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Oh and I'll be back to get ya, whottt.
Hedo was balling this year... it...if they want to trade Hedo...let's get on it then. Hedo can defense...he is custom made to defend guys like Dirk, and Artest and Bonzi...Hedo can get to the basket too. As long as no on dares him to shoot we'll be ok.
The other thing that has changed with the need to be able to play small ball?
We don't need shooting like we used too, especially against the Suns...and AJ aint going to give it to us....besides, we don't have lack shooting anymore, we are loaded with it...what we need is a guy that can force Dirk to play some interior D either with slashing or a post up game...Ariza can to the basket...
Let's Dirk play a little D and see how those legs hold up for those 4th quarter J's...
Oh and I'll be back to get ya, whottt.
That makes more sense (Jax).
If it were to come down to Arriza or Evans, I'd probably go with Arriza. But Evans for 2 mil is a pretty sweet deal. Man, I hate playing small ball.
P.S.
Dirk would guard Bowen, not Ariza.
We are actually going to take a nap, so timvp won't be answering you for a few hours.
So basically TimVP needs his manhood restored after this destruction of his Evans argument...got it. You go girl.
The direction the Spurs go in this offseason really depends on what Pop is going to do in the future. If he's going to ride this small ball wave, then he's going to need a longer 3. If he's going to go with a more traditional lineup, then obviously a typical PF or C would be better.
I'd much rather see a Spurs team that doesn't play small ball. It is one thing to try to matchup, but if your opponent gives you a matchup problem there is a damn good chacne you also present them with a situation they can't cope with. Then at least you can force your will on them as oposed to simply rolling over and trying to beat a team at their own game.
The dream player is a PF who can box out and get a good number of boards but spread the floor as well. Someone who can hit a 15 foot jumpshot with some decent consistency. If the Spurs can bring ina rebounder who can shoot, then we don't need to give into any teams smaller lineups because we'll present a difficult situation on the offenseive end as well.
I just feel that if Pop is really going small next year, theres not a single person out there we can realisitcly get that can help us.
And Hedo. Whottt, you sadden me by suggesting that .
Spurs need a player that will keep Pop out of dumbass mode...I say this player is not Evans, it's Ariza.
And yes...I would take Hedo back at this point...yes he's a choking but since AJ defends the 3 line and the Suns don't defend anything I don't expect this to be an issue, plus Hedo can drive.
We don't need shooting like we used too....if we did, I wouldn't want Hedo.
I don't agree that we don't need Hedo. Dallas is one team. Anyone we play out of the east is going to require we have shooting. You're not going to beat a Detroit or Miami without a good deal of shooting.
Also, if you put a bunch of non shooters in the game, all of a sudden you can't drive and Tim is seeing doubles at an insane pace.
If Tony had been hitting his jumpers at a better rate, our shooters would have been much better situations. The best quaters the Spurs had in the series were when they were able to get a good drive and kick game going after the doubles came on Tim. Shooting is still very much a key in this offense, and we can't start dumping shooters from the lineup.
But Dallas is the team that we can't beat right now...and other teams that will present similar problems in the future...like who guards Amare? Or Artest? or Lamar Odom? Or Tmac? etc...
Shooting we've got it...and we don't have to give any up to get Ariza or Hedo.
It's not our need...and if we give anything up for Hedo it will likely be Rasho...
Who says we have to put a bunch of non shooters on the court? Bruce is a shooter BTW...Parker is good enough and so is Manu..plus we still have Finley, and Horry, and Barry, and Beno.
If Tony had been hitting his jumpers at a better rate, our shooters would have been much better situations. The best quaters the Spurs had in the series were when they were able to get a good drive and kick game going after the doubles came on Tim. Shooting is still very much a key in this offense, and we can't start dumping shooters from the lineup.
This is the first time I've seen it argued that our problems against the Mavs were on offense...we tore them up offensively, and we did it without hitting many threes. The threes we did hit were transitional.
Hedo coming back?
What makes you think he'd want to come back, even if the Spurs wanted him?
And there must be some law of thermodynamics that says that Hedo and Brent Barry cannot be on the same team.
I'm on board with bringing back Hedo. If we just kick a guy to the curb for having a bad shooting playoffs, Horry would be gone from this team twice already. You need closers, but you also need guys to play the rest of the game too.
Everything I've seen points to Hedo having good relations with his former teammates. I haven't seen anything with Pop. It's a fair bet that, had the Spurs had the room, Hedo wold've been kept along with Manu. They had to make a choice.
I'm never really saw much evidence of Ariza being defensively oriented, but I imagine whottt saw more Knick games that I did. Ariza didn't do against Dallas but was very productive late in the season. Hedo blew up in April and played very well against Dallas and Phoenix -- and we all know about his defense.
At this point, I would rather have Hedo than Rasho or Barry. The money being relatively equal, which would you rather have?
Give him the minutes and Evans will produce. Rodman's was the same with our without Robinson. Great rebounders rebound. Evans got rebounds even when he had another great rebounder (Fortson) next to him.
That's not the stat I was referring to as rebounding rate...
Rebounding rate is the % of available rebounds the player has a legitimate chance of getting to and gets to...
93-94 was in fact the 5th best of Rodman's career, it was a drop from the previous year, as was his RPG total...
Hollinger > whottt
Okay, lets use the basketball-refence stats that you are using (even though I'd trust Hollinger over you). Even if you go by those stats,94-95 actually was Rodman's best year in terms of rebounding rate...there's just one problem with that...he only played in 49 games.
IOW, sticking Rodman next to David Robinson did not help him lead the league in rebounds, nor did it improve his rebounding rate in a provable way..but it did decline the initial year in a provable way.
1992 -- 26.2
1993 -- 26.0
1994 -- 25.7
You are calling that .3 a significant drop?
Ok so Reggie Evans will have a rebounding rate of 23.7 instead of 24
Nazr and Rasho were sucking and Horry wasn't rebounding.Desperate enough to put Nazr, Horry or Rasho in?
Maybe if he had a 6'8 rebounder he'd have options.Ya well...Pop wasn't playing a 6'7 2 guard as his PF...
Didn't have a rebounder who could play against quick players, obviously.No desperate enough to play a rebounder...obviously.
Not according to Hollinger.Wrong and wrong...again, the first year was the 5th best of his career, the second year was indeed the best...but again, he missed nearly half the season.
Whoops.
And after the 1995 season, the next four seasons were all very close together. Don't act there was a significant rise or drop before or after he was with the Spurs.
Show me a rebounder the Spurs had who could stay with the Mavs' quick lineup.Potentially Pop may not value those rebounds enough to play him...still want to argue this? I sugges you take a look at the past playoffs and Pop's history of stubborness if you still think his ability to help the team is based on anything more than potential.
I don't think Nazr dunked since the All-Star break. Nazr had no chance to guard Dirk. Dirk is a 7-foot-1 shooting guard. Nazr would have been eaten alive.Nazr the offensive rebounding machine and dunk threat could have certainly given Dirk more problems than Finley...
Name the rebounding power forward the Spurs had who could have helped.You'd think he would...but he didn't want to fix it bad enough to actually put a rebounder in the game...instead he tried to turn a collection of 2 guards into Bill Russel.
It solves the rebounding problem. That problem trumps all the other problems.It doesn't solve our matchup problems with the Mavs....it doesn't solve our aging and size perimeter D problem.
Our biggest problem.
I've never seen Duncan lead the league in rebounding like David did before and after Rodman.Yes, just like that in fact...moreso...because Duncan is a better rebounder than Drob was and Drob was busy doing everything else those two years anyway.
Play Nazr those minutes against a team like the Mavs and he will clean glass too, he'll also block some shots, and get some dunks...
Nazr would get abused on every play or else you'd have to put Duncan on Dirk and then Duncan is fouled out by halftime. You seem to think Nazr is good. You must have missed the end of the season and the playoffs.
Reggie Evans always rebounds. Nazr doesn't.Nazr can be a dumbass...and so can Reggie Evans. Don't act like he's Robert Horry...he's not.
Reggie Evans is quick.Not if he sits as much as Nazr did...which is possible, since he can't defend any better has no offensive ability and is just as capable of being a dumbass as Nazr.
Nazr isn't.
We've got all sorts of PF and C prospects...
What we do not have, is a long SF capable of defeding the big ass perimeter players in the NBA.
So you cry your whole post about Pop playing small ball and then you want a small forward to play power forward in small ball next year. Isn't that what lost it this year?
Uh, yeah he did. He played one minute and started an 8-0 run.Nazr can suck...he can also go off...he never go the chance in the Mavs series.
That was enough of a look.
And you come up with a restrictive free agent who is a 20 year old small forward. That's what you want to go to war with?Too slow, too much of a dumbass, likely too expensive, not good enough. Not what we need here.
Where are the other names? I see you happened to forget to quote that part of my post
Again, I don't want a small forward playing power forward again next playoffs. The Spurs need to have a real power forward. Dallas has Dirk. Miami has Haslem. The Pistons have Wallace. The Suns have Diaw, Marion and next year Amare. The Spurs can't counter with a small forward. You are just setting yourself up for another playoff disaster.We need a long SF that can be played at the PF position in a small ball lineup, defense is a premium, the ability to take advantage of Dirk on offense would be nice as well, Ariza has the skill set to do both of these things...and he's a pretty decent rebunder for a 21 year old. This is the only way to short circuit Pop's stubborness...and btw Ariza has shown rebounding potential
The Spurs need a power forward who can play power forward. I don't know what is so hard to understand. And this player has to do one thing well ... rebound. Yeah, I wish the person was a three point shooting, Magic Johnson passing, Mark Eaton shotblocking machine, but there's nothing like that on the market. Reggie Evans fills the Spurs major need and that is rebounding.
A 20 year old small forward is not who I want going against Dirk or Amare or Haslem or Wallace.
Come on now. Stop thinking like a loser.
You know the Spurs can't win a championship if they are outrebounded 11 of 12 playoff games. Fix the problem. Get a power forward who can play power forward and rebound.
Reggie Evans is that man.
Too much information....and he can score on Dirk's ass.
Just like I told you. The Magic aren't going to give away Ariza. To get him you'd have to throw your entire MLE at him.
And even then, it's not a guarantee. The Spurs have signed and gotten a grand total of zero ( 0 ) restricted free agents in their history. They've won three championships. They've gotten zero restricted free agents in history.
Think realistic. Think logical. Think about what the Spurs need.
Reggie Evan in Oh Seven.
Reggie Evans makes sense on multiple levels. He fills a need, he's underappreciated around the league, and his price will be (relatively) low. Sounds a bit like Bruce before the Spurs signed him to a minimum contract.
Grabbing someone in the nutsack is definitely a step in the right direction if Evans wants to be a modern day Worm.
But seriously Evans is a monster on the boards.... probably the best in the league.... and no body knows it.
I am really into the idea of having one of the best rebounders joining our team.
I would like to know how his 1-1 defense is and if he is able to be a effective team defender. What do you think, I haven't seen him play for a while.
It would be great to see the Spurs get Evans' rebounding.
The main thing that worries me is that it gives other teams the easy double team on Tim again. The best part of the Dallas series was watching Tim with 4 guys around him who could shoot and space the floor. We haven't had that in a long time, and it was awesome watching him turn into a one-man wrecking crew on offense.
I know that guys like Al Harrington are a damn pipe dream, but if we could just find a PF with decent range somehow....
Last edited by strangeweather; 06-01-2006 at 11:00 AM.
I think the Spurs are ideally suited for small ball, if they can get the right player they will pose acious matchups for most teams. One MAJOR advantage they have in small ball is their big, Duncan, is a top of the line big on both sides of the floor. There are VERY few teams that have that player. What they need is a good big SF/small PF type like Odom, Kirilenko, Harrington, a guy that can rebound, play good D and has offensive skills. Not that they can get that player but if they can they are going to be killas. They still have the slugs in Rasho and probably Javtokas to wrestle with the few decent offensive bigs like Shaq and Yao. Think against the Mavs if they had been able to put a Kirilenko/Odom type on the floor against Dirk and Diop or Damp.
I keep thinking about Pop's statement that he's looking for a Derrick McKey-type. Of all the players of recent vintage to choose, McKey is an interesting player to model your search on.
Pop may have been talking out of his ass, but I doubt it. Frankly, I think Pop has someone specific in mind -- someone he thinks is similar in stature and game to McKey. And, clearly, the intent is that whoever it is will come here to be a defensive-minded role player and little more. It's not about finding a guy with offensive range who can spread the floor. It's about finding a guy who won't get in the way too much and will take only good shots on the offensive end, while providing a long defensive presence that can make a difference against big, athletic players. Again, I don't know if Reggie Evans is that guy, but he'd certainly give them some much-needed rebounding help.
On a side note, Evans makes more sense if you find it hard to believe that Pop would rely on both Javtokas and Scola as rookies in the same season. I think that much rookie play would be more than Pop could handle.
I don't have a clear memory of McKey's game, but databasebasketball has him scoring 12-16 points a year through age 29, which sounds like a lot more offense than Evans brings.
I just wonder if we should look at someone like Darius Songalia -- he only rebounds about like Rasho, but he can hit jumpshots decently.
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