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Look, you want to move in next door to them. Wouldn't have Afghanistan, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Jordan, Israel, Egypt, been close enough?
Link to where I said that?
Look, you want to move in next door to them. Wouldn't have Afghanistan, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Jordan, Israel, Egypt, been close enough?
Why should I link to this thread? If we "withdraw to victory at all costs" in Kurdistan, why isn't an Islamist takeover of the rest of Iraq possbile when you say it is likely if we pull out of Iraq altogether?
Phyrrhic Victory
a victory or goal achieved at too great a cost.
[Origin: 1880–85; < Gk Pyrrikós; after a remark attributed by Plutarch to Pyrrhus, who declared, after a costly victory over the Romans, that another similar victory would ruin him]
For the 1,045,567,789,123,125,789 time...
A total pull out leaves us in no position to have any influence on anything and severely limits our military strike capability against Iran.
Leaving greater Iraq at the request of the elected government in the event of a civil war leaves us in position to gurantee ourselves a sane ally and influence the civil war in our favor.
And furthermore...a civil war leaves the Sunnis and Shias fighting against each other and further fragments Islamic unification against our country, and in fact will likely lead to one side courting our favor...either the Sunnis surrounded by enemies on all sides, or the Shias who are also surrounded by enemies on all sides, just on a bigger scale...
Influence how? By holding up signs they might be able to read across the border?Leaving greater Iraq at the request of the elected government in the event of a civil war leaves us in position to gurantee ourselves a sane ally and influence the civil war in our favor.Until someone wins. Then there could be near-complete unification against us.And furthermore...a civil war leaves the Sunnis and Shias fighting against each other and further fragments Islamic unification against our countrySo what is our stated goal in Iraq again? Civil war? Is taking sides in a civil war after working so long for a unified Iraq a good idea?and in fact will likely lead to one side courting our favor...either the Sunnis surrounded by enemies on all sides, or the Shias who are also surrounded by enemies on all sides, just on a bigger scale...
By providing one side with superior weaponry and support.
Another Shia country will further fragment them.Until someone wins. Then there could be near-complete unification against us.
To remove Saddam from power, install a popularly elected Democrat govt, and nurse it until it's capable of staying in power, done and done, the last segment requires an act of will on the Iraqis themselves, and if they order us to leave it's safe to assume they feel that has been accomplished...it won't be of course, but it becomes much easier to suppoer the Democratic autonomous region of the Kurds and still accomplish our primary aim...of course a Democratic country in the Middle East is a good thing, large or small.So what is our stated goal in Iraq again?
If it's not a unified Iraq it is...Civil war? Is taking sides in a civil war after working so long for a unified Iraq a good idea?
Which side?By providing one side with superior weaponry and support.Having a Shia Iraq next to a Shia iran fragments them?Another Shia country will further fragment them.Yeah, maybe you can end up with a Sunni strongman in power who is diametrically opposed to Iran. Oops.If it's not a unified Iraq it is...
Depends...
Yeah..because that Shia Iraq will also be right next to Saudi Arabia.Having a Shia Iraq next to a Shia iran fragments them?
Hey, as long as the Sunni strongman doesn't have designs on nukes or ruling the middle east...can't be any worse than Saddam.Yeah, maybe you can end up with a Sunni strongman in power who is diametrically opposed to Iran. Oops.
Plus gain a Democratic Kurdistan...
Depends how? They asked us to leave, didn't they?Depends...And?Yeah..because that Shia Iraq will also be right next to Saudi Arabia.How do you know he doesn't?Hey, as long as the Sunni strongman doesn't have designs on nukes or ruling the middle east...can't be any worse than Saddam.And militant Kurdish nationalist movements in four other countries. Including Turkey. Nice.Plus gain a Democratic Kurdistan...
Depends on which one is less ed up and more committed to Democracy...I'm leaning towards the Shias right now.
The Saudis don't want that...And?
Because our military will be right there on his ass to take him out if he puruses them.How do you know he doesn't?
Already exists...And militant Kurdish nationalist movements in four other countries. Including Turkey. Nice.
Thery certainly seem more committed to using democracy to facilitate ethnic cleansing. Whoever kills the most people is who you are for, admit it.Depends on which one is less ed up and more committed to Democracy...I'm leaning towards the Shias right now.And, what are they going to do about it?The Saudis don't want that...So we'll just go back in whenever we feel like it?Because our military will be right there on his ass to take him out if he puruses them.Exactly.Already exists...
Oh bull ...they didn't start the ethnic cleansing, they learned it. Sorry but to me the Sunnis are the ones ing everything up. That could change though...
Support us if the Shias should be the ones we need to take out.And, what are they going to do about it?
If need be...if it's a Sunni dictator pursuing nuclear weapons I imagine we'll have support from Iran...and whoever. Ditto Shias and Saudis...So we'll just go back in whenever we feel like it?
Divide and conquer split them...
Exactly.
Exactly is right...what, are you in a brief moment of enlightenment to where you suddenly realize the causes of all the problems in the Middle East and what it will take to fix them?
I wish that were true...alas if it were you wouldn't be arguing with me and I wouldn't be suffering because you are dense .
It's happenning and the PM isnt doing about it.Oh bull .Sudan's example has taught them quite well.they didn't start the ethnic cleansing, they learned it.It has changed once the Sunni population started getting rounded up and killed.Sorry but to me the Sunnis are the ones ing everything up. That could change though...So why ever leave? We'll be there forever anyway.If need beRight, will independent Kurditan make those movements more or less militant?Exactly is right.What, is your air conditioning out? I have trouble accepting you couldn't find any way to go out to the mideast and kill a few people even with your alleged medical condition.I wouldn't be suffering
Last edited by ChumpDumper; 10-26-2006 at 05:35 PM.
Holy , all over the place.
YOu already stated your dream. (We need to be there so we have first strike capability to hit Iran).
What the "F"? Afghanistan is not close enough.
It will never work. They will fight democracy forever. It will never be able to stand. They know why Bush is there, so they will never stop.
Bush already said it out loud. It's the oil!
Payback is a ...it's also why he won't ask us to leave.
The mountain is getting tired of coming to stupid...eventually stupid is going to have to come to the mountain.Sudan's example has taught them quite well.
Sunnis started it...It has changed once the Sunni population started getting rounded up and killed.
Um because their elected leader asks us too?So why ever leave?
And so we can sit back while they weaken each other and shut all the stupid libs over here up who thinks wars shouldn't involve death.
Ok then STFU...We'll be there forever anyway.
How do you get more militant then attempting to establish your own country?Right, will independent Kurditan make those movements more or less militant?
What, is your air conditioning out? I have trouble accepting you couldn't find any way to go out to the mideast and kill a few people even with your alleged medical condition.
And I have trouble accepting that you can't get your head stuck even further up your ass then it already is...keep trying, you can do it.
By the way, exactly what is your position on this?
Oh that's right...be for staying, but about it...I hope you and clambake don't reproduce.
Now your the mountain?
I guess I missed that Twilight Zone episode.
Go over there and show us how it's done. Your chance to be a man.
Why do you keep telling me to go over there? You belong over there with your fellow Islamofascists more than I do.....
Leave.
Get over there and fight and die for a cause you believe in and a way of life you embrace. Shut up and go.
If you believe in what amounts to a criminal invasion, then grow some balls.
You'll put everybodys ass on the line but your own. Empty gas bag.
And you'll ally yourself with the enemies of this country all the while living in it, badmouthing it, and feeding on it. Get out. Hyprocrite. Then stfu and go kneel to allah or die...pissbag. At least then you can stop living the lie.
Rascist..who makes fun of disabilities...worthless piece of .
Just get over there and kneel the kneel...
Just to further highlight the ins utional disadvantages for active duty military who oppose this war:
Army Blocking Soldiers In Iraq From Reading “Left Leaning” Websites, Conservative Website Allowed…
We realize that when it comes to freedom of the press, the USA has fallen to Number 53 in the world — tied with our fascist homies in Croatia and the islanders of the Kingdom of Tonga! — but do we have to make is so damned obvious?
Another Marine stationed in Iraq has sent us a screenshot of what happens when you need some hot news on Macaca and Foley:
forbidden, this page (http://www.wonkette.com) is categorized as (Personal Pages) ALL SITES YOU VISIT ARE LOGGED AND FILED.
Link to screenshot (hey, they use Firefox too!)
Nice little threat at the end, too. Asswipes.
Notice the other browser tabs. Two actual “personal pages” that rah-rah for Bush (What’s her name, the wannabe Coulter, and Hugh Hewitt) show up just fine, as our Marine Operative confirms. But “Talking Points Memo,” which is apparently one of the “left leaning” sites one hears so much about these days, is prohibited.
Writes the Corporal: “I think that this kind of censoring is a big deal. I can understand blocking porn, music and movies, and blatantly illegal sites, but blocking sites that some higher up just doesn’t agree with is disgusting. They are blocking a huge portion of voters from information that will help them determine which side to vote for. Because of this, the only news we get is from the big corporations or conservative based sites.”
Yeah, well, if it's on the internet, it must be true.
Hey whottttt. What disability? The one where you sink to the level of manure? Having reached your zenith and finding you are left with nothing makes you throw out the "your a racist" card? Look up the word degenerate for self examination. When your rants are exposed as nonsense, you resort to rancid insults. Adolescent.
I suspect your true disability is that your a tiny, bitter man that suffers from Neopoleon Syndrom, which must be quite the conundrum considering how much you hate the French.
So you aupport ethnic cleansing and genocide when it meets your childhood "he started it" logic. No surprise.But what if the Islamists take over then? Oh that's right, we'll be in a better position to fight them once we're not there anymore.Um because their elected leader asks us too?Yeah, you say divide and conquer. It's good to know conquest and permanent military presence in Iraq is your goal.And so we can sit back while they weaken each other and shut all the stupid libs over here up who thinks wars shouldn't involve death.Fascist.Ok then STFU...You start blowing more up and killing more people, that's how, idiot.How do you get more militant then attempting to establish your own country?Aw, hit a nerve did I? There are hundreds of ways to serve over there. You just wanted the one that gave you a gun and the opportunity to kill.And I have trouble accepting that you can't get your head stuck even further up your ass then it already is...keep trying, you can do it.Nope it's always been to find a face saving way out so they can get on with the business of genocide that will undoubtedly happen. You've just been to stupid to understand it. We ed up in Iraq big time, and I will never stop ing about that, nor should I, since I was right and idiots like you were wrong. Our mission was NOT accomplished in Afghanistan and Pakistan and now likely never will because idiots like you got tricked into supporting this stupid war that only made things worse in both theaters while at the same time making the worldwide support we enjoyed after 9/11 evaporate.By the way, exactly what is your position on this?
Oh that's right...be for staying, but about it...I hope you and clambake don't reproduce.
Congratulations.
So you're a pedophile?
It's good to know you're a sex offender.It's good to know conquest and permanent military presence in Iraq is your goal.
Hallucinatist.Fascist.
You start blowing more up and killing more people, that's how, idiot.
Is this before or after you molest children?
And you just want to cornhole small children and animials.Aw, hit a nerve did I? There are hundreds of ways to serve over there. You just wanted the one that gave you a gun and the opportunity to kill.
Nope it's always been to find a face saving way out so they can get on with the business of genocide that will undoubtedly happen.
Yeah because ing fixes it...We ed up in Iraq big time, and I will never stop ing about that, nor should I, since I was right and idiots like you were wrong.
And it's idiots like you that cause child crime.Our mission was NOT accomplished in Afghanistan and Pakistan and now likely never will because idiots like you got tricked into supporting this stupid war that only made things worse in both theaters while at the same time making the worldwide support we enjoyed after 9/11 evaporate.
Back at ya...Congratulations.
Come back when you get done with the kids...
Wow arguing on your level is hard.
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