a young stud to groom, but where was that young stud when Antonio Daniels was guarding Kobe Bryant?

I'm not panicking or whining, I'm just pointing out a potential flaw in the Spurs' future.

I swear, Spurs fans have turned into Laker fans.

"We have Gary Payton AND Karl Malone, WTF would we need a backup power forward? Stop whining Karl Malone is >>>>>>> Robert Horry. We are going to roll to a championship this season. The future? What is that? We don't need no young backup. "

--Laker fan circa September 2003

[TheWriter]

Viktor, Ian, Scola, Jav, drafts, and trades.

[Pistonfan1]

Pistons in 06 Marcus has given up on his Spurs. Joe Dumars>RC anyday of the week and twice on sunday. I have to admit I love watching people act like losing Devin will mean no more world les. Hey that is fine with me. Now this means that when we get our le back next year I will now hear the excuse "yeah well we didnt have Devin" crap. You guys have an old team while we have a young one. Hey guys I am cool with you saying losing Devin and signing these guys means no more les. We will get our 4th le in 2006 anyways!

[Kori Ellis]

This thread is a classic. MB, timvp, and Kori whining that the Spurs are not signing a 12th man for $2.5M. I thought whining about such things was GW's job. When you look at how such elite teams like Miami and Phoenix turn over half their roster, complaining about how the Spurs fill in their 12th man is just ridiculous. The Spurs have also turned over a lot of their roster in past years. Almost by definition, non-rotation slots are unstable.

Apparently reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. No one is whining.

I don't know what people don't see in this scenario. All we are saying is that it would have been ideal (and the Spurs think so too - thus the attempts to get a trade done) if the Spurs had been able to retain Devin.

If you are thinking only about the 2005-06 season, the Spurs are in awesome shape. If you are thinking about the future, Spurs fans are jumping the gun with their "dynasty" talk.

Next summer the swingmen will be: Bowen (35) Barry (almost 35) and Manu. They'll also have to re-sign Nazr, and they'll have no cap space. It won't be an easy summer.

I've said 10 times in this thread that I'm not "worried" about it because I know the Spurs will get it done. But you construe it as "whining". Like I said, I think the Spurs will still pick up a player now who will sit on the inactive list this season and get into the rotation next season. Hopefully they'll be able to get rid of Barry's contract next summer and then they'll be fine.

[team-work]

The argument can really last forever. Though I didn't a bit want Devin leave, I have to accept it and trust the Spurs FO anyway. Wish the controversy will not affect the chemistry of the team and sincerely hope for a prosperous season for the Spurs!

[AFE7FATMAN]

give me a break

You folks are acting like the FO is done and the roster is set in Stone.

I bet we get a 14th Guy out of Camp or a trade will happen by Christmas.

[leemajors]

yeah darko was a real steal in the draft, and letting larry brown go was a great move...

[MannyIsGod]

Marcus Bryant should realize the Spurs did not lose Devin for nothing. They lost Devin for Michael Finley.

[ploto]

The Spurs tried- even before they met with Finley- to work out a sign and trade with Devin. They tried to get him a better deal this way and also get a player in return (a true SF) but they found no takers. So, sometimes, you just let the guy go. It is true- they chose Finley over Brown. The Spurs do not see Devin as a replacement for Bowen, just as they didn't see LJIII as one either. They will continue to look for that elusive "3" and take advantage of Manu's defense to spell Bruce.

[TwoHandJam]

Like I said, I think the Spurs will still pick up a player now who will sit on the inactive list this season and get into the rotation next season. Hopefully they'll be able to get rid of Barry's contract next summer and then they'll be fine.

Bingo.

That's really all that needs to be said about this situation. A six page thread on this topic = mountain out of a mole hill.

[ploto]

He could also spend some time in the NBDL.

[froggyfroggy]

For true fans only, from [email protected]



Tom, If you haven't had a chance to send the piece to Bruce Bowen, could you please send him this version. And now that I think of it, could you please send it to the rest of the team, and anyone else you deem fit -- from Buford to Avery. I'm sure they'll all agree that Bruce deserves it. And I'm sure no one else took the time (six hours) to dramatize and chronicle his greatness in such detail. Thanks.
Jack

Spurs fans,
While all the credit is being handed out, I’d like to fill a bit of a vacuum.

There are six minutes left in the game. Tim has only one dunk and two turnovers in the quarter. We lead by three, 64-61, and neither team has scored for two minutes. I’m thinking, “We’ll be fine if we can just get the lead to six, because then they’ll probably need four possessions to beat us -- since they’ve made only one three-point shot all game.” (I later learned, when I spoke to David Robinson briefly on the phone after the game, that he’d also thought six was the key number.) “Moreover, Rasheed Wallace is the only Piston who’s scored in the period.”
Then comes the shot we’ve been waiting for. Is it Tim or Manu or Rob or Tony? No, it’s Bruce Bowen -- who hasn’t taken a single shot in the half. He hits a 3 -- and we have that six-point breathing room.
But it’s still not over. Detroit’s greatest offensive threat, Chauncey Billups, finally comes to life -- and now Detroit has two scorers. Brent Barry comes in for Bruce, immediately turns the ball over, and the lead is down to four. Bruce comes back in.
Tim is fouled with 1:02 left. If he makes both foul shots -- and we “kill clock” for two 24-second possessions -- they’ll need three baskets to send the game into overtime. But he only makes one, so they can send the game into overtime with a 3 and a 2.
Larry Brown calls time out. No coach in the league is better at running a play after a time out than he is. (After our last time out, they scored.)
Then comes the signature play of the game -- the one that best exemplifies what makes the Spurs great. Billups goes up for a 3-pointer. If he makes it, it’s a two-point game -- and they’re making that inevitable run the six-point lead was designed to protect us against.
Everyone knows you never foul a jump-shooter -- especially when he’s taking a 3; especially when the shot is being taken by a guy who gets every call; especially when you’re not known for being a shot-blocker; especially when he’s a near lock to make all three foul shots; especially when the refs know they won’t be accused of “keeping the game close” if they blow the whistle; especially when you’re playing with five fouls; especially when you’re not a super-star like Michael Jordan who gets all the calls himself.
Unless you’re Bruce Bowen -- who’s smart enough to know that only a perfect block will do. But he makes the play -- and recovers the ball.
Technically, Detroit is still in it. There’s enough time left that they don’t have to start deliberately fouling. But Bruce’s block crushed their spirit so badly that Manu can not only run 17 seconds off the clock, but he can split their defense for a game-clinching lay-up.
But that’s Bruce Bowen for you. Some players, e.g. Tayshaun Prince, are so “underrated” they become overrated. But even though Bruce is always described as underrated --and despite his getting the second most votes for Defensive Player of the Year -- he’s still underrated. And he never complains about it. Probably because he never thinks about it.
In this year’s playoffs he shut down Carmelo Anthony, Ray Allen, Shawn Marion, Rip Hamilton, and then, when it became necessary, Chauncey Billups. All this at 200 pounds -- and 34 years of age.
Last year, when Ray Allen, a personal favorite of mine, accused him of being a dirty ballplayer, I thought there must be some truth to this accusation (especially since they were close friends) -- so I started watching Bruce very carefully. The charge was completely untrue, and I no longer have any respect for Ray Allen as a person.
I’ve never seen Bruce commit a hard foul -- or a foul intended to “send a message”. I’ve never seen him commit a flagrant foul. If anything, the refs are unfairly tough on him.
He’s not a perfect coach’s dream. I’ve seen him throw a few lazy passes. But I’ve never seen him make a dumb play. So I’m willing to forgive all his offensive weaknesses -- including his poor foul shooting (which is still better than Tony Parker’s, and is basically irrelevant, since he rarely shoots any).
He plays totally within himself. He almost never turns the ball over. And he never takes a possession off.
I told David Robinson that I might have given Bruce my vote for MVP. He understood that I might have been doing so as a symbolic act, but he still said, “You’ve got a good point there.”

[Bruno]

I find you are too worried about the loss of devin. He is a great guy, good luck for him with the Jazz.

Devin is a good player not a great one. He is too short to play SF and at the SG spot we still have Manu.

For the 2005 season, Spurs could only offer him a spot on the inactive list and devin deserves 20-25 min of playtime.

For the 2006 season :

- Brent will be old, but he still can give something like 12 quality minutes a la Steve Kerr.(he is still a great shooter)

- Bowen is old and his style of play is physical but :
- He made a great season (maybe his best one), so he is not on the downside.
- He is very serious on his conditioning (have you siad iron man)
- He spent a lot of season in Europe where you have something like 35-40 games of 40 min a year . Tim plays 27000 min in nba, Bruce 17000 min.
- He will play less minutes in 2005.
Considering all these facts, bruce could play something like 20 min per games in 2006.

- Beno made a good rookie season. In 2006, he will begin his 3rd nba season. Beno played some SG with Slovenia and during the regular season. Remember he is only one inch shorter than Devin.

The rotation for the 2006 season could be something like :
PG : Tony 34, Beno 14
SG : Manu 32, Beno 10, Brent 6
SF : Bruce 20, A guy 22, Brent 6

For the missing SF, it could be :
- Finley, if his contract is one year, Spurs could give him $3M a year in 2006 without using the MLE.
- The 14th man of this season (a guy like Barnes). Spurs will probly sign a young SF to a two years minimum contract with a team option on the second year.
- A free agent signing with the MLE (Spurs will have no holes at the PG/PF/C spot the next offseason). A guy like Jumaine Jones could be the perfect cheap target.

So don't worry, be happy of the le and enjoy the le and the next season.

[DesiSpur_21]

I wouldn't say guys who are saying devin should have been re-signed are whining, but definitely they are overreacting. As Manny put it, we lost Devin for nothing - We got finley who is way better than Devin at this point.

Also, calling people who are okay with Spurs letting go Devin as Holt's nuts is uncalled for - then what do you call people who are overreacting over the whole issue? There is a high possibilty that posters here have personal acquaintance of Devin than Holt.