So if Danny's gone, the contingency plan is ?????

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Belli is the in house solution.

[Chinook]

In 2009-10 when the Spurs played the Suns in the second of the playoffs they were swept because they had shooters. Unfortunately, on their pick and roll offense the bigs were Duncan, Bonner, and McDyess. None of these bigs were good at going to rim after setting a pick. The suns knew this and all of their players just collapse on D and protect lane. This made it diffficult for Parker and Manu to get to basket. When Parker or Manu made a pass to the three point line Suns defenders could challenge shot because they knew that the Spurs were not athletic enough to get to rim. It's a different defensive mindset when you are challenging a shot and have to worry about your player driving to basket. Defending the three is easy as you do not have to chop your steps.

They were swept because no one could guard Nash or Amare. The Spurs were such a paper tiger back then, because their defense was awful (comparatively) and Tim was on the downslope of his career (we thought). You're right that without penetration, shooters won't be open. But the Spurs' guards don't consistently beat their guys off the dribble anymore. The only reason why it works out for them as often as it does is because the other perimeter defenders can't help off the shooters.

Green and Kawhi funneling players to Duncan is taking a risk as most players are taught not to leave baseline open. Spurs players are often taught the opposite. Green is often on the offensive players hip at a right angle which is not the way players are taught. AGain this is because of spurs defensive schemes and Duncan. Other teams except for Memphis and Chicago just do not have the same team defense mindset.

"No baseline" hasn't been standard defensive technique in a while now. The new phrase is "No Middle". But funneling to the short corner, Green and Leonard effectively trap their guy on three sides. In front of them is Duncan, on one side is the baseline and on the other is the defender. That makes much more sense than allowing middle where the shot-blocker has to guard both sides at once and where the drop-off pass to the big is easier to make. I have no idea who you think allows middle now, but no one who has a good defensive system does.

[apalisoc_9]

Why am I not surprised the biggest Danny hater is a Tony parker fan...

[baseline bum]

Less than $10 million a season for Green isn't happening with the cap getting ready to hit $108 million in two years. I could give a between $8 million and $12 million, they both will cost the Spurs the same amount of capspace the way they have everything set up. If the Spurs lose Green I really don't see them being any better than a 5 or 6 seed next year, we'll be going back to the days of Roger Mason and Richard Jefferson where opposing guards will on the team every night.

[tmtcsc]

It's not. Green is going to get offer(s) of at least $10 Million per, maybe more.

Take a look at his numbers the last time he was an UFA. They aren't dramatically different. Of course he completely shat the bed against OKC in the WCF which didn't help things for himself.

(2011-2012): 23 min, 9.1 ppg, 43.6 3FG%, 3.5 Rebs., .7 blks, .9 steals

(2014-2015): 28.5 min, 11. 7 ppg, 41.8 3FG%, 4.2 Rebs., 1.1 blks, 1.2 steals

Can you really justify tripling his salary?

[ducks]

Green will get more then tp
Cuban will do that after loosing alridge to spurs

[baseline bum]

- Among wing players(3000+ poss or more, so excluding end of bench guys), there were only 5 of them with a DRAPM of 2+, Green being one of them..

Of those 5, Green was the only player to shoot 40%+ from 3-point range..

- Among all rotation wing players, Green was #6 in the NBA in ISO defense, and had the best 3-point % of anybody in the top percentile of the list..

- Only 6 perimeter players had a DBPM over 2, this year: Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Tony Allen, Nic Batum, Antetokoumpo and Russell Westbrook

- Only 1 player in the NBA(eligible, statistically, Pau Gasol and Zeller did it too on limited 3 attempts) shot 40% from 3 and had a DBPM over 2: Danny Green

- 6 players in the NBA averaged 1 BPG and 1 SPG last season: Demarcus Cousins, Anthony Davis, Draymond Green, Nerlens Noel, Josh Smith and Danny Green..only 1 of those guys is a wing player, and only 1 of those guys shot 40% from 3

- Danny Green was the 8th player in NBA history to average 1 BPG/SPG and >150 3s in a season

- Players in the NBA that had a VORP over 4, this year: Curry, Harden, Westbrook, Paul, Lebron, Anthony Davis, Lillard, Marc Gasol, DeAndre Jordan, Draymond Green, Jimmy Butler, Tim Duncan, Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green

Among those players, only Curry, Chris Paul and Danny Green shot 40% from 3


Not sure in what universe that's replaceable with somebody on a lesser salary, tbh..only Kawhi and Duncan are more irreplaceable on this team..you can find a Parker on virtually every team in the NBA, Manu is tough to replicate but he's going to be on a minutes restriction, and while Splitter would be tough to replace, his injury history is troublesome..

Damn Harlem with the uppercut out of nowhere, delivering the TKO in the first.

[dbestpro]

The solution might be moving Leonard to SG and Anderson to SF. You then get a vet backup SF to spot fill when/if Anderson falters. It might be easier to find a defensive SF than a defensive SG, and no one would be better than who we already have.

[Agloco]

- Among wing players(3000+ poss or more, so excluding end of bench guys), there were only 5 of them with a DRAPM of 2+, Green being one of them..

Of those 5, Green was the only player to shoot 40%+ from 3-point range..

- Among all rotation wing players, Green was #6 in the NBA in ISO defense, and had the best 3-point % of anybody in the top percentile of the list..

- Only 6 perimeter players had a DBPM over 2, this year: Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Tony Allen, Nic Batum, Antetokoumpo and Russell Westbrook

- Only 1 player in the NBA(eligible, statistically, Pau Gasol and Zeller did it too on limited 3 attempts) shot 40% from 3 and had a DBPM over 2: Danny Green

- 6 players in the NBA averaged 1 BPG and 1 SPG last season: Demarcus Cousins, Anthony Davis, Draymond Green, Nerlens Noel, Josh Smith and Danny Green..only 1 of those guys is a wing player, and only 1 of those guys shot 40% from 3

- Danny Green was the 8th player in NBA history to average 1 BPG/SPG and >150 3s in a season

- Players in the NBA that had a VORP over 4, this year: Curry, Harden, Westbrook, Paul, Lebron, Anthony Davis, Lillard, Marc Gasol, DeAndre Jordan, Draymond Green, Jimmy Butler, Tim Duncan, Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green

Among those players, only Curry, Chris Paul and Danny Green shot 40% from 3


Not sure in what universe that's replaceable with somebody on a lesser salary, tbh..only Kawhi and Duncan are more irreplaceable on this team..you can find a Parker on virtually every team in the NBA, Manu is tough to replicate but he's going to be on a minutes restriction, and while Splitter would be tough to replace, his injury history is troublesome..

WTF can't you post cogent like this all the time Halem? I long for the good old days......

[Agloco]

What's the feasibility of setting up a scaling salary for Verde like 8, 10, ,12, 14 mil in successive seasons? Is that allowed? What do our resident salary experts say?

[manufan10]

I hope DG will re-sign with the Spurs, but if he decides to leave for more money I can't blame him.

[manufan10]

WTF can't you post cogent like this all the time Halem? I long for the good old days......

[raybies]

The solution might be moving Leonard to SG and Anderson to SF. You then get a vet backup SF to spot fill when/if Anderson falters. It might be easier to find a defensive SF than a defensive SG, and no one would be better than who we already have.

Good point. And Leonard would eat two guards up.

[coachmac87]

You're ing re ed if you're willing to pass on LMA for Green/Splitter...the biggest deal about signing LMA is not about next year. It's about the post Duncan era. Period.

[G-Dawgg]

It would be very interesting to see how well Kawhi could do playing the off guard position...

[Shabazz]

Trade for Reggie Bullock. He is getting no playing time for the Suns (similar to Danny in Cleveland.). He is a 3-and-D guy. He isn't the shotblocker Danny is. But hey, the last time Pop and Roy Williams collaborated on a similar player it worked out well.

[cutewizard]

Just brainstorming

Get Nocioni and move Kawhi to the offguard spot

hehehehehe

[wildchild]

Also, I don't understand why people seem to want Kawhi to be the only wing defender on the team..half this forum(myself included) has complained about his offensive role, yet some of you want him to exert all his energy on defense, next season(which would be the case if Green is gone)?

Maybe that's Pop plan. Having Kawhi playing D and give Lamarcus and Tony all the touches they need to be effective on the offensive end.

I've said before that the only reason for Kawhi's offensive emergence was Parker's injury/low performance.
Even Leonard said Pop let him do more on the floor in march and april rather than limit him as he used to do.

The Spurs will revive the 1-4 pick and roll with the starting lineup, plus Aldridge will take 20 FGA per game -he needs 19.9 to score 23ppg-, healthy Parker needs 14/15 FGA to score 17 points, and with Spurs' pace, there is no way that Kawhi can have an offensive role on the team.
His offense will return to his 2012-13 status, some fast break points from steals and occasional corner 3's.

Thinking long term, I'd like to see Pop sacrificing a little bit Parker's role in order to continue developing Leonard's game but that never gonna happen.

[tmtcsc]

- Among wing players(3000+ poss or more, so excluding end of bench guys), there were only 5 of them with a DRAPM of 2+, Green being one of them..

Of those 5, Green was the only player to shoot 40%+ from 3-point range..

- Among all rotation wing players, Green was #6 in the NBA in ISO defense, and had the best 3-point % of anybody in the top percentile of the list..

- Only 6 perimeter players had a DBPM over 2, this year: Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Tony Allen, Nic Batum, Antetokoumpo and Russell Westbrook

- Only 1 player in the NBA(eligible, statistically, Pau Gasol and Zeller did it too on limited 3 attempts) shot 40% from 3 and had a DBPM over 2: Danny Green

- 6 players in the NBA averaged 1 BPG and 1 SPG last season: Demarcus Cousins, Anthony Davis, Draymond Green, Nerlens Noel, Josh Smith and Danny Green..only 1 of those guys is a wing player, and only 1 of those guys shot 40% from 3

- Danny Green was the 8th player in NBA history to average 1 BPG/SPG and >150 3s in a season

- Players in the NBA that had a VORP over 4, this year: Curry, Harden, Westbrook, Paul, Lebron, Anthony Davis, Lillard, Marc Gasol, DeAndre Jordan, Draymond Green, Jimmy Butler, Tim Duncan, Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green

Among those players, only Curry, Chris Paul and Danny Green shot 40% from 3


Not sure in what universe that's replaceable with somebody on a lesser salary, tbh..only Kawhi and Duncan are more irreplaceable on this team..you can find a Parker on virtually every team in the NBA, Manu is tough to replicate but he's going to be on a minutes restriction, and while Splitter would be tough to replace, his injury history is troublesome..

All those wonderful stats equaled a 1st round loss in the playoffs.

[tmtcsc]

You're ing re ed if you're willing to pass on LMA for Green/Splitter...the biggest deal about signing LMA is not about next year. It's about the post Duncan era. Period.

Drops mic. Well said.

[Chinook]

All those wonderful stats equaled a 1st round loss in the playoffs.

Also equalled three deep playoff runs. What a ty comeback.

[tmtcsc]

Also equalled three deep playoff runs. What a ty comeback.

Danny Green had a solid year but you are over-valuing his contributions. Kawhi Leonard had more to do with those 3 deep playoff runs imo. I'd love for Green to stay a Spur but not at 3 times his current salary and not if it costs the Spurs a chance to get an All-Star PF. Tim won't be here much longer.

[Chinook]

Danny Green had a solid year but you are over-valuing his contributions. Kawhi Leonard had more to do with those 3 deep playoff runs imo. I'd love for Green to stay a Spur but not at 3 times his current salary and not if it costs the Spurs a chance to get an All-Star PF. Tim won't be here much longer.

Do you not see how hypocritical your stance is? Green was absolutely elite during his time as a starter, and you're trying to dismiss his impact last season by saying the Spurs didn't make it out of the first round. Yet you're so keen to sacrifice him for Aldridge, who's been out of the first round once in my memory. So who cares if he's an All-Star if he can't even take his team to the semis on a regular basis? Why is that worth sacrificing any of a championship core for?

Again, though, it's been demonstrated that you CAN'T expect to replace Green's production with a journeyman any more than you can replace LMA's. By most educated accounts, Green is top-five at his position in terms of overall impact, and you just aren't going to get any near that for the min guys through whom the Spurs would have to pick if they let Green walk. Also, Green's cap hold is all that matters in terms of being able to sign LMA, so if you're willing to pay Green $8 Million, paying him $12 Million is functionally the same thing.

If it's so important to get a younger big like Aldridge that the Spurs have to sacrifice a rotation player to do it, it simply makes more sense that that player be a big (preferably Diaw). Letting Green walk with no way of replacing him is foolish. As far as the future goes, the Spurs will have max cap space in 2016 anyway, so it's not like they couldn't go for a free agent then.

[tmtcsc]

Do you not see how hypocritical your stance is? Green was absolutely elite during his time as a starter, and you're trying to dismiss his impact last season by saying the Spurs didn't make it out of the first round. Yet you're so keen to sacrifice him for Aldridge, who's been out of the first round once in my memory. So who cares if he's an All-Star if he can't even take his team to the semis on a regular basis? Why is that worth sacrificing any of a championship core for?

Again, though, it's been demonstrated that you CAN'T expect to replace Green's production with a journeyman any more than you can replace LMA's. By most educated accounts, Green is top-five at his position in terms of overall impact, and you just aren't going to get any near that for the min guys through whom the Spurs would have to pick if they let Green walk. Also, Green's cap hold is all that matters in terms of being able to sign LMA, so if you're willing to pay Green $8 Million, paying him $12 Million is functionally the same thing.

If it's so important to get a younger big like Aldridge that the Spurs have to sacrifice a rotation player to do it, it simply makes more sense that that player be a big (preferably Diaw). Letting Green walk with no way of replacing him is foolish. As far as the future goes, the Spurs will have max cap space in 2016 anyway, so it's not like they couldn't go for a free agent then.

We're not going to agree. You prefer keeping DG over getting Aldridge correct? It's my opinion that there are more shooting guards with the potential to replace Danny's contributions than there are elite bigs to replace Tim's. I also think the Spurs need to replace Splitter. Not because he sucks, but because he is prone to freakish injuries. He's a bargain as far as contracts go but what good is that if you can't count on him? So that leaves a huge void in the front court in the next couple of years.

If you want to build for the future AND stay in the hunt for a le next year, you bring in Aldridge if you can. Otherwise, you sign Danny to market value and look for Tim's replacement next year. Here's a list of potential free agents in 2016. Its not 100% accurate because some players (like David West) are opting to become free agents this year.

http://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/2016/


2016 Potential SG Free Agents (In no particular order):

1. Joe Johnson
2. Eric Gordon
3. Bradley Beal
4. Jeremy Lamb

[littlecoyotecoin]

Spurs defense before Green was a full-time starter:

2011: 11th
2012: 10th

That system, though..

Not sure if serious. That's, pretty much, meaningless. Moving up one slot is almost definitely not statistically significant, which bolsters the argument that Green isn't the defender you, Chinook and others claim. I don't necessarily believe that; I think he is a very good defender, but the team moving up a slot when he became a starter would almost definitely fall under the grey area of random error. Essentially no change in defensive rank when Green starts. Definitely more convincing evidence out there than that.

He is a very good 3/D guy, and I hope we can keep him. But, if he commands too much in the free market, his negatives, inability to create off the dribble, and a propensity for turnovers and bad shots when he attempts to create off the dribble equaling same (turnover), and other Danny Green moments, must become more scrutinized as his commanded salary continues to increase.

When he is compared to Neal, etc, salary must be considered...we are talking 4 million for a Neal maybe, and as much as 10-15 million for Danny. Of course Danny is better than Neal, the question is, is he ten million dollars better? And, Neal is just a random example. Same question for any replacement.

Bottom line is he wins out over Tiago (IMHO) because Tiago is no longer reliable. As others point out. Green is less of a gamble. We know what we are getting. With Tiago, you may end up with almost nothing all season, or at the most inopportune time. Better to gamble on an inferior Tiago replacement than an inferior Green replacement. Even an inferior Tiago replacement is far superior to no Tiago, or even limited Tiago.

A curious question to the Danny-Gree-can-do-no-wrong camp, and he was always a "great" player: At what price is Danny Green not worth keeping?

Most seem to agree 10 seems fair. I don't see a whole lot of Danny Green is unappreciated. A small handful of people say let him walk, but only based on the premise that he gets offered a ridiculous amount.

Chinook, do we pay him $15 million? 20?