The Curious Brainwashing Case of ...

[ChumpDumper]

Either you don't know or you are playing games...I broke off from the christian thread to start this one - once Woo Bung Hole and I agreed on the premise/issue--
when he agreed that the premise was indeed brainwashing and that he didn't think anyone of us was ever brainwashed - I started this thread to demonstrate how it is very common for people to be brainwashed and in fact I think most of us were.

End of story.

An OP is an OP, and you just repeated the error you made there.

End of story.

Join the topic and let your butthurt go.

I did join the topic. All I got was defensiveness, excuse making and OP denial. Butthurt is a bigger problem for you than brainwashing. No one could possibly take your talk of happiness and enlightenment seriously if you can't let it go.

[silverblk mystix]

An OP is an OP, and you just repeated the error you made there.

End of story.


I did join the topic. All I got was defensiveness, excuse making and OP denial. Butthurt is a bigger problem for you than brainwashing. No one could possibly take your talk of happiness and enlightenment seriously if you can't let it go.

Well I am well on the way to doing just that - with Blake teaching me all about true happiness - how can I lose?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

??Read above comments - the labels aren't the problem - the programming/brainwashing is.

So this is us just getting to watch you masturbate. Lovely.

[Blake]

Well I am well on the way to doing just that - with Blake teaching me all about true happiness - how can I lose?

you certainly can't win

[silverblk mystix]

So this is us just getting to watch you masturbate. Lovely.

Did you read Freddie's story?

It is more than witnessing a masturbation - but hey if that is your thing...

[silverblk mystix]

you certainly can't win

I was programmed to lose...

[Blake]

I was programmed to lose...

I think you were born with it

[LnGrrrR]

First of all...did you read Freddie's story?

What is your take on Freddie's story? Any parallels to anyone you know or to your life - if you'd rather reference someone else that is understandable.

Isn't Freddie like most people and Freddie's upbringing very similar to a lot of people (give or take a few details) ?

How are people who know "truth" the unhappiest? I would argue that if it was "truth" they found they are the happiest, the mystics, infants, dogs, creatures, etc....

Actually, I don't think Freddie is like most people at all... Or at least, not like people I have met since high school. Most children who reach puberty tend to ask these sorts of questions and have figured out for themselves what they think is true or not. At least, in the company I keep. Sure, they haven't questioned everything, but they have usually questioned the important things.

And knowing the truth of the world can be pretty ty to be honest. Millions are starving. Multiple people are being raped, murdered etc etc at this very second, and even if you had billions of dollars you still couldn't fix it. There are far more unpleasant truths than pleasant ones. It's one of the few things I think Kierkegaard got right.

[LnGrrrR]

Silverblk, if you really want enlightenment, I might suggest reading up on the topic of projection. You are taking this story and assuming everyone else grows up the same way, and yet everyone in this thread has disagreed with you. You could a) assume we are all colluding to challenge you, which makes no sense, b) in complete denial, which doesn't make much sense either or c) you could be wrong about your brainwashing hypothesis.

If I wrote a story saying how every son grows up to marry a woman like their mother, and multiple people posted that their wives were completely different from their mothers, wouldn't you think it a bit silly if I insisted that, deep down somewhere, their wife DID act like their mother on some subconscious level?

[Woo Bum-kon]

He's arguing like a conspiracy theorist now. The fact that we disagree with him only proves his point further, in his mind. If he is wrong about something, it's because he is brainwashed, too. He also doesn't need to actually read up on any of this, because everybody is brainwashed and can't be right.

[silverblk mystix]

Actually, I don't think Freddie is like most people at all... Or at least, not like people I have met since high school. Most children who reach puberty tend to ask these sorts of questions and have figured out for themselves what they think is true or not. At least, in the company I keep. Sure, they haven't questioned everything, but they have usually questioned the important things.

??(typing on an iPad)... Fair enough...it appears that you have met people who are blissful and happy and are not working and striving because they falsely believe happiness lies somewhere in the future.Amazing. You are living a very charmed life if NONE of the people you know are unhappy. I envy you. You live in a very different world than mine.

And knowing the truth of the world can be pretty ty to be honest. Millions are starving. Multiple people are being raped, murdered etc etc at this very second, and even if you had billions of dollars you still couldn't fix it. There are far more unpleasant truths than pleasant ones. It's one of the few things I think Kierkegaard got right.

??hmmm...well, seems contradictory....if the world you described above is real...where is this sudden unhappiness coming from?
This is not the case at all when true happiness is involved. True happiness is when you have died to everything and you can see yourself and the world clearly....the reality of the world is not going to make you unhappy to think about. This would make you a puppet who was tossed about by external events.

[silverblk mystix]

??

Silverblk, if you really want enlightenment,
????who ever said I was looking for that? Not me. I only wanted to discuss this and before that I was only pointing out how hypocritical it was to bash Christians when no one else is any better.
I might suggest reading up on the topic of projection. You are taking this story and assuming everyone else grows up the same way, and yet everyone in this thread has disagreed with you. You could a) assume we are all colluding to challenge you, which makes no sense, b) in complete denial, which doesn't make much sense either or c) you could be wrong about your brainwashing hypothesis.

??fair enough....no one has to agree....just wanted to have a discussion...if no one knows anyone in their world that is unhappy, that has suffered, that ever had a bad divorce where they suffered- then good for all of you. I envy all of you that live in a world that is perfect with perfectly happy people. I must be the only one who knows people that mistakenly spend their lives chasing money,things,achievements, les, success.
????I never knew I was among people who were completely and perfectly happy here. Amazing.

If I wrote a story saying how every son grows up to marry a woman like their mother, and multiple people posted that their wives were completely different from their mothers, wouldn't you think it a bit silly if I insisted that, deep down somewhere, their wife DID act like their mother on some subconscious level?

Yes, it would and no I am not trying to do that. If Freddie's story didn't resonate with you or with anyone....it is all good, I feel that I represented some common things in a lot of our childhoods.if I was wrong....no worries...thanks for reading. It was informative to me anyway.

[silverblk mystix]

He's arguing like a conspiracy theorist now. The fact that we disagree with him only proves his point further, in his mind. If he is wrong about something, it's because he is brainwashed, too. He also doesn't need to actually read up on any of this, because everybody is brainwashed and can't be right.

Woo- it is all good - you don't have to agree - no one does.

Here is something for you to ponder;

Those Christians that you bash - do you think they were born "christian?" Where did their christian belief come from? They inherited from somewhere.

Yup, programming.

Why don't YOU have that " le?"

Different programming.

Which part of all this did I get wrong from the very beginning?

[Woo Bum-kon]

Those Christians were raised Christian. I was raised Christian, too, and chose not to be Christian anymore. If you want to call it programming, fine. I am not brainwashed. I looked at the religion on my own and saw that it didn't make much sense and had as much evidence supporting it as every other religion.

[silverblk mystix]

Those Christians were raised Christian. I was raised Christian, too, and chose not to be Christian anymore. If you want to call it programming, fine. I am not brainwashed. I looked at the religion on my own and saw that it didn't make much sense and had as much evidence supporting it as every other religion.

Right, so regarding RELIGION, you re-programmed yourself from your previous brainwashing. Outstanding. So this gives you the right to bash others just like you because you re-programmed yourself and can now see how you were blind before - but now you are not brainwashed regarding religion. So you bash them because they haven't yet arrived to where you are-able to see that their Christian BELIEFS are wrong. Fair enough.

So now you are bashing ME because I re-programmed myself in ways that you haven't arrived yet and are still brainwashed by. So now you are bashing someone who is ahead of you on the re-programming ladder.

And I am the hypocrite in this scenario.

Got it.

Thanks.

[silverblk mystix]

Silverblk, if you really want enlightenment, I might suggest reading up on the topic of projection. You are taking this story and assuming everyone else grows up the same way, and yet everyone in this thread has disagreed with you. You could a) assume we are all colluding to challenge you, which makes no sense, b) in complete denial, which doesn't make much sense either or c) you could be wrong about your brainwashing hypothesis.

If I wrote a story saying how every son grows up to marry a woman like their mother, and multiple people posted that their wives were completely different from their mothers, wouldn't you think it a bit silly if I insisted that, deep down somewhere, their wife DID act like their mother on some subconscious level?

I forgot to add;

You must have missed those threads here at Spurstalk - the ones where someone asks , "what is your major?"

and it turns into a bashfest because some people are superior because their "label" or " le" will earn them more money than those they are bashing...

their "programming" didn't tell them that money would make them "superior" and "happier" than those they were bashing...they weren't brainwashed into thinking that their chosen field made them "superior" to other "less reputable" fields....

I guess I am misinformed here.

[Woo Bum-kon]

I am bashing you because your beliefs are stupid and wrong, too, and don't hold up to the tiniest bit of scrutiny.

Your absolute refusal to explain how I am brainwashed or how it is wrong to not believe in something that has no evidence supporting it, only strengthens my belief that you are an idiot who has no idea what he was talking about.

"God exists."

That's a claim. The claim is either true or false, depending on how one defines "God." I am of the opinion that one should believe that that claim is true if, and only if, there is sufficient evidence for it. I have not seen any sufficient evidence for any supernatural definition of God, and I therefore do not believe God exists.

You claim that I am wrong and brainwashed (by?), yet you haven't and will never be able to make a logical argument explaining why.

[LnGrrrR]

Silverblk, happiness is not usually in a permanent state. If one were happy all the time, it would certainly cheapen the experience, I feel. Only by knowing something's opposite can you appreciate it. Regarding le bashing, some careers are certainly considered more "superior" than others. That's why they get paid more by society. It says little about the actual person, but most people understand that the worth of a job is not the measure of the person holding it.

[silverblk mystix]

I am bashing you because your beliefs are stupid and wrong, too, and don't hold up to the tiniest bit of scrutiny.

Did you read Freddie's story? Did it remind you of anyone you know? Were you ever given a list like Freddie's - ie are there things that you feel that you cannot be happy without? Anything you think you need to have in order to be happy?

Your absolute refusal to explain how I am brainwashed or how it is wrong to not believe in something that has no evidence supporting it, only strengthens my belief that you are an idiot who has no idea what he was talking about.

Your above answers should be more helpful than your name calling and judgments.

"God exists."

That's a claim. The claim is either true or false, depending on how one defines "God." I am of the opinion that one should believe that that claim is true if, and only if, there is sufficient evidence for it. I have not seen any sufficient evidence for any supernatural definition of God, and I therefore do not believe God exists.


I understand what you are saying here - but the issue of "god" doesn't apply. Sorry. It just doesn't and there is no scientific evidence to support that there is or isn't.
You are like the little "special" child that has a board with triangles and squares and he is bashing the out of the square peg because it won't fit into the triangle slot...getting angrier and angrier -because he is convinced that it will fit.

Sorry, it won't and you are convinced and brainwashed that your way of thinking - by using conventional rationale will somehow apply to the issue of "god."

You are seriously misguided here.


You claim that I am wrong and brainwashed (by?), yet you haven't and will never be able to make a logical argument explaining why.

The answers are in Freddie's story and how we were programmed. Give it a chance and try to remember how many things you were told you couldn't be happy without.

[silverblk mystix]

Silverblk, happiness is not usually in a permanent state. If one were happy all the time, it would certainly cheapen the experience, I feel. Only by knowing something's opposite can you appreciate it. Regarding le bashing, some careers are certainly considered more "superior" than others. That's why they get paid more by society. It says little about the actual person, but most people understand that the worth of a job is not the measure of the person holding it.

I am at the office working so I will ponder on your statement and get back to you.

[LnGrrrR]

??hmmm...well, seems contradictory....if the world you described above is real...where is this sudden unhappiness coming from?
This is not the case at all when true happiness is involved. True happiness is when you have died to everything and you can see yourself and the world clearly....the reality of the world is not going to make you unhappy to think about. This would make you a puppet who was tossed about by external events.

Why would seeing the world clearly, with all the ugliness that occurs, make one happy? Especially when one is faced with their near complete inability to do anything about it?

[Woo Bum-kon]

Yawn. The idiot cultist again claims that the God claim is exempt from the burden proof without proving why.

[silverblk mystix]

Yawn. The idiot cultist again claims that the God claim is exempt from the burden proof without proving why.

It is in the freddie story...but it would be in later chapters...

[silverblk mystix]

Why would seeing the world clearly, with all the ugliness that occurs, make one happy? Especially when one is faced with their near complete inability to do anything about it?

Didn't say the world condition would make someone happy - the world condition would not make you unhappy either. These are two different things.

A person in the state of true happiness won't be pulled either way...as they say in the east..."all is well...all is well"

Reality is perfect. Reality is not problematic. The problems are in human beings brains. In sleeping humans (or brainwashed- same thing).

[LnGrrrR]

Didn't say the world condition would make someone happy - the world condition would not make you unhappy either. These are two different things.

A person in the state of true happiness won't be pulled either way...as they say in the east..."all is well...all is well"

Reality is perfect. Reality is not problematic. The problems are in human beings brains. In sleeping humans (or brainwashed- same thing).

Seems like a slight abdication of responsbility there. To know about all the world's problems, and not even feel slightly compelled to do one's part to alleviate the suffering... seems callous.

How would you define "perfect"? A mother miscarrying a baby doesn't involve any brainwashing, but I wouldn't say it's perfect. A child that dies at a young age isn't perfect. An old man who suffers painfully into his advanced years isn't perfect.