Trouble in Crawford: "Why did my son die?"

[MannyIsGod]

Why pick on brown people when you can pick on gay people instead?

[whottt]

Well thats ing dandy. If you're trying to use that as an arguement that Republicans are pro minoirty, I'm going to laugh because thats one of a good joke.

I don't care what they did 40 years ago, I care what they do now. And well, both of the parties exploit minorities and then forget about them.

And I've never exactly seen the Republicans accused of pandering to get the minority vote...that's the reason they get the racist label...

The Democrats switched from being anti-minority to portraying themselves as pro-minority...they have a history of playing race favorites...

The Republicans don't have a history of playing any kind of race favorites...but they do have a history of being against slavery and segregation....they have a history of promoting equal rights, not preferential rights...The Democrats are the ones that use minorities and they always have been, one way or another....

I realize they aren't the same ones as 40 years ago...but it's just funny that the Republicans have the racist label, when they have done to more to bring racial equality to this country while the Democrats have usually been opposed to it...it's just ironic.

But hey, as long as they tell you what you want to hear right?

And it's so easy to portray those conservative, whitebread, god-fearing Americans as the racists...when their major crime is not being image saavy..

[MannyIsGod]

You've never seen Republicans pandering to the minority vote? Give me a ing break. You're turning into Minivore here.

[whottt]

whottt, I think you're doing yourself a disservice by equating liberal with Democrat and conservative with Republican - especially within historical context.

Republicans have never been liberals, they have always been conservative...Democrats used to be more conservative...but they have always been considered the liberal party of the two.

Well people like to say the parties switched platforms in the 1960's...but that's not what really occured..the Democrats just went from being anti-minority, to pro-minority(in words) I call it a PR move...

And the white supremacists started jumping to the Republican side, not because they were racist...but because they weren't pro minority...

But the ultra religious conservatives WERE the ones against slavery, and even though they weren't de-segregationists...they ended up being the first to de-segregate as well.


And what do you guys mean brown people?

Mexicans have never been discriminated against in this country like Blacks...there was never a color barrier against Mexicans....yeah if they looked black there was...but it had nothing to do with what country they were from.

There was never color barrier against Mexicans in pro sports...they were never slaves in this country...

the Aztecs had enslaved every native tribe in Central America...

There is a whole world of difference between blacks and mexicans having minority status...Mexicans owned land in Texas from forever...those that fought against Mexico got to keep their lands.

Even native North American Indians never faced the descrimination blacks did.

[MannyIsGod]

Yeah, tell that to members of my family who were discriminated against in much the same way blacks were. Tell them it didn't happen. I would LOVE to see that.

[whottt]

You've never seen Republicans pandering to the minority vote? Give me a ing break. You're turning into Minivore here.

No I haven't...which is why they don't get it...and get the label of being the racist party. I mean it just depends on who the voting base is...

[whottt]

Yeah, tell that to members of my family who were discriminated against in much the same way blacks were. Tell them it didn't happen. I would LOVE to see that.

By the government? Or just people in general? You can't make people like other people they don't want to like.

And in general..people are going to be racists and have a preference for their own race....You will never beat that...you will damn sure never beat it by bonding together with racial bonds.

You know there is a restaurant here in Austin called Matt's El Rancho...

I was in a crew of the first white waiters to work for that restaurant in it's 25 years of existence....and belive me...I got a good healthy dose of what it feels like to be discriminated against.

But still not like the blacks...like when ole Matt Martinez made me write down on an aplication that a guy that came in and applied for a job was black.


Tell me it doesn't happy Manny...it's not a white or a mexican or a black thing...it's a people thing....it's a mankind thing...races discriminate against other races.

Don't even get me started on when I worked for some Koreans....



But the blacks were ing enslaved and not allowed equality...government sanctioned racism...it's not the same thing.

[MannyIsGod]

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_ho.../24517116.html
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05196/538309.stm
http://www.sptimes.com/2004/07/11/Wo...s_to_del.shtml
http://www.freenewmexican.com/news/2391.html

Took me about 1 minute. But you know, who really comes to mind when I think of a specific instance of a republican trying to pander to a minority?

George P. Bush.

[JoeChalupa]

whottt, I think you're doing yourself a disservice by equating liberal with Democrat and conservative with Republican - especially within historical context.

Great point. I'm conservative on issues like national security, strengthening our borders and the war on terrorism. But liberal on social issues, civil liberties (yes, I truly am), the environment.

So basically I'm just myself but will still tend to vote democrat.

[Vashner]

I got an idea... don't join the army if you don't want to fight...

There are plenty of jobs that will pay you the same money or more.. or go to school.

[whottt]

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_ho.../24517116.html
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05196/538309.stm
http://www.sptimes.com/2004/07/11/Wo...s_to_del.shtml
http://www.freenewmexican.com/news/2391.html

Took me about 1 minute. But you know, who really comes to mind when I think of a specific instance of a republican trying to pander to a minority?

George P. Bush.

W is pro Mexican...it's not a pandering thing...that's the way he is. Doesn't he have brother in Law that's Mexican? Or maybe it's Cuban.

The mother er is in trouble with his own party, and Democrats for his stance on the border. What you think is pandering is actually a genuine voter base whose support he seeks...my guess is because Mexicans are mostly catholic and actually have very conservative religious beliefs...on top of that a lot of Mexican immigrants buy heavily into the patriotic aspect of this country.

After September 11th when I went to SA to take a physical to join the Army...100% of the guys trying out for the Marines in my recruit class were Mexicans.

No I think there is a legimate political base there among the Mexican American community, and to a lesser extent the hispanic community, that has a similar ideology to the conservative mindset...and that's why W seeks it...I don't see him changing anything on his conservative views to get that vote..His border stance is very liberal...but I think that's got more to do with business and cheap labor than it does with vote pandering. In short I don't think he's just trying to tell people what they want to hear to get votes...I don't see him promising preferential treatment....the true definition of pandering. And you can't even claim Reagan was a race panderer.

[MannyIsGod]

I highlighted the P on purpose.

[whottt]

I still don't get it. P for Pro?


Edit: The thing is...pandering works...if W were doing it, he'd be a of a lote more popular than he is....He's an asshole...not a panderer.

[JoeChalupa]

I got an idea... don't join the army if you don't want to fight...

There are plenty of jobs that will pay you the same money or more.. or go to school.

I saw a bumper sticker the other day that said...
"My son is serving in Iraq so yours can be in college."

[Guru of Nothing]

3.Those who act like it's a virtue to render themselves irrelevant, and enjoy their view from the peanut gallery(IE the sidelines)

[MannyIsGod]

That is the name of his hispanic nephew that campaigns with him all the damn time. The Bush's love to recyle names. It's one big family of George and Barbaras.

And the main group behind Bush's border plans and forgien worker program is the lobby that stands to benefit from the continued use of cheap labor. He plays it up to be a liberal way to appease hispanic voters, but thats not the driving force behind it.

[Dos]

didn't bush get like almost 50 percent of hispanic vote this last election.. I think his numbers with hispanics was pretty high.... someone can look it up.. I would be interested in knowing... plus being a hispanic male... I voted for W....

[MannyIsGod]

I still don't get it. P for Pro?


Edit: The thing is...pandering works...if W were doing it, he'd be a of a lote more popular than he is....He's an asshole...not a panderer.

He got a lot more of the Hispanic vote (nearly half) and saw an increase in black votes as well. So pandering does indeed work.

[MannyIsGod]

didn't bush get like almost 50 percent of hispanic vote this last election.. I think his numbers with hispanics was pretty high.... someone can look it up.. I would be interested in knowing... plus being a hispanic male... I voted for W....

Yes, he got nearly half, 44%

[JoeChalupa]

This hispanic male voted for Kerry.

[whottt]

That doesn't mean he was pandering...Pandering is promising preferential treatment. I never saw him do it.

And I don't think he ever tried to pass off his border stance as liberal...he pretty much says it's for cheap labor. And that's probably a popular POV with big business here in Texas.

I just think the Democratic Party got too liberal for some minorities...

He damn sure wasn't pandering to the gay vote now was he?

[MannyIsGod]

Joe sometimes reminds me of those "bots" that you can talk to on the internet but inevitably end up repeating things over and over. In Joe's case, that he voted for Kerry and has conservative feelings as well as liberal feelings which is why he considers himself a Democrat with the ocassional Semper Fi! thrown in for good measure.

[MannyIsGod]

No, everyone hates the gays.

[Nbadan]

Something's In The Air/But Its Not On The Airwaves

[Nbadan]

Day 6:

Bush gets first look at anti-war protest near ranch
By Patricia Wilson
Reuters
Friday, August 12, 2005; 1:16 PM

CRAWFORD, Texas (Reuters) - President Bush got his first look at an anti-war vigil near his ranch on Friday as his motorcade took him by the protest site lined with small white crosses representing fallen American soldiers in Iraq.

When Bush's black sport utility vehicle carried him past the site to a Republican fund-raiser, the protest leader, Cindy Sheehan, whose son was one of the nearly 1,850 U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq, held up a sign that said: "Why do you make time for donors and not for me?"

Other signs said: "Iraq is Arabic for Vietnam" and "Bring Them Home Now." Some protesters held up white crosses as well.

Well, it only took 6 days and a Republican fundraiser to get W to even drive by Cindy Sheehan, now if they can only get him to stop.

The protest vigil began last Saturday and is being led by Sheehan, who has been demanding a meeting with Bush to discuss her opposition to the Iraq war.