Top 30 NBA Spurs (Updated every Sunday)

[wildbill2u]

Part of the problem with a list like this is that it gets mixed up with at several rating factors that are problematical in themselves:

1. A player's career elsewhere vs. contribution to the Spurs.
2. A player who played on championship teams.
3. A single play or failure that marked the player's contribution to the Spurs.

In category 1, let's put John Lucas, Rod Strickland, mings as NBA stars on other teams and even Kenon, Gilmore, Del Negro and Silas whose play was mostly in the ABA. Some players luster is enhanced by career stats, but they may have been lesser players as Spurs. How do you put Del Negro on the list and leave off Lucas or Strickland if you're rating players? Oviously, in that case you're rating longevity vs. talent.

In category 2, you have players like Kerr and Elie who contributed to championships although they might not have been super as individual players for the Spurs or even played with the Spurs for many seasons. I'm sure Elie considers himself a Rocket first and foremost. Did he contribute to a championship, yes, but so did Sean Marks if that is the only criteria. Does one championship season put an Elie above a long term player who contributed season after season? How do you estimate that in the ratings?

Category 3 is probably the least importatant if you consider the player's overall career with the Spurs and in the NBA, but a single play--or failure to make the play-- indelibly prints itself onto our consciouness about the 'greatness' of a player as a Spur.

Horry is venerated for turning around a playoff series with one shot; Rod Strickland made a bad pass in the waning seconds of a playoff series and was the villain who 'lost' the playoffs. If either play was reversed, so would the 'greatness' of the player on the Spurs all time heroes list. Imagine if Strickland makes the play and the Spurs go on to win the championship. He was acknowleged as one of the best PGs in the league and as a hero, he would have been on the list. Now he's a footnote to failures and not even on the list.

[Spurs Brazil]

The top 30 NBA Spurs: No. 8 - Larry Kenon

Web Posted: 02/25/2007 01:00 AM CST


San Antonio Express-News

Thirty years ago, in 1976, the Spurs played their first season in the NBA after being absorbed into the older league along with three other teams from the American Basketball Association. To commemorate the milestone, the Express-News each Sunday will recognize our selections as the 30 greatest NBA Spurs. Here is No. 8:
Larry Kenon, 1975-80: Another player who helped the Spurs make a smooth transition from the ABA to the NBA, Kenon was the left hook to George Gervin's right cross in the Spurs' 1-2 scoring punch during their first four NBA seasons.


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Though he never led the Spurs in scoring — always No.2 behind Gervin — and does not appear in the club's all-time top 10 in games played, he ranks sixth all-time in points scored (6,733). He averaged 21.2 points per game in the four NBA seasons with the Spurs.

He is one of five players in Spurs history to score more than 50 points in a game, with 51 against the Pistons on March 30, 1980, one of the last games he would play for the Spurs.

The 6-fooot-9 forward known as "Special K" also was a workhorse rebounder. He ranks fifth on the Spurs' all-time rebound list (3,217), and led the team in rebounding each of the four NBA seasons he played in San Antonio. He averaged 11.3 rebounds in 1976-77, which ranked 10th in the league.

A two-time NBA All-Star, he was a key performer in the Spurs' run to the Eastern Conference finals in 1979, averaging 21.1 points.

Kenon departed San Antonio after the 1979-80 season, signing as a free agent with the Bulls.



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Visit the Spurs page on MySA.com for Nos. 30-8.

[SenorSpur]

Absolutely loved Larry Kenon. He was a true example as to how rebounding was about heart and desire as much as it was positioning and ability. Sure he was 6'9", but he was a skinny beanpole who could run the floor with the grace of a gazelle.

For those who are Special K afficiandos like me, you'll remember one of his signature specialty moves was to soar high for a one-hand defensive rebound and start the break himself! Usually finishing with a thunderous dunk on the other end.

[aaronstampler]

1) Duncan 2) Robinson 3) Gervin 4) Ginobili 5) Parker 6) Elliott, guaranteed.

[wildbill2u]

Absolutely loved Larry Kenon. He was a true example as to how rebounding was about heart and desire as much as it was positioning and ability. Sure he was 6'9", but he was a skinny beanpole who could run the floor with the grace of a gazelle.

For those who are Special K afficiandos like me, you'll remember one of his signature specialty moves was to soar high for a one-hand defensive rebound and start the break himself! Usually finishing with a thunderous dunk on the other end.

I also remember Kenon as a ball-hawking defensive player. I think he got something like 8 steals in one game. (somebody will probably have access to a site with better memory and prove me wrong)

And when he got the steal, he was off to the races. He was exceptionally swift in moving with the ball on the break.

Kenon still works and lives in SA. Last I heard he was still a successful car salesman out at the Lincoln-Mercury dealership.

[ShoogarBear]

Kenon holds the NBA records for steals with 11, set against (I think) the KC-Omaha Royals.

I had also read somewhere that his daughter was a top-notch HS volleyball player.

[samikeyp]

You are correct Shoog...December 1976 at the Kings.

[FromWayDowntown]

For the record, Kenon is #7 on the list, not #8.

The list as it stands
7. Larry Kenon
8. Avery Johnson
9. James Silas
10. Alvin Robertson
11. Mike Mitc
12. Artis Gilmore
13. Johnny Moore
14. Bruce Bowen
15. Malik Rose
16. Terry mings
17. Billy Paultz
18. Dennis Rodman
19. Robert Horry
20. Mark Olberding
21. Steve Kerr
22. Vinny Del Negro
23. Mario Elie
24. Gene Banks
25. Mike Gale
26. Chuck Person
27. Coby Dietrick
28. Dave Corzine
29. Willie Anderson
30. Stephen Jackson



I think Elliott will end up at 4, Ginobili at 5, and Parker at 6. Gervin is a mortal lock to be 3. The question between 1 and 2 (or 1 and 1(a)) is whether keeping the franchise in San Antonio and single-handedly making the team a championship contender will outstrip 3 rings, 3 Finals MVP trophies, and 2 MVPs (along with everything else). My guess is that it won't; that Duncan will be #1 and Dave will be #2.

[jcrod]

For the record, Kenon is #7 on the list, not #8.

The list as it stands
7. Larry Kenon
8. Avery Johnson
9. James Silas
10. Alvin Robertson
11. Mike Mitc
12. Artis Gilmore
13. Johnny Moore
14. Bruce Bowen
15. Malik Rose
16. Terry mings
17. Billy Paultz
18. Dennis Rodman
19. Robert Horry
20. Mark Olberding
21. Steve Kerr
22. Vinny Del Negro
23. Mario Elie
24. Gene Banks
25. Mike Gale
26. Chuck Person
27. Coby Dietrick
28. Dave Corzine
29. Willie Anderson
30. Stephen Jackson



I think Elliott will end up at 4, Ginobili at 5, and Parker at 6. Gervin is a mortal lock to be 3. The question between 1 and 2 (or 1 and 1(a)) is whether keeping the franchise in San Antonio and single-handedly making the team a championship contender will outstrip 3 rings, 3 Finals MVP trophies, and 2 MVPs (along with everything else). My guess is that it won't; that Duncan will be #1 and Dave will be #2.

Robinson also was League Defensive Player, Rebounding Champ, Block Leader and Scoring Leader all things Duncan has yet to do. He was also MVP. I think its 1a and 1b. One is not over the other.

[jcrod]

Oh and before its all said and done, Parker will be over Manu.

[timvp]

I'll guess the Express-News will finish the list off like this:

6) Parker
5) Elliott
4) Ginobili
3) Gervin
2) Robinson
1) Duncan

[timvp]

My main problem with the list so far has been Steve Kerr's placement. He's way, way too high.

Am I the only Spurs fan who remembers he sucked for 99.9% of his time in San Antonio. His first three year stint was a disaster. He couldn't hold down a spot in the rotation and was horrible when called upon in the playoffs.

When he came back to San Antonio, he had his best season. But really, he would have never played in the regular season if Speedy hadn't gotten hurt. In the playoffs in 2003, he had about three quarters in which he played really well. But does that make him the 21st best Spurs player of all-time?

Yeah, right.

[whottt]

You seriously under-rate Kerr's contributions to the 03 le....as well as during that season. Jack had one good year....was it better than any of Kerr's? Yeap. Did he hit that many more big shots than Kerr during the playoffs that year inspite of starting? No he didn't...and he had some clunker perfomances too.

No one remember how poorly Jack shot against LA...

And you are seriously undervaluing Kerr's big shots against the Mavs. Kerr was the key to not having the huge late choke jobs that plagued that team due to offensive stagnation.

Recognize...you act like hitting two 3 pointers in the playoffs is something anyone could do

[whottt]

And there's no way you can rank Duncan ahead of Robinson while Duncan is still playing...

Duncan probably will take it one day, but what Dave did was more than enough to keep the spot while Duncan is active...

Dave gave a career, a complete and total HOF career...and gave SA a great citizen.

Duncan may wind up playing 5 years with the Lakers or something....you definitely can't rank him over Dave while he is playing. And it'll be a close argument even after he retires. I haven't resolved it yet...Dave did a lot.


I think Gervin is 1b as well. I mean he was the one that put SA on the Map in basketball.

[timvp]

You seriously under-rate Kerr's contributions to the 03 le

He had 22 points in 10 games in those playoffs. He had two good games: 12 points in Game 6 against the Mavs and 6 points in Game 5 against the Nets.

That's it. What else did he do? He hit the shots people remember in that Game 6 versus the Mavs, but that comeback was more because of Stephen Jackson and Malik Rose. Kerr just hit the wide open daggers with the worst defender of the century guarding him.

....as well as during that season.

Beno's year last year blows Kerr's 2003 regular season out of the water. In fact, Beno has done more in his three regular seasons with the Spurs than Kerr did.

You look at just the stats and you'd think Beno was the 21st best player in franchise history.

Jack had one good year....was it better than any of Kerr's? Yeap. Did he hit that many more big shots than Kerr during the playoffs that year inspite of starting? No he didn't

Kerr scored 22 points in 10 playoff games that year. Jackson scored 23 points in his first career playoff game for the Spurs that year. In the entire playoffs, Jackson scored 307 points.

Kerr hit 7 shots total. Maybe 4 of those were big shots. If you go back and count, Jackson had at least three or four times that. He had more than 4 big shots just counting Game 6 of the Mavs series and the championship game alone.

...and he had some clunker perfomances too. No one remember how poorly Jack shot against LA...

Kerr had a clunker three year stretch as a Spur. Do you remember how bad Kerr was during the '99 playoff run?

And you are seriously undervaluing Kerr's big shots against the Mavs. Kerr was the key to not having the huge late choke jobs that plagued that team due to offensive stagnation.

Rewatch that game notice how the players who put the Spurs in a position to win the game were Jackson and Rose.

Recognize...you act like hitting two 3 pointers in the playoffs is something anyone could do

I would be surprised by your Kerr love but Kerr is like Shane Heal if Shane Heal had 1.5 good games over a four year playoff stretch.

[ShoogarBear]

I already said before that there is no way Kerr, by any measure you can name, ranks over Elie or Mike Gale or Stephen Jackson. Even if you want to weight everything towards playoff performance, Jackson and Elie rank above Kerr.

, JAREN Jackson ranks above Kerr.

[ShoogarBear]

Kerr just hit the wide open daggers with the worst defender of the century guarding him.

Nash wasn't defending him. He was actually RUNNING AWAY from him.

[whottt]

You act like I didn't watch the Mavs series or something...

Fact is Jackson won some big games, but he also put us in some holes as well...he had 7 TO's in the first half in game 6 VS NJ...c'mon man....get real.

And it's funny that Smitty and Hedo get bagged on for choking ass against the Lakers but Jack gets a free pass for making them look like Jordan against LA.

True, he was being defended and they weren't....but he was invisible against LA.


Put it this way...Kerr did contribute to other championship teams...Jack hasn't done except his teams over.


You saying you'd take Jack's career over Kerr's?

I wouldn't.

Jack's career is disappointing other than his year with the Spurs....Kerr overachieved.


A bigger travesty is Vinny Del Negro's ranking....

Rod Strickland deserves to be on this list before Vinny.

Kerr played an invaluable role in 03...stop the hate.

I agree he's not the 21st best Spur in history...but you guys are trying to downplay his contributions...he made definite contributions to that LE, that puts him over a lot of players that had better statistical careers for this team. Add to that that he was popular in town while...

Never mind.


Kerr's ranking is as justified as Mister AJ's. Yannow....mascot like popularity goes a long way. I shouldn't have to explain that to a couple of members of the AJ Jersey Retirement Commitee....

[timvp]

You act like I didn't watch the Mavs series or something...

Not even really the Mavs series. More like the one game. Kerr didn't do anything the rest of the series.

Fact is Jackson won some big games, but he also put us in some holes as well...he had 7 TO's in the first half in game 6...c'mon man....get real.

How many games did Kerr win in his four years in the playoffs with the Spurs? Maybe one? Probably more like zero. The Spurs were winning that game before Kerr put in the daggers.

And it's funny that Smitty and Hedo get bagged on for choking ass against the Lakers but Jack gets a free pass for making them look like Jordan against LA.

True, he was being defended and they weren't....but he was invisible against LA.

It's true that Jackson sucked against the Lakers. But I know that you know that Phil Jackson wasn't going to let Jack get open shots. Phil is the master at figuring out the other team's chokers and making them beat his teams. Stephen Jackson has a lot of holes in his game, but hitting wide open pressure shots isn't one of them.

Put it this way...Kerr did contribute to other championship teams...Jack hasn't done except his teams over.

You saying you'd take Jack's career over Kerr's?

I wouldn't.

Jack's career is disappointing other than his year with the Spurs....Kerr overachieved.

This list is about the best Spurs of all-time ... not a list of who had the best careers who also happened to play for the Spurs.

I agree that Kerr had the better career. Five championship rings. Probably earned three and a half of those. Jackson's career, on the other hand, pretty much ended the day his agent forced him out of San Antonio.

But looking just at their San Antonio careers, Jackson was waaay better while Kerr is closer to Beno level than he is Top 20 level. If Beno stayed in San Antonio long enough, he too might hit a couple big shots in a game in the playoffs.

A bigger travesty is Vinny Del Negro's ranking....

Vinny Del Negro >>>> Steve Kerr. Del Negro pretty much sucked but his stats destroyed any stats Kerr ever put up. 1.5 good playoff games over 4 years doesn't change the fact that Kerr put up worse stats in his time with the Spurs than Beno Udrih.

Rod Strickland deserves to be on this list before Vinny.

Strickland >>>> Kerr.

Kerr played an invaluable role in 03...stop the hate.

2.2 points per game. You can put a value on that.

I agree he's not the 21st best Spur in history...but you guys are trying to downplay his contributions...he made definite contributions to that LE, that puts him over a lot of players that had better statistical careers for this team. Add to that that he was popular in town while...

Never mind.

Kerr goes down as probably a top ten most popular Spur of all-time. That's the only reason he would ever make a list like this.

If Vinny Del Negro was as well liked and did TV after his retirement, he'd be way ahead of Kerr in a list.

Kerr's ranking is as justified as Mister AJ's. Yannow....mascot like popularity goes a long way. I shouldn't have to explain that to a couple of members of the AJ Jersey Retirement Commitee.

If AJ hit threes he'd be your favorite player.

Don't lie.

[ShoogarBear]

Put it this way...Kerr did contribute to other championship teams...Jack hasn't done except his teams over.


You saying you'd take Jack's career over Kerr's?

I wouldn't.

Jack's career is disappointing other than his year with the Spurs....Kerr overachieved.

And how does any of this have anything to do with ranking their contributions to the Spurs?

A bigger travesty is Vinny Del Negro's ranking....

Rod Strickland deserves to be on this list before Vinny.

Maybe, but not the point of discussion.

Kerr played an invaluable role in 03...stop the hate.

I agree he's not the 21st best Spur in history

Then what exactly are we doing here?

...but you guys are trying to downplay his contributions...he made definite contributions to that LE, that puts him over a lot of players that had better statistical careers for this team. Add to that that he was popular in town while...

If by "downplaying his contributions" means saying that he isn't the 21st greatest Spur, then you are correct. But isn't that what you just did?

If you want to talk about career contributions to the team and community, then Mike Gale ranks above him. If you want to talk about big games in the playoffs, then both Jaren and SJax rank above him. He's ridiculously overrated on this list.

[timvp]

Kerr as a Spur
2603 minutes
761 points
188 assists
.417 field goal percentage

Beno as a Spur
2449 minutes
1001 points
335 assists
.424 field goal percentage

Either Beno is a top ten Spur of all-time or Kerr is seriously overrated in this list.

[whottt]

I don't think you two are deliberately trying to have a bad argument...you just can't help yourselves.

Youy are trying to rate Kerr based on statistical production when in fact, his inclusion on this list is because of a handful of big shots and popularity....and I'd argue that whether or not his ranking is in error, I doubt we win the le that year without him.

You aren't even remembering the incident against the Mavs that got him off the bench...when everyone was choking their throws and Duncan flat out told Pop to put him in the game...

Little things like that...Kerr was an invaluable steadying influcent on a team that was heavily reliant on some young and inconsistent players....what was he during the playoffs that year? Consistent...when he was put in, he hit his shots. This team would have about 5 more les right now had it had simple contributions like that in some other years of Robinson and Duncan's careers.

We might have beaten the Lakers in 2002 if we had Kerr(and Pop had played him).

Kerr had one truly ty year here...98-99...the rest of the time Pop just wouldn't play him. It wasn't until Mo Cheeks played him against us and he tore us a new asshole that Pop realized guys who can hit open shots are good to have around.

And if not for Duncan I doubt Pop would have played him in 03...

Just because Pop doesn't play the guys don't mean they suck....Horry didn't give us a game 5 VS Det last year because he wasn't on the court to do it...

[timvp]

Kerr as a Spur in the playoffs
244 minutes
76 points
20 assists
.409 field goal percentage

Beno as a Spur in the playoffs
289 minutes
103 points
30 assists
.352 field goal percentage

Playoff studs.

[Kori Ellis]

Kerr's ranking is obviously just based on the game against the Mavs and the fact that he was very popular here. (And still is, despite the fact he chose to be affiliated with the Suns rather than the Spurs upon retirement.)

He never did much in a Spurs uniform, other than helping the Spurs win that game (and consequently series).

I just think that LJ/Shoog are saying that other Spurs deserve to be ranked higher.

I also think Whottt is one of those unathletic white guys (that relates to Kerr) who was calling into the radio station for years saying, "Why doesn't Pop play Steve Kerr more?"

[ShoogarBear]

We said Kerr was overrated at #21.

You argued with us, and THEN AGREED.

Who has the bad argument?