AIG Bonuses

[RandomGuy]

I think we'll just have to disagree on what would have happened, we'll never know now; and, besides, that's water under the bridge now. But, I think Congress micromanaging and fomenting outrage is just worsening the problem. Particularly when, from my perspective, they're only doing it to deflect blame and skirt their own complicity in the problem.

If they were dead set on bailing these companies out, they should have put a bit more thought into the plan. , Shut down the markets until you have it written if you have to.

But throwing a trillion dollars out there and then saying, OH ! You can't do that, you must do this -- well after the barn is empty -- is a bit ridiculous.

I agree somewhat.

The problem with really doing it "right" is that the time it would have taken to get the perfect plan down was greater than the time it would have taken for a complete collapse.

"shutting down" the markets is not really an option that is feasible in any way. Too much money/pressure for that not to happen.

In business, as in war, having a bad plan at the right time, is often better than no plan at all, hesitating, and getting swept away by events.

[RandomGuy]

Well, seeing as how these retention bonuses were contracted prior to any bail out being given or even contemplated, I'd say it not only makes one think twice about accepting bail out money but, it might make one think twice about agreeing to stay on -- on the promise of a retention bonus -- if a failing company is likely to receive bailout money in the future and thus, jeopardize their reason for staying at all.

If I had been an executive offered one of the bonuses and known that they could be nullified by Congressional action or worse, witness Congress fomenting a murderous rage against me and my family, in the future...I'd of found work elsewhere and AIG would have been toast.

All of the executives responsible for writing the CDS's and making the ty, risky decisions, are gone already. It was part of Liddy's testimony, by the way.

I doubt many of them will want to list that particular job on their resume's.

Quite frankly, if I were a firm that had to take that bailout money because some talented idiot ed my company, I would probably fire them anyways, and find someone who didn't up.

That kind of knowledge of finance isn't *that* rare. , maybe I should start applying to the companies winding this down and firing the idiots responsible. Gimmie a bonus...

[Winehole23]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/13112282/A...kruptcy-Report

[Winehole23]

The GAO reports that AIG's ability to pay back the $170 billion loaned to it so far is "deteriorating."

[Yonivore]

All of the executives responsible for writing the CDS's and making the ty, risky decisions, are gone already. It was part of Liddy's testimony, by the way.

I doubt many of them will want to list that particular job on their resume's.

Quite frankly, if I were a firm that had to take that bailout money because some talented idiot ed my company, I would probably fire them anyways, and find someone who didn't up.

That kind of knowledge of finance isn't *that* rare. , maybe I should start applying to the companies winding this down and firing the idiots responsible. Gimmie a bonus...

You didn't respond to the point that the executives getting bonuses were hired and promised the bonuses pre-bailout and how that might affect your assertion that they might think twice before accepting bailout money.

[coyotes_geek]

The GAO reports that AIG's ability to pay back the $170 billion loaned to it so far is "deteriorating."

I'm guessing not too many people are going to be surprised by this.

[Yonivore]

Should have just let them go down the toilet...there is no way government can dig this out any better than the market.

[Crookshanks]

I really can't believe some of you think what Congress is doing to AIG is okay. The gov't put Liddy in charge and the gov't orchestrated the bail out - bonuses and all. Then Dodd put in the amendment to protect those bonuses that everyone is now screaming about. Maybe if they'd taken the time to READ the stimulus bill before ramming it through, they would've known what was in there!

Are you really okay with Congress targeting a small group of private citizens and seeking to punish them through excessive taxation? And in the process, they are inciting the mobs and putting these PRIVATE citizens at risk. This is insanity and very scary!

[RandomGuy]

You didn't respond to the point that the executives getting bonuses were hired and promised the bonuses pre-bailout and how that might affect your assertion that they might think twice before accepting bailout money.

??

Um, not sure what you want here.

They were promised this before the company went down the tubes. That is a very valid point, and it kind of mitigates a lot of the criticism of the current administration's handling of the bonuses. They were stinky and repugnant, but pre-existing conditions so to speak.

The assertion about banks not wanting to accept bailout money because of the publicity their execs' pay package might cause would be unaffected.

Personally I think CEO's in this country are vastly overpaid at the expense of shareholders.

There was one economist who studied returns of companies and found that it actually varied inversely with executive pay packages, i.e. the more they got paid over the average worker at the company, the worse the performance. Not sure how valid that linkage is, as I can think of a few factors that might affect that, but it wouldn't surprise me if it turned out to be the case.

[Winehole23]

I'm guessing not too many people are going to be surprised by this.

Among those who've be tracking the story? No.

I'm surprised by how many people don't know anything about AIG or are just now getting acquainted.

(*Hauteur* of the record store clerk) --

"Still listening to THAT, I see."

[Winehole23]

The assertion about banks not wanting to accept bailout money because of the publicity their execs' pay package might cause would be unaffected.

In the same ballpark: a few banks loudly insist they want to return TARP funds. Some said the money tainted their banks as troubled; others that they only accepted the money in the first place at the behest of Treasury.

[RandomGuy]

Should have just let them go down the toilet...there is no way government can dig this out any better than the market.

(padlocks fire escape door in crowded night club)
(hands Yonivore a megaphone, centers him squarely infront of the doors, and moves away)

It's all yours. Shout "fire" when you are ready.

(END REFERENCE TO PREVIOUS POST)

So how exactly would "the market" handle the problem?

What is your market-based solution, and why would that work better than what is being done?

Honestly, I am dubious, but if it works, it, I'm all for just about anything at this point.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

whoopsie..........

also, is it me or does geithner favor beavis? besides the hair color.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Geithner: Treasury pushed for bonus loophole
Posted: 04:25 PM ET
Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner told CNN Thursday his department asked Sen. Chris Dodd to include a loophole in the stimulus bill allowing bonuses to be paid.



(CNN) — Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner told CNN Thursday his department asked Sen. Chris Dodd to include a loophole in the stimulus bill that allowed bailed-out insurance giant American International Group to keep its bonuses.
In an interview with CNN's Ali Velshi, Geithner said the Treasury Department was particularly concerned the government would face lawsuits if bonus contracts were breached.
Dodd admitted to CNN Thursday he'd added the controversial provision after a Treasury official pushed for it. Earlier in the week, Dodd had said he had not played any role in the addition of the loophole.
Geithner told Velshi Thursday he takes full responsibility for the situation

[Winehole23]

Congress allowed itself to be muscled by Geithner. For the upcoming rescue plan to have any chance of succeeding, expect to see more of the same. Only, I suspect, somewhat more discreetly in the future.

[LnGrrrR]

whoopsie..........

also, is it me or does geithner favor beavis? besides the hair color.

He looks much more like Butthead.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

He looks much more like Butthead.

a cross pollination of the two. if only i had photoshop skills