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  1. #151
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    I really don't care about it one way or the other. Conservatives are the ones defining selective genocide. You don't find that interesting?
    If you say so. I'll bet you have no good examples.

  2. #152
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    Here's a couple articles on the genocide thing and part of the articles:

    Pelosi’s Most Dangerous Ploy

    According to Defense Secretary Robert Gates, Incirlik Air Base near Adana, Turkey is the transshipment point for about 70% of all air cargo (including 33% of the fuel) going to supply US forces in Iraq. Included are about 95% of the new “MRAP” -- mine-resistant, ambush-protected -- vehicles designed to save the lives of American troops. Turkey wasn’t always this helpful. In 2003, the Turks refused permission for the 4th Infantry Division to enter Iraq through Turkey.

    Turkey’s Erdogan government has indicated that if the House of Representatives takes action on a non-binding resolution being pushed by Speaker Pelosi, Turkey might revoke our ability to use Incirlik as a waypoint for Iraq supplies.
    There is a deep-seated cultural sensitivity among the Turkish people and their government on the issue of the Armenian massacre nine decades ago. Amb. Sensoy may have been thinking about the far-reaching effects – including on Turkey’s application for EU membership -- of the House genocide resolution when he told us, “No nation would like to be labeled with that greatest of human rights violations.”

    House Republican leaders are very concerned about the effects the Democrats’ resolution could have. House Minority Leader John Boehner told me, “If the Turks cut off our ability to use Incirlik, there’s no question that this could jeopardize our troops on the ground in Iraq. And frankly, if this is just the latest in the Democrats’ string of back-door attempts to force a retreat from the war against al Qaeda, it’s certainly the most dangerous.”

    Speaker Pelosi is apparently so intent on forcing an end to American involvement in Iraq that she is willing to interfere in our tenuous friendship with Turkey. When she does, it will be an historic event: the House of Representatives will be responsible for alienating a key ally in time of war and possibly interdicting supplies to US troops.
    Sabotage in Wartime

    If Congress has gone nearly a century without passing a resolution accusing the Turks of genocide, why now, in the midst of the Iraq war?

    It is hard to avoid the conclusion that this resolution is just the latest in a series of Congressional efforts to sabotage the conduct of that war.

    Large numbers of American troops and vast amounts of military equipment go to Iraq through Turkey, one of the few nations in the Islamic Middle East that has long been an American ally.

    Turkey has also thus far refrained from retaliating against guerrilla attacks from the Kurdish regions of Iraq onto Turkish soil. But the Turks could retaliate big time if they chose.

    There are more Turkish troops on the border of Iraq than there are American troops within Iraq.

    Turkey has already recalled its ambassador from Washington to show its displeasure over Congress' raising this issue. The Turks may or may not stop at that.

    In this touchy situation, why stir up a hornet's nest over something in the past that neither we nor anybody else can do anything about today?
    Too many Democrats in Congress have gotten into the habit of treating the Iraq war as President Bush's war -- and therefore fair game for political tactics making it harder for him to conduct that war.

    In a rare but revealing slip, Democratic Congressman James Clyburn said that an American victory in Iraq "would be a real big problem for us" in the 2008 elections.

    Unwilling to take responsibility for ending the war by cutting off the money to fight it, as many of their supporters want them to, Congressional Democrats have instead tried to sabotage the prospects of victory by seeking to micro-manage the deployment of troops, delaying the passing of appropriations -- and now this genocide resolution that is the latest, and perhaps lowest, of these tactics.

  3. #153
    Believe. Walter Craparita's Avatar
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    Too many Democrats in Congress have gotten into the habit of treating the Iraq war as President Bush's war -
    Too many Democrats in Congress have gotten into the habit of treating the Iraq war as President Bush's war -
    Too many Democrats in Congress have gotten into the habit of treating the Iraq war as President Bush's war -

  4. #154
    Veteran
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    "Too many Democrats in Congress have gotten into the habit of treating the Iraq war as President Bush's war"

    It is dubya's war.

    He lied and bullied for it, he got it, then he botched it murderously.

  5. #155
    i hunt fenced animals clambake's Avatar
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    If you say so. I'll bet you have no good examples.
    shelving genocide for selfish purpose is a pretty good example. ignoring history when it benefits an aspect of an already corrupt act is not why the world use to look at america as a pillar of hope. i don't think bush has the courage to salvage what's left of the american dream.

    Like I said, I don't really care, I just find it interesting that conservatives are able to pick and choose which genocide is acceptable.

  6. #156
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    shelving genocide for selfish purpose is a pretty good example. ignoring history when it benefits an aspect of an already corrupt act is not why the world use to look at america as a pillar of hope. i don't think bush has the courage to salvage what's left of the american dream.

    Like I said, I don't really care, I just find it interesting that conservatives are able to pick and choose which genocide is acceptable.


    the GOP was silent during the 90's concerning genocide.. yet listening to them blaming clinton for not doing anything about it is humorous.. of course all of it to justify the indefensible..

  7. #157
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    the GOP was silent during the 90's concerning genocide.. yet listening to them blaming clinton for not doing anything about it is humorous.. of course all of it to justify the indefensible..
    Actually, Republicans supported Clinton's action in Bosnia precisely because of the genocidal aspects of it.

  8. #158
    i hunt fenced animals clambake's Avatar
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    Actually, Republicans supported Clinton's action in Bosnia precisely because of the genocidal aspects of it.
    good for them! i think their morals have changed since then. still don't see how ANY resolution regarding ANYTHING could possibly affect the victory you claim in Iraq.

  9. #159
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    Actually, Republicans supported Clinton's action in Bosnia precisely because of the genocidal aspects of it.


    "President Clinton is once again releasing American military might on a foreign country with an ill-defined objective and no exit strategy. He has yet to tell the Congress how much this operation will cost. And he has not informed our nation's armed forces about how long they will be away from home. These strikes do not make for a sound foreign policy."
    -Senator Rick Santorum (R-PA)
    "No goal, no objective, not until we have those things and a compelling case is made, then I say, back out of it, because innocent people are going to die for nothing. That's why I'm against it."
    -Sean Hannity, Fox News, 4/5/99
    "American foreign policy is now one huge big mystery. Simply put, the administration is trying to lead the world with a feel-good foreign policy."
    -Representative Tom Delay (R-TX)
    "If we are going to commit American troops, we must be certain they have a clear mission, an achievable goal and an exit strategy."
    -Karen Hughes, speaking on behalf of presidential candidate George W. Bush
    "I had doubts about the bombing campaign from the beginning...I didn't think we had done enough in the diplomatic area."
    -Senator Trent Lott (R-MS)
    "You think Vietnam was bad? Vietnam is nothing next to Kosovo."
    -Tony Snow, Fox News 3/24/99
    "Well, I just think it's a bad idea. What's going to happen is they're going to be over there for 10, 15, maybe 20 years"
    -Joe Scarborough (R-FL)
    "I'm on the Senate Intelligence Committee, so you can trust me and believe me when I say we're running out of cruise missles. I can't tell you exactly how many we have left, for security reasons, but we're almost out of cruise missles."
    -Senator Inhofe (R-OK)
    "I cannot support a failed foreign policy. History teaches us that it is often easier to make war than peace. This administration is just learning that lesson right now. The President began this mission with very vague objectives and lots of unanswered questions. A month later, these questions are still unanswered. There are no clarified rules of engagement. There is no timetable. There is no legitimate definition of victory. There is no contingency plan for mission creep. There is no clear funding program. There is no agenda to bolster our overextended military. There is no explanation defining what vital national interests are at stake. There was no strategic plan for war when the President started this thing, and there still is no plan today"
    -Representative Tom Delay (R-TX)

    Today these folks would be genocide lovers.. using the rhetoric we are hearing today..

  10. #160
    Retired Ray xrayzebra's Avatar
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    Well, looks like the stuff is going to hit the fan between the
    Kurds and Turkey. The troops are on the move. I can't say I
    really blame Turkey. The Kurds might want to take to talk to
    a few of their folks. The Turks are a hard headed bunch. And
    unless their military has changed, can be pretty barbaric themselves.

  11. #161
    i hunt fenced animals clambake's Avatar
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    Well, looks like the stuff is going to hit the fan between the
    Kurds and Turkey. The troops are on the move. I can't say I
    really blame Turkey. The Kurds might want to take to talk to
    a few of their folks. The Turks are a hard headed bunch. And
    unless their military has changed, can be pretty barbaric themselves.
    yoni knows who to blame. i guess you 2 don't see eye to eye on this.

  12. #162
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    Well, looks like the stuff is going to hit the fan between the
    Kurds and Turkey. The troops are on the move. I can't say I
    really blame Turkey. The Kurds might want to take to talk to
    a few of their folks. The Turks are a hard headed bunch. And
    unless their military has changed, can be pretty barbaric themselves.

    yoni has been telling us that pelosi is to blame?

  13. #163
    Retired Ray xrayzebra's Avatar
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    yoni knows who to blame. i guess you 2 don't see eye to eye on this.
    Whats to see? Condi is doing her dead level best to
    avert, what I think it is about happen, and I don't like
    to see it happen either. But this is a long festering sore
    and I would suspect that there is more to it than meets
    the eye. But we will have to wait and see. I, nor you, have
    access to intel reports from the area.

    I think what some like you wish to happen, wont. It will
    be kept isolated and not go out of region. But then
    again, that is only a supposition.

  14. #164
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    yoni has been telling us that pelosi is to blame?
    This is the type of absolutist micharacterization that precludes you from engaging in a reasonable debate.

    I will add, however, that the United States' ability to mediate or broker a compromise was seriously hampered by Pelosi's idiotic move. Just ask Jack Murtha.

  15. #165
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    Whats to see? Condi is doing her dead level best to
    avert, what I think it is about happen, and I don't like
    to see it happen either. But this is a long festering sore
    and I would suspect that there is more to it than meets
    the eye. But we will have to wait and see. I, nor you, have
    access to intel reports from the area.

    I think what some like you wish to happen, wont. It will
    be kept isolated and not go out of region. But then
    again, that is only a supposition.

    oh i guess there is always hope for condi. too bad she wasn't doing her level best to avert the unecessary war.. oh well we can't have everything..


    long festering sore? like the sunnis and shia hating eachother for over 1,000 yrs?

  16. #166
    Retired Ray xrayzebra's Avatar
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    yoni has been telling us that pelosi is to blame?
    GGA, two separate things. Nancy right now is more than
    likely dancing a jig with the rest of the dimm-o-craps
    thinking this will turn things around in Iraq, for the worst.
    But like I said I think this will be kept isolated to a
    particular area. I also suspect that the main political parties
    in Iraq (Kurdish) are well aware of Turkey's intentions
    and will not interfere. They have too much to lose. Shall
    we say oil. And Turkey does not want to lose their main
    source of "Oil".

  17. #167
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    This is the type of absolutist micharacterization that precludes you from engaging in a reasonable debate.

    I will add, however, that the United States' ability to mediate or broker a compromise was seriously hampered by Pelosi's idiotic move. Just ask Jack Murtha.

    hey if the talk radio super heroes can get away with this stuff so can I..

  18. #168
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    It's not like we didn't know this was going on almost continuously the past four years; there just wasn't anything we could do about it except cross our fingers. Good war strategy.

  19. #169
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    hey if the talk radio super heroes can get away with this stuff so can I..
    If that's where you set your bar...so be it.

  20. #170
    uups stups! Cant_Be_Faded's Avatar
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    ROFL

    GGA just cramed Yonivore's AH with a big metaphorical historically accurate dildo

  21. #171
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    ROFL

    GGA just cramed Yonivore's AH with a big metaphorical historically accurate dildo
    That's what I'm talking about!

  22. #172
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    Turkish troops, weapons head toward Iraq
    By VOLKAN SARISAKAL

    SIRNAK, Turkey -
    Dozens of Turkish military vehicles loaded with soldiers and heavy weapons rumbled toward the Iraq border on Monday after an ambush by rebel Kurds that killed 12 soldiers and left eight missing. Turkey's foreign minister said his country will pursue diplomacy before it sends troops across the rugged frontier.


    The guerrilla ambush on Sunday outraged an already frustrated public. Demonstrations erupted across the country and opposition leaders called for an immediate strike against rebel bases in Iraq, despite appeals for restraint from Iraq, the U.S. and European leaders.

    Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said he told Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice in a telephone conversation on Sunday night that Turkey expected "speedy steps from the U.S." in cracking down on Kurdish rebels and that Rice asked "for a few days" from him.


    Erdogan did not specify what he meant by "speedy steps," but he has often urged the United States and Iraq to crack down on the Kurdistan Workers' Party, or PKK. Turkish leaders say it is the responsibility of those countries to do whatever is necessary to destroy the guerrilla group's bases in northern Iraq.
    Link

  23. #173
    i hunt fenced animals clambake's Avatar
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    no no no yoni has confirmed this is all due to a supposed resolution.

  24. #174
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    I just find it interesting that conservatives are able to pick and choose which genocide is acceptable.
    It's not that this genocide was acceptable. It's not. Bringing it up is politically sensitive, and the current government of Turkey had nothing to do with it. It would be like blaming the current government of Germany for the slaughter of so many Jews. It just stuipid to do so.

  25. #175
    TRU 'cross mah stomach LaMarcus Bryant's Avatar
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    It's not that this genocide was acceptable. It's not. Bringing it up is politically sensitive, and the current government of Turkey had nothing to do with it. It would be like blaming the current government of Germany for the slaughter of so many Jews. It just stuipid to do so.
    Wild Cobra's arguments do not follow the basic rules of logic.

    But whatever.

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