Jared Zwerling: Source close to Leonard says he's worried about roster and future

[TD 21]

I don't think anything the Spurs had could beat Isaiah-Crowder-Brooklyn_pick.

But they might be able to get in on Kemba.

If it takes the 18 and 20 picks with declining lotto protections on 20 it's a must make move.

Don't think it takes both; Murray essentially qualifies as a pick as is.

Hurting the value they're likely to receive, is their insistence that someone take a bloated contract and PG being the most saturated position in the league.

Think Nuggets, Pistons, Pacers and Jazz are the compe ion here.

It wasn't about lack of assets to consummate a proposed deal, it's about the lack of attempts. Spurs had a star player that publicly stated that he wanted to play for them and they never even made a formal offer. Oh, there were rumors they made a trade one but unlike every other team's trade proposal which was visible and accounted for, the Spurs offer was never revealed. And even if the Spurs don't publicly announce their trade proposals, you can rest assured it would been leaked someway, somhow through social media via a third party. For all we know, Danny Green was a deal breaker.

If the Spurs didn't have assets to trade for Kyrie, I'm not sure what makes you think they have assets to trade for Walker. Guys like Forbes, Bertans, Laughverne, long term Paddy doesn't exactly make trading with the Spurs more desirable. Even if Jordan was bent on trading him at the deadline, a slew of teams could offer up a better package than the Spurs.

On the Leonard front, the best thing for him is to be shutdown for the season rather than risk any further injury for a team that isn't championship contending with or without him.

No less a source than Wojnarowski himself said, to paraphrase, they tried really, really hard. A formal offer isn't necessary when you can't make a compe ive one.

Walker isn't as good as Irving and there's an even bigger gap in their cache. I don't know that Spurs can trade for him, but I think it's plausible they could. Other than Irving, no recent star trade has been for (perceived) equal value.

[Hoops Czar]

I'm all for criticism when it's due, but the notion that there was anything they could have done to acquire Irving, is insane. Look at the package he went for; there was no internal comparable to it. If there was, they'd more than likely have him because all things being relatively equal, no one wants to trade players of that caliber in conference.

As bad as this situation is at the moment, if Leonard can get healthy and they can pull off a trade for Walker, they're probably right back to being the 2nd best team in the league.

It wasn't about lack of assets to consummate a proposed deal, it's about the lack of attempts. Spurs had a star player that publicly stated that he wanted to play for them and they never even made a formal offer. Oh, there were rumors they made a trade proposal but unlike every other team's trade proposal which was visible and accounted for, the Spurs offer was never revealed. And even if the Spurs don't publicly announce their trade proposals, you can rest assured it would been leaked someway, somhow through social media via a third party. For all we know, Danny Green was a deal breaker.

If the Spurs didn't have assets to trade for Kyrie, I'm not sure what makes you think they have assets to trade for Walker. Guys like Forbes, Bertans, Laughverne, long term Paddy doesn't exactly make trading with the Spurs more desirable. Even if Jordan was bent on trading him at the deadline, a slew of teams could offer up a better package than the Spurs.

On the Leonard front, the best thing for him is to be shutdown for the season rather than risk any further injury for a team that isn't championship contending with or without him.

[Hoops Czar]

No less a source than Wojnarowski himself said, to paraphrase, they tried really, really hard. A formal offer isn't necessary when you can't make a compe ive one.

Walker isn't as good as Irving and there's an even bigger gap in their cache. I don't know that Spurs can trade for him, but I think it's plausible they could. Other than Irving, no recent star trade has been for (perceived) equal value.

I saw the Woj quote and it sounds more like a lot of huffing and puffing but nothing that can be substantiated. Even if the Spurs didn't have the assets, they could have got in on a three way trade with another team. For that to happen, RC probably would have had to work a little over time.

"A formal offer isn't necessary when you can't make a compe ive one."

Boston's offer wasn't on the table until weeks after he announced his desire to leave Cleveland. Prior to that, Cleveland was receiving nothing but low ball offers. That's a defeatist at ude if I've ever seen one. "Lets not make an offer because someone might make a better one."

[szkorhetz]

Stop this Kyrie non-sense. We had nothing to offer.

[spursistan]

I don't have much hope for the front office.

I doubt they could muster the sober reflection needed to succeed.

Worse, even if they did come to their senses, the damage is done. They can't undo that. At best, they could burn more assets to dump the toxic ones, but the cure might kill the patient anyway.

Everything they did wrong was written about accurately in forewarning by so many posters here that it's mind boggling.

They did so much wrong I just don't think the front office is still capable of telling good deals from bad. This wasn't one single contract that was wrong, or over optimistic faith in one player being healthy against history to the contrary.

There were massive, reckless mistakes at every aspect that the front office took on:

When gauging the free agent market for players like Mills

When gauging the impact of their deals on the cap of future deals

When gauging the talent and impact of Mills

Misusing the asset of restricted free agency for Simmons.

When they approached the draft like they weren't going to re-sign Mills

When gauging the status of Milutinov going back to his draft, and wasting the best part of a late first round pick: a very cheap player under team control for at least 4 seasons

When scouting the free agent market for bigs and somehow finding Joffrey as a credible NBA player and not the worst rim defender in NBA history

Giving a player option to that terrible rim defender.

Everything they touch, scouting, the lay of the land, free agency, understanding their own coach's predilections, cap management, asset management, the draft, foresight, everything.

For that much to get wrong, I don't know if there's any coming back.

/thread

[spursistan]

I remember a thread made by one of the typical homers laughing at the "cliff jumpers" because the Spurs were taking advantage of the easiest schedule on the NBA.

I can't remember who it was though.

Probably that raybies..Hasn't logged to the forum since started to go south..

[TheDoctor]

Don't hold back man, tell us how you really feel.

BTW, someone bold this man.

[TimDunkem]

Probably that raybies..Hasn't logged to the forum since started to go south..

Wonder if raybies still thinks we're a better team than GS.

"When we get healthy!....We had the lead on them after the first half of game 1!"

[SAGirl]

Stop this Kyrie non-sense. We had nothing to offer.

Hops Zar is a troll../ he is going to disregard rationality to push his agenda.

[SAGirl]

Wonder if raybies still thinks we're a better team than GS.

"When we get healthy!....We had the lead on them after the first half of game 1!"

To be fair to him and others, that cannot be known or unknown.

Injuries killed the Spurs and if anything it gives an excuse for the entire season. No need to ignore this truth with the purpose of trolling.

I am not persuaded they would have done much in the postseason past the second round even when healthy bc their guard situation is beyond pathetic but telling someone I told you so when the team has suffered the loss of their best player, a third leading scorer, and Manu, well it’s no wonder they are where they are.

[lmbebo]

Think the spurs have had a remarkable season considering all the challenges they've faced this year. Its hard to say this team isn't well built or they suck when they really haven't been healthy enough to be truly evaluated. Its resulted in a lot of players to play outside there strengths and was originally envisioned for their roles.

[SAGirl]

Think the spurs have had a remarkable season considering all the challenges they've faced this year. Its hard to say this team isn't well built or they suck when they really haven't been healthy enough to be truly evaluated. Its resulted in a lot of players to play outside there strengths and was originally envisioned for their roles.

Yes... basically this.
——
We only disagree that one could see the problems they had with their guards coming even b4 this season and they have gotten worse and will be worse next season with more attrition, injuries, aging, possible retirements. Either one of their recent guard draftees develops or they will need to brreak this up at some point through a trade. They need at least one quality guard who is young and doesn’t require minutes restrictions or rest games. I therefore completely understand going all in with Murray and see what he has.

[TheGreatYacht]

Get the in here raybies

[TimDunkem]

Get the in here raybies

That delusional slurper bas has conveniently been MIA for awhile now. Shocker!

[TheGreatYacht]

That delusional slurper bas has conveniently been MIA for awhile now. Shocker!

He won't be showing up anytime soon seeing as it's a tough schedule from here on out and we'll most likely be playing the dubs, rockets, or wolves in the first round

[TD 21]

I saw the Woj quote and it sounds more like a lot of huffing and puffing but nothing that can be substantiated. Even if the Spurs didn't have the assets, they could have got in on a three way trade with another team. For that to happen, RC probably would have had to work a little over time.

"A formal offer isn't necessary when you can't make a compe ive one."

Boston's offer wasn't on the table until weeks after he announced his desire to leave Cleveland. Prior to that, Cleveland was receiving nothing but low ball offers. That's a defeatist at ude if I've ever seen one. "Lets not make an offer because someone might make a better one."

This is a stunning lack of knowledge as to how the business works.

Even in a three way trade, Spurs didn't have a centerpiece (high end pick and/or prospect) and no one was giving them that for their spare parts.

Low ball or not, the offers still blew whatever Spurs could offer out of the water.

[Hoops Czar]

This is a stunning lack of knowledge as to how the business works.

Even in a three way trade, Spurs didn't have a centerpiece (high end pick and/or prospect) and no one was giving them that for their spare parts.

Low ball or not, the offers still blew whatever Spurs could offer out of the water.

The lack of understanding is all yours.

Sure, teams could offer more but sadly for the majority of those teams, Kyrie wouldn't guarantee a contract extension so that meant losing assets for nothing. A gamble teams weren't willing to commit to. He told the Spurs he would sign an extension. That alone puts them in a favorable position. The Spurs had LMA, Green, Murray and a 2018 1st at their disposal to be used in a trade for Kyrie. Yes, LMA was proving difficult to move because of his opt out clause but not impossible and the pick would have been a late first rounder but that's why you bring in a third team to make the deal work. When you don't have lemons to make lemonade, you borrow lemons from your neighbor. Come on TD21, didn't you have a lemonade stand when you were a kid?

[dabom]

Ya ing gots.

[TD 21]

The lack of understanding is all yours.

Sure, teams could offer more but sadly for the majority of those teams, Kyrie wouldn't guarantee a contract extension so that meant losing assets for nothing. A gamble teams weren't willing to commit to. He told the Spurs he would sign an extension. That alone puts them in a favorable position. The Spurs had LMA, Green, Murray and a 2018 1st at their disposal to be used in a trade for Kyrie. Yes, LMA was proving difficult to move because of his opt out clause but not impossible and the pick would have been a late first rounder but that's why you bring in a third team to make the deal work. When you don't have lemons to make lemonade, you borrow lemons from your neighbor. Come on TD21, didn't you have a lemonade stand when you were a kid?

I don't get what about this is so difficult to comprehend. You needed 2 significant pieces for Irving: 1) A prime, above average starting PG so that they could maintain a current big 3 (granted, Thomas' hip injury has derailed that) and conference favorite status, 2) A significant pick or prospect.

Spurs had neither of these things and no one was giving them one for Aldridge or Green.

[Hoops Czar]

I don't get what about this is so difficult to comprehend. You needed 2 significant pieces for Irving: 1) A prime, above average starting PG so that they could maintain a current big 3 (granted, Thomas' hip injury has derailed that) and conference favorite status, 2) A significant pick or prospect.

Spurs had neither of these things and no one was giving them one for Aldridge or Green.

You're laying on thick with hindsight and that goal post moving is epic. Nobody is disputing the Spurs could match Boston's offer however Boston's offer wasn't on the table until nearly a month after Irving demanded a trade.

Are you calling Isaiah Thomas a big three component? He's a huge downgrade from Irving and to top it all off, the only reason Ainge entered the Irving sweepstakes was because he was concerned over Isaiah's long term health prognosis and by the looks of things, he was right because Thomas is a s of his former self. I would argue that if/when Lebron decides to leave this summer, that roster wouldn't be fit enough to make the playoffs in the leastern conference with Thomas/Love/third wheel. The only thing Cleveland got of substance was Brooklyn's 2018 unprotected. But again, Boston wasn't in the picture until late in the game and Irving made it increasingly difficult on Cleveland because he wasn't willing to sign an extension with most teams.

By the look of it, they better hope the brooklyn pick turns out to be lightening in a bottle because they've been robbed thus far. Also, your selling Aldridge short. He could have netted a mid lottery pick. The Spurs could not have pulled off a trade by themselves, they would have needed a third team to enter the fray which was certainly plausible before Boston's offer.

[raybies]

That delusional slurper bas has conveniently been MIA for awhile now. Shocker!

Nah just realized this place was a waste of my time. The negativity in here is toxic. I have friends I talk to now to suffice my itch. Spoiled, irrational, illogical, etc... spurtalk in a nuts . Most here have agendas or have to be the first to call something out cause they desperately want attention or feel if they are right they are somehow validated as a good analyst... I lurk but I always feel worse after I leave. I'm a team fan. I think this is what everyone wanted right? ing and complaining to the end lol

[Robz4000]

Nah just realized this place was a waste of my time. The negativity in here is toxic. I have friends I talk to now to suffice my itch. Spoiled, irrational, illogical, etc... spurtalk in a nuts . Most here have agendas or have to be the first to call something out cause they desperately want attention or feel if they are right they are somehow validated as a good analyst... I lurk but I always feel worse after I leave. I'm a team fan. I think this is what everyone wanted right? ing and complaining to the end lol

ST is not for the faint of heart, that's for sure.

[raybies]

ST is not for the faint of heart, that's for sure.

I guess... just wish there were more good posters. Sucks having to ignore 90% of the community. This place is cancer tbh.

[NASpurs]

Nah just realized this place was a waste of my time. The negativity in here is toxic. I have friends I talk to now to suffice my itch. Spoiled, irrational, illogical, etc... spurtalk in a nuts . Most here have agendas or have to be the first to call something out cause they desperately want attention or feel if they are right they are somehow validated as a good analyst... I lurk but I always feel worse after I leave. I'm a team fan. I think this is what everyone wanted right? ing and complaining to the end lol

Probably talking about reddit

don't talk bad about mah team, get a downvote

[SAGirl]

Ehhhh Don't have to hate on team fans. There is enough with Tholdren.....