Nikola Topic

[Mr. Body]

You're right, it certainly can be. But when people seem to go out of the way to ignore his ability to consistently get into the paint at a high rate, and to score at an absurdly high percentage only to point out something like the absence of midrange attempts, I feel like it's a case of looking for flaws over objective analysis. There's probably a pretty good chance that his coaching staff encourages getting to the rim over midrange shots, as it has obviously been a successful strategy the past two seasons.

He definitely can develop a midrange. I guess I'd say he has to develop a jump shot of any kind. This is the problem with what we have to work with. Clips of him blowing by one unathletic guy after another. The optimistic side would say that his compe ion is so bad that he hasn't had to develop any kind of shot whatsoever. The pessimistic side would say those things don't come automatically and if they never develop, what is he? Killian Hayes without the defense?

[exstatic]

I'm not sure why this cannot be a criticism.

If you finish at 65% at the rim, which you get to with ease, why would you ever put up a 45-50% middie?

[baseline bum]

It's a 2 game sample size on a sore knee, so I'm not giving that too much weight. But sure, nothing's guaranteed.

What sore knee? He injured it in the ABA and not in his second Euroleague game?

[exstatic]

He definitely can develop a midrange. I guess I'd say he has to develop a jump shot of any kind. This is the problem with what we have to work with. Clips of him blowing by one unathletic guy after another. The optimistic side would say that his compe ion is so bad that he hasn't had to develop any kind of shot whatsoever. The pessimistic side would say those things don't come automatically and if they never develop, what is he? Killian Hayes without the defense?

He’s not blowing by anyone, even in Europe. He uses footwork, chance pf pace, and body control, all things that can be adapted to the NBA game. Both Doncic and SGA use the same techniques, and to good effect.

[baseline bum]

If you finish at 65% at the rim, which you get to with ease, why would you ever put up a 45-50% middie?

Great so Amen and Ausar never need jumpshots because they could get to the rim in OTE?

[baseline bum]

He’s not blowing by anyone, even in Europe. He uses footwork, chance pf pace, and body control, all things that can be adapted to the NBA game. Both Doncic and SGA use the same techniques, and to good effect.

Both Doncic and SGA have diversified offensive games that don't allow you to load up on stopping one thing.

[Mr. Body]

He’s not blowing by anyone, even in Europe. He uses footwork, chance pf pace, and body control, all things that can be adapted to the NBA game. Both Doncic and SGA use the same techniques, and to good effect.

Brother, watch the next five to eight possessions starting at 4:48. This defense is just trash. Blow by. Blow by. Blow by. Blow by. Trash. Dillingham scoffs at these defenders.

[R. DeMurre]

He definitely can develop a midrange. I guess I'd say he has to develop a jump shot of any kind. This is the problem with what we have to work with. Clips of him blowing by one unathletic guy after another. The optimistic side would say that his compe ion is so bad that he hasn't had to develop any kind of shot whatsoever. The pessimistic side would say those things don't come automatically and if they never develop, what is he? Killian Hayes without the defense?

True, and optimism & pessimism can be very fickle emotions. I agree of course that a wide range of outcomes are possible, but I guess i can't help but take notice when multiple people confidently declare Topic a "non-shooter" despite having an elite 87% FT average, but then calmly say "oh, i have faith that Stephon Castle's 3 point shot will come around." Neither one is guaranteed, but some of the takes on them just seem to be "the guy I like is going to improve and the guy i don't like is going to stay the same, even though he's 18."

[baseline bum]

True, and optimism & pessimism can be very fickle emotions. I agree of course that a wide range of outcomes are possible, but I guess i can't help but take notice when multiple people confidently declare Topic a "non-shooter" despite being an elite 87% FT average, but then calmly say "oh, i have faith that Stephon Castle's 3 point shot will come around." Neither one is guaranteed, but some of the takes on them just seem to be "the guy I like is going to improve and the guy i don't like is going to stay the same, even though he's 18."

I think people trust Castle's work ethic more given what a bulldog he is defensively. It's easy to understand why Dillingham is a horrendous defender but not so much for Topic who has the physical tools to be a good defender but isn't.

[exstatic]

Great so Amen and Ausar never need jumpshots because they could get to the rim in OTE?

Europe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>OTE. I’m also not saying that he won’t need one, just that he doesn’t now.

[R. DeMurre]

I think people trust Castle's work ethic more given what a bulldog he is defensively.

Yeah, that's a good point. I love younger players who work on the defensive side without being prodded. For the record, I hope his shooting comes around, but i just don't buy it as a given.

[baseline bum]

Europe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>OTE. I’m also not saying that he won’t need one, just that he doesn’t now.

Looked like he needed one in Euroleague. Wait now we care again about play in lousy leagues like ABA?

[exstatic]

Looked like he needed one in Euroleague. Wait now we care again about play in lousy leagues like ABA?

It’s unworthy of you to stoop to hysteria like even comparing ABA to OTE. Do better, even if you hate Topic.

[LeBowen]

It’s unworthy of you to stoop to hysteria like even comparing ABA to OTE. Do better, even if you hate Topic.

Topic's team could've had 100% winrate in ABA league if they tried and didn't sit best players.
Meanwhile, they were one of the worst teams in Euroleague.

There's a huge difference between those two leagues.

[exstatic]

Topic's team could've had 100% winrate in ABA league if they tried and didn't sit best players.
Meanwhile, they were one of the worst teams in Euroleague.

There's a huge difference between those two leagues.

There absolutely is a huge difference between the ABA and Overtime Elite.

[LeBowen]

There absolutely is a huge difference between the ABA and Overtime Elite.

I was referring to Euroleague to ABA difference, which is huge.
Maybe not NBA to G-league, but not far off it.

[exstatic]

I was referring to Euroleague to ABA difference, which is huge.
Maybe not NBA to G-league, but not far off it.

You misread the conversation you jumped into. bb was comparing Topic to Ausar and Amen.

[LeBowen]

You misread the conversation you jumped into. bb was comparing Topic to Ausar and Amen.

Somewhat. I was trying to point out that his ABA percentages at the rim aren't as relevant and won't necessarily translate to the NBA.

[baseline bum]

It’s unworthy of you to stoop to hysteria like even comparing ABA to OTE. Do better, even if you hate Topic.

You were lumping in ABA in with with the blanket term Europe like it was some top league. And I don't hate Topic, I'd be willing to take a swing on him at 8 because he has a lot of upside despite not being very good right now. I hate seeing you making Doncic comparisons when Doncic was destroying the same league Topic was putting up 3.5 ppg in.

[duncan2150]

Somewhat. I was trying to point out that his ABA percentages at the rim aren't as relevant and won't necessarily translate to the NBA.

Are they really more revelant in NCAA ?

[couchman]

If Topic is healthy he is a top 3 talent in this draft and imo has a higher ceiling than Risacher and Sarr.
Someone might find themselves with a tremendous gift if he has a significant slide.
His game is not built on athleticism, which means what he does well with hesitation, footwork, and change of pace will likely translate, especially with his size and length. He also sees the floor well so it’s easy to see him as someone who regularly breaks down defenses and sets up teammates.
I believe the outside shot will come because his form looks good.
It all comes down to health.

[BackHome]

I remember some people saying no way Topic could be 6'6 because he looked so small watching vids. But he does looks small but he is legit 6'6 and maybe even 6'7 so he is going up against a lot of guys who are 6'9 to 6'11 and scoring at at the rim at a very high percentage.

[JPB]

I've never been high on Topic, and don't even exclude hecould be relevant in the NBA (although I don't personnally believe he will that much) but the thing is I didn't see anything in his game, as a supposed PG, that really striked or wowed me and let me believe he could even just be a starter in this league...

He didn't show particular atheticism, speed, and before you mention Luka, great shooting or any kind of playmaking, creation skills...He didn't really show me anything actually. And spurs happen to badly need playmaking, creation skills. Topic won't get in the NBA the easy, under the rim layups he got in the ABA... Add his suspect defense and I'm not sure about the point of bringing a non playmaking, non shooting, no defense PG.

then, short sample size but his two terrible, pre-injury Eurolague games are not there to comfort me either. Not every eastern euro PG is Luka. We've seen Risacher put up nice stats in 4 games vs. a top 3 euloeague team, we've even seen Nolan Traoré at 17 perform damn well vs. a Euroleague team... We've seen Topic looking like he didn't belong there, like what worked in the ABA didn't at a bigger stage.

[duncan2150]

I've never been high on Topic, and don't even exclude hecould be relevant in the NBA (although I don't personnally believe he will that much) but the thing is I didn't see anything in his game, as a supposed PG, that really striked or wowed me and let me believe he could even just be a starter in this league...He didn't show particular atheticism, speed, and before you mention Luka, great shooting or any kind of playmaking, creation skills...He didn't really show me anything actually. And spurs happen to badly need playmaking, creation skills. Topic won't get in the NBA the easy, under the rim layups he got in the ABA... Add his suspect defense and I'm not sure about the point of bringing a non playmaking, non shooting, no defense PG. then, short sample size but his two terrible, pre-injury Eurolague games are not there to comfort me either. Not every eastern euro PG is Luka. We've seen Risacher put up nice stats in 4 games vs. a top 3 euloeague team, we've even seen Nolan Traoré at 17 perform damn well vs. a Euroleague team... We've seen Topic looking like he didn't belong there, like what worked in the ABA didn't at a bigger stage.

Why i can understand some of your takes, i still find it crazy that some refers to topic 2 euroleague games post injury where he played like 15 minutes. Unbeliavable imo.

[TD 21]

Topic isn't Doncic not only in caliber, but physique. He's not going to overpower and bully his way to get to his spots and even the latter needed a mid range pullup.

Every lead ball handler needs to be able to score from all three levels (and make all of the reads) so they can punish every p-n-r coverage.

Also, he's obviously not facing the same caliber of athletes/length in Serbia that he will in the NBA and doesn't have explosive athleticism/speed, so the jury is out on his rim pressure too.