Well, I would argue that Conservatives and Liberals share the stupid moniker quite well.
But, if the best reasoning you bring to way the appeals process produced the same results, even when placed in front of conservative judges, is stupidity, then I think you've made my case that much stronger.
Well, it hasn't exactly produced the same results. On two previous occassions the decision to allow Mrs. Schiavo to die has been reversed, on appeal, and the feeding tube re-inserted.
My question is this. Why is the husband so intent on seeing this through when he's obviously moved on in every other aspect of his life?
Because he sincerly believes that this is what his wife would have wanted?
And as I pointed out early today, regardless of what the husband wishes now, the courts have made their rulings and they are operating off of Terri's wishes, not her husbands.
good point, although from reading a few posts im not sure everyone seems to understand what this means. heres an example...if a person prosecutes another for a crime, and the charged party gets found guilty and goes to prison, the prosecuting party can't all of a sudden say "hey, i forgive the guy, go ahead and let him out of jail"...its not in his hands anymore, its in the justice systems.And as I pointed out early today, regardless of what the husband wishes now, the courts have made their rulings and they are operating off of Terri's wishes, not her husbands.
Schiavo's Parents File New Appeal
1 hour, 7 minutes ago Top Stories - AP
By JILL BARTON, Associated Press Writer
TAMPA, Fla. - Warning that Terri Schiavo was "fading quickly" and might die at any moment, her parents begged a federal appeals court Tuesday to order the severely brain-damaged woman's feeding tube reinserted.
AP Photo
AFP
Slideshow: Terri Schiavo Right-to-Die Case
Judge Won't Order Reinsertion of Feeding Tube
(AP Video)
David Gibbs III, attorney for parents Bob and Mary Schindler, told the 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals (news - web sites) in Atlanta that the 41-year-old woman might die before they could get a chance to fully argue their case that her rights are being violated. The appeal came after a federal judge in Tampa rejected the parents' emergency request.
"Where, as here, death is imminent, it is hard to imagine more critical and exigent cir stances," Gibbs said in the appeal filed electronically with the court. "Terri is fading quickly and her parents reasonably fear that her death is imminent."
There was no immediate indication of when the appeals court might rule.
Even before the parents' appeal was filed, the woman's husband urged the 11th Circuit not to grant an emergency request to restore nutrition.
"That would be a horrific intrusion upon Mrs. Schiavo's personal liberty," said the filing by Michael Schiavo's attorney, George Felos. He filed a response to the Schindlers' appeal and said he would go to the U.S. Supreme Court (news - web sites) if the tube were ordered reconnected.
I agree this is a waste of time.
Death with a smile!
I would suggest that somebody whose position is to throw out the system of laws, and ignore federalism, the democratic process, and the Cons ution, because they feel the results are morally wrong, should be careful about throwing that "Liberal" moniker around.
It seems the Republican Party has been overrun by a Christian fundamentalist version of bleeding-heart liberalism.
If that were true, he would have demanded she be allowed to die 15 years ago when she entered her current physical condition. Instead, he waited seven years before deciding to be "sincere" about what his wife would have wanted. That doesn't add up.
No one knows what here wishes are.
But, it appears her fate is sealed...so, further debate would amount to euthanizing a dead horse. I say we yank the feeding tube on this subject altogether.
Isn't it fortunate Terri's loving husband suddenly remembered a conversation they had years ago, in which she said, "If I ever have a heart attack and suffer severe brain damage, I'd like to be slowly starved to death. Pass the bacon, please." But what if Michael Schiavo was out of the room when she made such a request? Who would fight for Terri Schiavo's right to die then? Who would protect her from unscrupulous doctors who wrap themselves in the Hippocratic Oath, seeking only to prolong the life of the ill and infirm?
Compassionate caregivers must always err on the side of Death with Dignity when the patient's true wishes are uncertain, and they should be able to do so with a clear conscience. Once health care is nationalized and medical resources are strictly rationed, a progressive doctor-assisted suicide program such as Oregon's will become a vital tool for keeping hospital beds open for those who truly need it. Religious extremists who are still hung up on all that "sanc y of human life" crap will be encouraged to draft a "Living Will" - a notarized do ent specifying their sincere desire to inconvenience doctors, loved ones, and society itself by remaining alive for another 40 years. This "Living Will" could be printed on a wallet-sized card that one would present to their doctor or dentist, explicity stating "I'm a Quaker. Due to my antiquated religious beliefs, I politely request that I not be euthanized on this visit. Yes, I know I have hallitosis that can kill a bull moose at 50 yards, but I'd like to pointlessly linger on for a few more years anyway, if you don't mind."
Once we free caregivers from the constrictive binds of guesswork and legal roadblocks, we can look forward to a bright future where the euthanization of undesirables is as natural, beautiful, and merciful as terminating unwanted pregnancies.
One of the best replies I've read on any subject in a long time. Well done.
I am all for that. The debate is at a stalemate here.I say we yank the feeding tube on this subject altogether.
My mother-in-law made an interesting point. This was caused by bulimia. Looking at it from the same point of view as that (vanity), would she want people to be seeing her as she looks now? Shallow, of course, but an interesting theory...
Sure, if you ignore the facts on the case.
They are there! I suggest anyone here who hasn't, read the actual judgement of the first case.
Immediately after her injury, a reasonable person might hold out hope for recovery. By the time several years passed, that hope would have passed.
In any regard, he allowed the state to determine based upon the available evidence what her wishes would have been.
If the people of the state of Florida feel the current laws with regard to medical decisions are not sufficiently weighted in favor of life, then they should change them. However, our Cons ution does not allow ex post facto laws, so they can not apply to Terry Schiavo.No one knows what here wishes are.
If activists believe that the rule of law should be put aside in this case in order to preserve Terry Schiavo's life, then that is their opinion. So be it. But in that case the Christian pro-life movement can no longer be called politically conservative according to any definition that has been accepted since the days of FDR. Bypassing the rule of law because some think it is morally wrong, rather than changing the law, is the crux of what conservatives have disliked about bleeding-heart liberalism.
So, what I observe is that today the Christian right is best described as a socially conservative, politically bleeding-heart liberal, big-government political movement, similar to the old Southern Democrats.
And since that group is preeminent in the Republican Party, then the conservative movement is in decline.
True conservativism has been gone for a while now. This is simply the final realization of how far the neocons have strayed.
A different issue...
It seems there was a concerted attempt to deny Terri her religious freedom. According to these articles....
You make the call.
Terri Schiavo Denied Last Communion
Why Was Terri Denied Holy Communion?
Will Terri Again be Denied Communion?
Not cool at all.
Manny, I'm not looking to hijack this thread...this sort of thing deserves its own.
But this sort of thing also fuels my recent comments about the judiciary.
Old articles, I assume. two catholic priests attended the session where her tube was removed and gave communion. Will dig up the articles when I get a chance...
See, thats what I thought. I thought she was given communion through the tube before it was removed.
One of those is recent.
Also, how do you give communion through the feeding tube? That question was asked in one of those articles.
I have no idea man, but it was my understanidng a priest was there to bless it and do the whole 9 yards.
I could be wrong, I'm not sure.
http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/18/sc...brain-damaged/
The tube was disconnected about 1:45 p.m., George Felos, Michael Schiavo's attorney, told reporters. Friday's medical procedure was the third time the tube had been disconnected from the 41-year-old woman.
Present were her doctor, a number of other health care providers and a representative of her husband and guardian, Felos said. He said Terri Schiavo, who is Roman Catholic, received the sacrament of Communion from a ho e priest before the tube was disconnected.
"I am told that it was an emotional occasion. Prayers were said at the time, and the feeding tube was disconnected," Felos told reporters. "Mr. Schiavo currently is with his wife, at her bedside."
"It was a very calm, peaceful procedure," he said.
nevermind.
It would not surprise me that they messed up the article.
However, the Eucharist is often included with the administering of the Anointing of the Sick. And, when the patient is lucid (not a player here), Reconciliation is also offered.
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