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  1. #176
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    What exactly is your beef? Do you misunderstand my intent here?

    Our founding fathers realized the purpose of a tariff. We should be taxing goods that can be made here to make them as expensive, or mare expensive than we can make them for.

    Tell me. Why do you think "tariff" is mentioned in our cons ution?
    Tarriffs reduce the efficiency of the free market, and force the economy to operate below its full capacity. If you think we need them, you are against free markets and for the government picking winners and losers.

    The founding fathers did not understand modern economics, either.

  2. #177
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    Tarriffs reduce the efficiency of the free market, and force the economy to operate below its full capacity. If you think we need them, you are against free markets and for the government picking winners and losers.

    The founding fathers did not understand modern economics, either.
    Corporations pushed very hard for free market globabilization in the 80s and 90s. When they got it, the killed 10Ms of jobs in the USA (great side effect of destroying the hated unions and flattening real household incomes since 1980).

    China held its currency way undervalued vs dollar. In that case, the USA should have placed a tariff on all Chinese imports to keep jobs in the US.

  3. #178
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    Tarriffs reduce the efficiency of the free market, and force the economy to operate below its full capacity. If you think we need them, you are against free markets and for the government picking winners and losers.

    The founding fathers did not understand modern economics, either.
    Really?

    You really think global free trade was their intent?

    If so, tariffs would have never been mentioned or used, don't you think?

    Can you explain why tariffs would be mentioned in the cons ution?

  4. #179
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    Hottest September On Record, Fastest Pacific Warming In 10,000 Years, Warmest Arctic In 120,000 Years




    Average summer temperatures in the Eastern Canadian Arctic during the last 100 years are higher now than during any century in the past 44,000 years and perhaps as long ago as 120,000 years, says a new INSTAAR study.

    The study is the first direct evidence the present warmth in the Eastern Canadian Arctic exceeds the peak warmth there in the Early Holocene, when the amount of the sun’s energy reaching the Northern Hemisphere in summer was roughly 9 percent greater than today, said study leader Gifford Miller.

    “The key piece here is just how unprecedented the warming of Arctic Canada is,” said Miller, also an INSTAAR fellow. “This study really says the warming we are seeing is outside any kind of known natural variability, and it has to be due to increased greenhouse gases in the atmosphere.”

    … a new study in the leading journal Science adds support to the idea that the oceans are taking up some of the excess heat, at least for the moment. In a reconstruction of Pacific Ocean temperatures in the last 10,000 years, researchers have found that its middle depths have warmed 15 times faster in the last 60 years than they did during apparent natural warming cycles in the previous 10,000.

    “We’re experimenting by putting all this heat in the ocean without quite knowing how it’s going to come back out and affect climate,” said study coauthor Braddock Linsley, a climate scientist at Columbia University’s Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory. “It’s not so much the magnitude of the change, but the rate of change.”

    http://thinkprogress.org/climate/201...tember-record/
    I see B- had the s again today...

  5. #180
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    I see B- had the s again today...
    I'm devasated by your substantiated retort, just devastated.

  6. #181
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Really?

    You really think global free trade was their intent?

    If so, tariffs would have never been mentioned or used, don't you think?

    Can you explain why tariffs would be mentioned in the cons ution?
    I have not done enough reading of the background of why tariffs were mentioned in the cons ution to hazard more than a guess, sorry, you will get no answer to that question from me, if I do not know the answer. If you can't accept "I don't know" as an answer, you may as well add it to your siggy, cause you are gonna have to ask it a lot.

    Why do you give a what the founding fathers intended in 1791?

    Do you think the founding fathers were infallible?

  7. #182
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Really?

    You really think global free trade was their intent?

    If so, tariffs would have never been mentioned or used, don't you think?

    Can you explain why tariffs would be mentioned in the cons ution?
    Do you understand how tariffs reduce the efficiency of the free market?

  8. #183
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    Do you understand how tariffs reduce the efficiency of the free market?
    Yes.

    Do you understand there are different levels of commerce?

    Do you understand supply and demand, and want our wages to go to what places like Indonesia pays so we have jobs?

  9. #184
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    link: Tariff

    A tariff is a tax levied by a government on imported goods. In some countries it also may be a tax on exported goods. A tariff also is called a customs duty or an impost.

    In general terms the purposes of a tariff are twofold:

    To supply revenue to the government. This was especially true in the early days of the United States when other forms of federal taxation had not been developed

    To protect domestic producers from foreign compe ion. Placing a tax on an imported foreign item would make a similar domestic item more compe ive in price. Use of this form of tariff is called protectionism. The stock argument presented by protectionists is that such duties are needed only until there is an equalization of production costs between the U.S. and the foreign nation.

  10. #185
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Not really an explanation regarding the economic effects of tariffs.

    I, for one, do not want my standard of living effected by such things. You want our government to pick winners and losers, and I would be one, as would the majority of Americans, which is deeply ironic.

  11. #186
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Yes.

    Do you understand there are different levels of commerce?
    I don't understand your question. You will have to expand that until I do.

    Do you understand supply and demand,
    yes.

    and want our wages to go to what places like Indonesia pays so we have jobs?
    No. Tariffs will not prevent that from happening if the market moves in that direction.

  12. #187
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    Tariffs will not prevent that from happening if the market moves in that direction.
    eg, sure they will. US mfrs wouldn't have moved to China with its suppressed value of currency if US had not allowed them to tax write-off their moving expenses, and if the US had imposed import tariffs on ALL Chinese-origin products, including US mfrs, to counter the Chinese undervaluing their currency.

  13. #188
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    eg, sure they will. US mfrs wouldn't have moved to China with its suppressed value of currency if US had not allowed them to tax write-off their moving expenses, and if the US had imposed import tariffs on ALL Chinese-origin products, including US mfrs, to counter the Chinese undervaluing their currency.
    Meh, it will get harder and harder for them to support that. If they want to prop it up, it will get more and more expensive as their economy grows.

  14. #189
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    Meh, it will get harder and harder for them to support that. If they want to prop it up, it will get more and more expensive as their economy grows.
    we'll see when, if Apple, etc start bailing out of Asian assemblers and subcontracting to US mfrs.

  15. #190
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    did the world end yet

  16. #191
    I play pretty, no? TeyshaBlue's Avatar
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    did the world end yet
    Yes. Welcome to .


  17. #192
    my unders, my frgn whites pgardn's Avatar
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    No

    but we have royally screwed a whole lot of fisheries.
    South China Sea is a real mess.

    Our managing of resources is fairly pitiful.

  18. #193
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    No

    but we have royally screwed a whole lot of fisheries.
    South China Sea is a real mess.

    Our managing of resources is fairly pitiful.
    pitiful? It's unsustainable disaster. major food fish in many oceans have collapsed, cod, tuna, sharks.

    Now there is industrial harvesting of krill for Omega-3 oil in antarctic waters, reducing the main food for whales.

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