Update... RJ talks Stalled, Vince deal dead...

[SScarrJ]

With all due respect Mr. Body, that's not necessarily true. While Carter can more than hold his own offensively and will certainly make up for Manu's absence there, in no way does he provide the other elements. He doesn't play the on-the-ball defense that Manu does. Doesn't create opportunities for others. And as a newcomer, he's going to have an awfully steep learning curve - offensively and defensively. My point is, even if Carter does come here, his transition will not be as seamless as you've indicated.

Even if his transition isnt seamless and the spurs lose in the WCF to the Lakers, it sets San Antonio up for a great 3 year last hurrah with Duncan. You can easily find low cost vets who will line up to join the Spurs. Rather than waiting for 2010 and overpaying in a crowded market.

[Spursfan092120]

I think everyone is forgetting what we really need here, a Big man..

Thank you...maybe that will throw some ice water on their heads.

[MarHill]

What the does Hill bring to the table that is vital to us contending?

Carter will produce more then Mason. We get Bruce back for sure and maybe Oberto (like he matters).

Basically what Hill brings to the table is the only thing that's lost and that aint much.

Stop trying to use the Mavs/Suns analogy. It doesn't work.

The Mavs/Suns analogy works quite well.

Those teams who have never won a le.....made bold trades in order to have a chance. It didn't work!!

[Holt's Cat]

Even if his transition isnt seamless and the spurs lose in the WCF to the Lakers, it sets San Antonio up for a great 3 year last hurrah with Duncan. You can easily find low cost vets who will line up to join the Spurs. Rather than waiting for 2010 and overpaying in a crowded market.

Positioning for a star level free agent run makes no sense for the Spurs. You use the cap flexibility to deal for that talent.

[SenorSpur]

Even if his transition isnt seamless and the spurs lose in the WCF to the Lakers, it sets San Antonio up for a great 3 year last hurrah with Duncan. You can easily find low cost vets who will line up to join the Spurs. Rather than waiting for 2010 and overpaying in a crowded market.

Speaking of the 2010 plan, I would assume that with the FO out shopping for high-priced FA talent, the vaunted 2010 plan is "out the window".

[Mr. Body]

Even if his transition isnt seamless and the spurs lose in the WCF to the Lakers, it sets San Antonio up for a great 3 year last hurrah with Duncan. You can easily find low cost vets who will line up to join the Spurs. Rather than waiting for 2010 and overpaying in a crowded market.

That's the benefit many are missing right now. Carter may have trouble integrating this year - maybe - but the next two years we still have him, his talent and offensive prowess. He'll prolong Ginobili and Duncan's careers for those reasons alone, and could make the SAS prohibitive favorites going into next year without any changes.

[Mr. Body]

Speaking of the 2010 plan, I would assume that with the FO out shopping for high-priced FA talent, the vaunted 2010 plan is "out the window".

You're not signing a player better than Carter in 2010.

'Sides, every team is clearing money for that year. I'd take Carter now over a vague shot at Chris Bosh.

[SScarrJ]

The Mavs/Suns analogy works quite well.

Those teams who have never won a le.....made bold trades in order to have a chance. It didn't work!!

Suns and Mavs traded for guys that were not meant for their system. Vince Carter has great range and is one of the better catch and shoot guys, not to mention he has the ability to put it on the floor and attack the basket..... Sounds like he would fit in great here . Oh i forgot though, he doesn't play lockdown defense like Mike Finley.

[MaverickRipper]

The Mavs/Suns analogy works quite well.

Those teams who have never won a le.....made bold trades in order to have a chance. It didn't work!!

No, it doesn't.

And it's not a bold trade, outside the salaries.

We lose a back up point who puts up 5 points on under 40% shooting.

Mason's production is replaced by Carter and then some.

We get Bowen back. May get Oberto back, but hes a bum now anyway.



The analogy doesn't work, at all.

[K-State Spur]

I'm glad we're going to be pissing away the rest of Duncan's prime waiting for tomorrow. How about Manu isn't out for the rest of the season? Stack the rotation and win now.

I'm all for stacking the rotation. If spare parts and Horry can net a productive player - go for it.

What I'm not in favor of is turning the team in the Big 4, but having to surround them with the D-League All-Stars.

[MaNu4Tres]

The Mavs/Suns analogy works quite well.

Those teams who have never won a le.....made bold trades in order to have a chance. It didn't work!!

Or they just never had a good enough team to begin with( suns) or never had a leader who knows how to win ( mavs).

[MarHill]

Suns and Mavs traded for guys that were not meant for their system. Vince Carter has great range and is one of the better catch and shoot guys, not to mention he has the ability to put it on the floor and attack the basket..... Sounds like he would fit in great here . Oh i forgot though, he doesn't play lockdown defense like Mike Finley.

But still they made trades they thought would work for their system and they were bold in doing that.

However, the result was the same for the both of them and it has affected them financially.

[Shastafarian]

The Spurs would definitely be over the lux tax threshold next year if they were to trade for Carter. Just one more reason it's not gonna happen.

[SenorSpur]

You're not signing a player better than Carter in 2010.

'Sides, every team is clearing money for that year. I'd take Carter now over a vague shot at Chris Bosh.

I agree in that there is gonna be a lot of team out there that will be "all dressed up and nowhere to go" in 2010.

[Universe]

In NBA 2K9, Mason bolts in two years anyways.

[SenorSpur]

The Spurs would definitely be over the lux tax threshold next year if they were to trade for Carter. Just one more reason it's not gonna happen.

Plus the salary cap will be going down.... yet another reason.

Try squeezing more potential lux tax dollars out of Holt's ass.

[Holt's Cat]

How much faith is there to have in Ginobili's ankle? That cost the Spurs the le last year. If he's really having problems now is he really going to be ready come May and June? He finally broke 30 minutes a night last season and he broke down by the playoffs. With Bruce winding down his career the Spurs are going to have to change their approach. That means more scoring. The Spurs could really use a proven scoring threat like Carter on the wing.

[MaverickRipper]

I'm all for stacking the rotation. If spare parts and Horry can net a productive player - go for it.

What I'm not in favor of is turning the team in the Big 4, but having to surround them with the D-League All-Stars.

Bonner
Thomas
Finely
Bowen

How is that supporting 4 D-league allstars?

Better yet, how is losing the Hill the difference between have nothing but D-league all-stars?

[MarHill]

No, it doesn't.

And it's not a bold trade, outside the salaries.

We lose a back up point who puts up 5 points on under 40% shooting.

Mason's production is replaced by Carter and then some.

We get Bowen back. May get Oberto back, but hes a bum now anyway.



The analogy doesn't work, at all.

Yes it does!!

I guess you don't get it. Both teams made trades they thought would put them over the top for a championship and it didn't work!

Now both teams...more Phoenix than Dallas are hurt financially by it and neither are going to win a le this year.

So the analogy fits!!!

[K-State Spur]

With all due respect Mr. Body, that's not necessarily true. While Carter can more than hold his own offensively and will certainly make up for Manu's absence there, in no way does he provide the other elements. He doesn't play the on-the-ball defense that Manu does. Doesn't create opportunities for others. And as a newcomer, he's going to have an awfully steep learning curve - offensively and defensively. My point is, even if Carter does come here, his transition will not be as seamless as you've indicated.

Carter has also - historically - needed more shots to equal Manu's production.

I'm not saying that he's not as productive as Manu - but he has rarely been as efficient.

[SScarrJ]

But still they made trades they thought would work for their system and they were bold in doing that.

However, the result was the same for the both of them and it has affected them financially.

So we shouldn't make a good trade because other teams made bad trades?

Everything has affected the Suns financially, Sarver is a cheap prick.

Dallas isn't hurting in the least bit except the fact they aren't a very good team overall.

[Holt's Cat]

What's Manu's production when he has to sit because of a bum ankle? The Spurs will need someone to shoulder the scoring load night in and night out moving forward. Manu's role is only going to get smaller with the Spurs moving forward. TD + TP is not enough to carry this team to another le.

[MarHill]

Plus the salary cap will be going down.... yet another reason.

Try squeezing more potential lux tax dollars out of Holt's ass.

Like I said it's easy to spend other's people money and think there is no rammifications for it!

No wonder our country is going a tough an economic situation right now!!!

Spend, spend, spend.....it doesn't matter the government will give me more anyway!!!!

[MaverickRipper]

Yes it does!!

I guess you don't get it. Both teams made trades they thought would put them over the top for a championship and it didn't work!

Now both teams...more Phoenix than Dallas are hurt financially by it and neither are going to win a le this year.

So the analogy fits!!!

No, it doesn't.

You understand when Duncan/Manu are gone in a few years, so are all our le hopes, right?

We aren't trading away anything massive. We lose a great role player and back up point.

[MaNu4Tres]

Carter has also - historically - needed more shots to equal Manu's production.

I'm not saying that he's not as productive as Manu - but he has rarely been as efficient.

Have you ever wondered why players fg percentages tend to rise when they play with Duncan Parker and Manu?


Have you thought about how Carter has basically had create his own shots and carry the offensive load by himself for just about his whole career?

He's never had an inside presence to play off of to begin with. I guarantee you if Manu was on the nets his efficiency would take a dive.