Page 5 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 101 to 125 of 139
  1. #101
    Spur-taaaa TDMVPDPOY's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Post Count
    41,330
    lol the beverly interview on espn...talks like a true hater on forums...

  2. #102
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Post Count
    3,379
    I’m surprised in the interest in Ayton for max money. He probably gets it but I’d prefer Lavine 10x if we could.
    What?! No way. It's been a crazy collapse for the Suns, but the even crazier thing has been seeing a literal one-game sample affect a players' stock so much, especially such a young one as Ayton with his whole career ahead of him still. Even a homerist place like ST was collectively agreed that getting Ayton was a pipe-dream and impossible as recently as last week...

    ..And now he's not even worth it? Especially not over freakin' Lavine of all players?! Zach, who'll be turning 28, has multiple knee issues/surgeries in his past whilst having an entirely athleticism-based game as a guard, has never been The Guy on any remotely successful team, is due for yet another knee surgery this off-season... And you'd max him, "10x" over, over the 23yo, #1 pick, do-it-all, switchable on defense, efficient scoring, athletic, and most of all buildable/malleable, center?!?

    Recency bias is absolutely real and clouding your judgment, my guy. I ask this same question last week and it's not even a debate. I don't care how DA played last game, that he didn't want to come on the court (of course he wasn't gonna risk his entire bag over a 40pt blowout...), whatever . You max him (it's not even a supermax!! Lavine costs significantly more money!!!), then figure it out later.

  3. #103
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Post Count
    3,379
    Mo Bamba is Lonnie walker. Same draft. Same potential. Ayton rookie year is better than Bamba 4th. Bamba doesn't start off isaac was playing.
    Thank you. Finally some rationale. Bamba is nowhere close to Ayton's ceiling (or floor, game 7 notwithstanding). Talk about talking yourself into a "Costco Kobe" kind of player...

  4. #104
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    5,327
    What?! No way. It's been a crazy collapse for the Suns, but the even crazier thing has been seeing a literal one-game sample affect a players' stock so much, especially such a young one as Ayton with his whole career ahead of him still. Even a homerist place like ST was collectively agreed that getting Ayton was a pipe-dream and impossible as recently as last week...

    ..And now he's not even worth it? Especially not over freakin' Lavine of all players?! Zach, who'll be turning 28, has multiple knee issues/surgeries in his past whilst having an entirely athleticism-based game as a guard, has never been The Guy on any remotely successful team, is due for yet another knee surgery this off-season... And you'd max him, "10x" over, over the 23yo, #1 pick, do-it-all, switchable on defense, efficient scoring, athletic, and most of all buildable/malleable, center?!?

    Recency bias is absolutely real and clouding your judgment, my guy. I ask this same question last week and it's not even a debate. I don't care how DA played last game, that he didn't want to come on the court (of course he wasn't gonna risk his entire bag over a 40pt blowout...), whatever . You max him (it's not even a supermax!! Lavine costs significantly more money!!!), then figure it out later.
    Didn’t like Ayton before and don’t now. The 20mm amortized over 4 years with a rising cap means nothing. If PATFO can get comfortable with Lavine’s knee I stand by that choice. I’ve also qualified my position on Lavine as making sense in an outright signing versus giving assets in an S&T. Ayton will cost considerably more via S&T given his RFA status.

    Additionally, Lavine’s 3pt shooting is elite and not entirely athleticism based as you claim.
    Last edited by KingKev; 05-17-2022 at 03:19 PM.

  5. #105
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    14,005
    I can't believe I'm going to have to root for the fvcking Mavericks now versus the Warriors. But that's what this season has left me with.

  6. #106
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    14,005
    And the Mavs played great. Caught the Suns flat-footed and thoroughly and completely shut down CP3. A great coaching job by J. Kidd, thoroughly outcoaching Monty Williams...which is something I really never expected to say.

  7. #107
    Veteran spurs10's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Post Count
    10,605
    I can't believe I'm going to have to root for the fvcking Mavericks now versus the Warriors. But that's what this season has left me with.
    Yeah rooting for the Mavs is hard to wrap my head around for sure.....but I surely will.

    Wow what a blow out for the Suns...timvp is not holding back.

  8. #108
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    7,878
    Is the hate for GSW over Dallas really justified? Not that i particularly like GSW, but i still remember the rivalry with Dallas quite vividly (i.e., 2006)

  9. #109
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Post Count
    3,379
    Is the hate for GSW over Dallas really justified? Not that i particularly like GSW, but i still remember the rivalry with Dallas quite vividly (i.e., 2006)
    I was about to say something similar. I don't understand the Mavs-siding here. Yes the Dubs are annoying and the KD era was awful, but they're back to the "old core" now, and quite the likeable, homegrown, done-it-right team, TBH. Poole emerging has been very interesting to see, and the whole "one last job" thing they've got going on is very entertaining. I wouldn't mind seeing them win one last time (and then fade out into the sunset, hopefully...) at all.

    On the other hand, I don't have much beef with the Mavs either, it's not a real rivalry as far as the Spurs are concerned (not close to Suns level, that's for sure), so I'm pretty neutral on the series overall, and would've thought most of ST would be as well.

  10. #110
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Post Count
    3,379
    Didn’t like Ayton before and don’t now. The 20mm amortized over 4 years with a rising cap means nothing. If PATFO can get comfortable with Lavine’s knee I stand by that choice. I’ve also qualified my position on Lavine as making sense in an outright signing versus giving assets in an S&T. Ayton will cost considerably more via S&T given his RFA status.

    Additionally, Lavine’s 3pt shooting is elite and not entirely athleticism based as you claim.
    Ah, you just plain dislike DA, that's fair. I don't believe the difference between Lavine's and Ayton's maxes would be "nothing" (it never is when you're building a contender and the margin of error/salary shifting gets closer and closer) but also don't have the actual numbers to compare, I'm no capologist.

    I think it's less about PATFO being "comfortable" with Zach's knee, and more about the situation overall. I'm not fine with that knee, lol. Especially not with his history and another (granted, a debrilement, not a repair, but still) surgery already lined up, before we get to see him play again. And as you say, it's wholly different scenarios between S&Ts and outright signing either player; but on a vacuum, I think Ayton is clearly a step above Lavine as far as "FAs to go after". I just don't see the argument against DA, that you also can't make about ZL (not the #1 option on the team, not really worth the max, etc).

    Lavine's shooting is definitely elite - but that's not what his game is based on, is it? Would you pay Lavine the max to be a spot-up 3pt shooter, if his knee was bad enough that he couldn't blow by defenders anymore, and couldn't penetrate to score nor dish out assists? no. That's my concern. Maybe not next year, not immediately, but down the line; and I say this with the knowledge that the Spurs, as-is, simply aren't ready for a le run. Not next season and probably not the one afterwards, either. That definitely matters when you're picking out the core pieces of the will-be team, and is a big reason Ayton >> Lavine, IMO at least.

  11. #111
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    93,154
    What?! No way. It's been a crazy collapse for the Suns, but the even crazier thing has been seeing a literal one-game sample affect a players' stock so much, especially such a young one as Ayton with his whole career ahead of him still. Even a homerist place like ST was collectively agreed that getting Ayton was a pipe-dream and impossible as recently as last week...
    Agreed. Ayton had to be thinking this place, Sarver doesn't want to pay me, I'm out of here after tonight. If Paul with his $90 million due and Booker with his $70 million due from the Suns could quit Ayton had to be thinking what's the point by the end of the second quarter.

  12. #112
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    5,327
    Ah, you just plain dislike DA, that's fair. I don't believe the difference between Lavine's and Ayton's maxes would be "nothing" (it never is when you're building a contender and the margin of error/salary shifting gets closer and closer) but also don't have the actual numbers to compare, I'm no capologist.

    I think it's less about PATFO being "comfortable" with Zach's knee, and more about the situation overall. I'm not fine with that knee, lol. Especially not with his history and another (granted, a debrilement, not a repair, but still) surgery already lined up, before we get to see him play again. And as you say, it's wholly different scenarios between S&Ts and outright signing either player; but on a vacuum, I think Ayton is clearly a step above Lavine as far as "FAs to go after". I just don't see the argument against DA, that you also can't make about ZL (not the #1 option on the team, not really worth the max, etc).

    Lavine's shooting is definitely elite - but that's not what his game is based on, is it? Would you pay Lavine the max to be a spot-up 3pt shooter, if his knee was bad enough that he couldn't blow by defenders anymore, and couldn't penetrate to score nor dish out assists? no. That's my concern. Maybe not next year, not immediately, but down the line; and I say this with the knowledge that the Spurs, as-is, simply aren't ready for a le run. Not next season and probably not the one afterwards, either. That definitely matters when you're picking out the core pieces of the will-be team, and is a big reason Ayton >> Lavine, IMO at least.
    I’m just not a proponent of paying 30mm plus for a traditional big when I think Jak can give you a similar skill set for 30-50% of the price.

    A healthy Lavine gives you the elite scoring we so sorely need and when you couple Ayton’s contract with the cost of acquisition (probably some combo of Jak, Vassell, JRich and an FRP) its a no for me.

  13. #113
    Dyna5ty BatManu20's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Post Count
    34,181

  14. #114
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    93,154
    I’m just not a proponent of paying 30mm plus for a traditional big when I think Jak can give you a similar skill set for 30-50% of the price.

    A healthy Lavine gives you the elite scoring we so sorely need and when you couple Ayton’s contract with the cost of acquisition (probably some combo of Jak, Vassell, JRich and an FRP) its a no for me.
    No way you're re-signing Poetl for 30-50% of Ayton's salary in the summer of 2023.

  15. #115
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    5,327
    No way you're re-signing Poetl for 30-50% of Ayton's salary in the summer of 2023.
    15 vs 30… he can be extended this offseason for 4yrs/50mm.

    what do you think he gets away from us?

  16. #116
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    14,005
    I was about to say something similar. I don't understand the Mavs-siding here. Yes the Dubs are annoying and the KD era was awful, but they're back to the "old core" now, and quite the likeable, homegrown, done-it-right team, TBH. Poole emerging has been very interesting to see, and the whole "one last job" thing they've got going on is very entertaining. I wouldn't mind seeing them win one last time (and then fade out into the sunset, hopefully...) at all.

    On the other hand, I don't have much beef with the Mavs either, it's not a real rivalry as far as the Spurs are concerned (not close to Suns level, that's for sure), so I'm pretty neutral on the series overall, and would've thought most of ST would be as well.
    It's really three things for me with Golden State. First, I'm hoping the Warriors don't get too far ahead of the Spurs in overall le count. The ZaZa incident is my number two reason to always hate the Warriors. And the national media attention the Warriors get, even when they suck, is outdone only by the Lakers. That also makes me kind of despise them.

    I like Steve Kerr. I think he's a very good coach. But beyond that I can't cheer for them.

  17. #117
    Kill4Fun SpurSpike's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Post Count
    831
    Is the hate for GSW over Dallas really justified? Not that i particularly like GSW, but i still remember the rivalry with Dallas quite vividly (i.e., 2006)
    I respect the team that they have built but personally i just don't like the at ude that golden states plays with. The mouth chewing the, nut kicking (though that has been toned down this year) and the general sense of arrogance and superiority. They are not a likable humble team.

  18. #118
    Dyna5ty BatManu20's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Post Count
    34,181

  19. #119
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    93,154
    15 vs 30… he can be extended this offseason for 4yrs/50mm.

    what do you think he gets away from us?
    I'd imagine Poetl might be able to pull a deal starting at $25 million for the first season, something like 4 years, $110 million when you factor in 6% raises. 4 years, $50 million would be selling himself way short of his market value. There is no way he's worth less than McDermott.

  20. #120
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    5,327
    I'd imagine Poetl might be able to pull a deal starting at $25 million for the first season, something like 4 years, $110 million when you factor in 6% raises. 4 years, $50 million would be selling himself way short of his market value. There is no way he's worth less than McDermott.
    That is quite the imagination.

  21. #121
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    93,154
    That is quite the imagination.
    You think he's worth less than Doug McDermott? He has become a pretty high quality center who will be 27 next summer and the salary cap will probably be $130 million or so for 2023-24.

  22. #122
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    93,154
    I respect the team that they have built but personally i just don't like the at ude that golden states plays with. The mouth chewing the, nut kicking (though that has been toned down this year) and the general sense of arrogance and superiority. They are not a likable humble team.
    Good teams are arrogant as a lot of the time, from Bird's Celtics to Jordan's Bulls to the Shaq & Kobe Lakers to LeBron's Heat to Curry's Warriors. I can't hate on good teams just for having a different personality than Tim's.

  23. #123
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    5,327
    You think he's worth less than Doug McDermott? He has become a pretty high quality center who will be 27 next summer and the salary cap will probably be $130 million or so for 2023-24.
    McDermott was then, and is now a terrible contract so I don’t understand the comparison.

    I think similar comps are less than Jarrett Allen recently received, less than what Jonas will receive this offseason and not far from what Steven Adams will get in the same free agency period.

    15mm or so…

  24. #124
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    93,154
    McDermott was then, and is now a terrible contract so I don’t understand the comparison.

    I think similar comps are less than Jarrett Allen recently received, less than what Jonas will receive this offseason and not far from what Steven Adams will get in the same free agency period.

    15mm or so…
    Vucevic makes $24 million. Lauri Markkanen's scrub ass makes $17 million a year. Jarett Allen should fire his agent for only getting $20 million a year and no raises.

  25. #125
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    5,327
    Vucevic makes $24 million. Lauri Markkanen's scrub ass makes $17 million a year. Jarett Allen should fire his agent for only getting $20 million a year and no raises.
    Both bad comparisons. Mark is a bad contract and everyone knows that.

    Vuc is a WAY better offensive threat and former AS who averaged 20+ for multiple seasons and can shoot the 3.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •