Weak east and they win cause of injuries. And Tim carried that 2014 team all Playoffs while Kawhi was getting skull ed by Devin Harris.
Couldn't even back down Monta Ellis either.
2014 FMVP but he was the whole playoffs. Tim and Manu had better playoffs than that quitter.
So he got major carried for his 2014 and now he wins cause the other team had injuries to Kevin Durant. He's lucky he faced them in the finals and not the 1st 2nd 3rd round.
Dabom with the goods.Weak east and they win cause of injuries. And Tim carried that 2014 team all Playoffs while Kawhi was getting skull ed by Devin Harris.
Couldn't even back down Monta Ellis either.
2014 FMVP but he was the whole playoffs. Tim and Manu had better playoffs than that quitter.
So he got major carried for his 2014 and now he wins cause the other team had injuries to Kevin Durant. He's lucky he faced them in the finals and not the 1st 2nd 3rd round.
Yeah, Kawhi was in his PRIME off of 12 FGA for an ENTIRE season
He had TWO postseason runs as the UNDISPUTED lead-dog. In '17, he was taken out by Zaza then missed one year of his prime. This postseason he carried a bunch of CHOKERS against the Sixers ("Finals MVP" VanVleet shot 12%Andwhy do you keep bringing up Jordan, Duncan, etc chokejobs? I've already said that EVERY all-time great has choked at one time or another, but they balanced those chokes with more clutch/dominant performances than chokes. Kawhi has never had a dominant post-season run that can be considered all-time great.
Oh, so Dork being 7th by decimal points in an arbitrary metric MAGICALLY makes his run an all-time great?His 2019 run ranks 8th in on/off since '01.
Kawhi's lead dog post-season legacy so far:
Name me a "LEAD DOG" that averaged 12 FGAs & had the 3rd highest usage rate on his team for the duration of a season.2015: Outplayed by Matt Barnes.
First off, Softridge had more FGAs & higher usage rate than Kawhi in the series. He wasn't the UNDISPUTED lead-dog.2016: Leads team to 67 wins. Spurs lose to OKC, with him getting thoroughly outplayed by Kevin Durant, the guy who called him a "system player."
He was guarding Westbrook & clamping him up (Destroyed the Duds when he was freed from the straitjacket) until Danny lit the house on fire then had to switch in the 4th quarter. Snake was no where to be found in the pivotal Gm 5 (along w/ Softrigde) which was sabotaged w/ Porker AGAIN playing heroball & ThundeRefs during crunchtime. Snake was also resting on defense for a good portion of the game, he was basically a hired gun against 6'6" Danny Green
This was the last time Kawhi touched the ball in the 4th quarter of Gm 5 thanks to Enirique:
Yeah, let's COMPLETELY ignore the '17 run despite the sample SIZE being MUCH greater than '152017: Incomplete.
Greatly affects sample size as the "LEAD DOG"2018: Didn't play
"Solid' run b/c it he was decimal points behind Dork's '11 in a handpicked stat.2019: Solid superstar run.
You are out here clamoring as if he's 37 & at the end of his career.His lead dog post-season resume is nowhere near tier 1 level greats. Quit trying to sell it as such.
He has a sample size of 2 UNDISPUTED lead-dog runs one of which was cut short by the Duds & also cost him another lead-dog run. He's 28 & has PLENTY more crows coming your way.
BTW, '14 doesn't happen without Kawhi locking up MVP Snake in the 4th quarter & this ALL-TIME clutch defensive play ala LeBron blocking Iggy:
Last edited by Kawhitstorm; 06-15-2019 at 01:29 PM.
how the is Kawhi not top 20 all time?
2x NBA Championship
2x Finals MVP
2x DOPY
"b-b-but no regular season MVPs"
So I guess Harden and Westbrook rank higher than Kawhi??
If he wins one more championship he's in the top 10 all time.
No, he was lead dog in 2015. Everyone with a brain knew Kawhi was handed the keys after the 2014 run. He lead the team in regular season scoring and field goal attempts. He lead the team in post-season field goal attempts by 2.7 over Duncan. He was the lead dog, and citing an estimate stat like usage isn't going to change the fact he was the 1st offensive option. And regarding usage, he lead the playoffs in that, too
Regarding the bolded, yeah, you prove my point again, dip . "2 lead dog runs" doesn't make a tier 1 great legacy. This is, again, like crowning Wade after the '06 run. You weren't following basketball then, but the hype was HUGE. Next Jordan. Greatest Finals performance in history. Etc, etc. Then Miami hit a rough patch and Wade became something of an afterthought until '11. If Kawhi bolts to the Clippers and suffers early round exits for the next 3 or 4 years, he'll be an afterthought as the next shiny thing captivates the NBA world. Let's say Harden finally figures it out and plays historically great en route to a le. The hype will be huge.
Yeah, maybe try posting in this thread when those crows finally come. All you're doing is spinning like a top to sell Kawhi's 2019 run as an all-time great run when everyone knows all-time great runs don't end with poor back-to-back Finals closeout game efforts, one in which you were outplayed by a 35 year old role player. Until then, find a Raps forum where you can fellate Kawhi with the rest of the fanboys.
Yeah, Kawhi was in his PRIME off of 12 FGA for an ENTIRE season
He had TWO postseason runs as the UNDISPUTED lead-dog. In '17, he was taken out by Zaza then missed one year of his prime. This postseason he carried a bunch of CHOKERS against the Sixers ("Finals MVP" VanVleet shot 12%
Oh, so Dork being 7th by decimal points in an arbitrary metric MAGICALLY makes his run an all-time great?
Kawhi's lead dog post-season legacy so far:
Name me a "LEAD DOG" that averaged 12 FGAs & had the 3rd highest usage rate on his team for the duration of a season.
First off, Softridge had more FGAs & higher usage rate than Kawhi in the series. He wasn't the UNDISPUTED lead-dog.
He was guarding Westbrook & clamping him up (Destroyed the Duds when he was freed from the straitjacket) until Danny lit the house on fire then had to switch in the 4th quarter. Snake was no where to be found in the pivotal Gm 5 (along w/ Softrigde) which was sabotaged w/ Porker AGAIN playing heroball & ThundeRefs during crunchtime. Snake was also resting on defense for a good portion of the game, he was basically a hired gun against 6'6" Danny Green
This was the last time Kawhi touched the ball in the 4th quarter of Gm 5 thanks to Enirique:
Yeah, let's COMPLETELY ignore the '17 run despite the sample SIZE being MUCH greater than '15
Greatly affects sample size as the "LEAD DOG"
"Solid' run b/c it he was decimal points behind Dork's '11 in a handpicked stat.
You are out here clamoring as if he's 37 & at the end of his career.
He has a sample size of 2 UNDISPUTED lead-dog runs one of which was cut short by the Duds & also cost him another lead-dog run. He's 28 & has PLENTY more crows coming your way.
BTW, '14 doesn't happen without Kawhi locking up MVP Snake in the 4th quarter & this ALL-TIME clutch defensive play ala LeBron blocking Iggy:
There was nothing substantial in that argument. He cherry picks situations and constructs biased analysis to make an argument (i.e. "Um, reason Kawhi was subpar, because, um, they loaded up on him and his teammates didn't help by hitting open shots!!!") rather than using stats, which he tried to use but poorly, since FGA and USG basically confirmed Kawhi was the number one option.
🧂
That will never happen
FACTS: Porker led the team in FGAs per 100 possession (minutes had to be cut due to multiple maladies) & Porker/Manu led the team in usage rate for the duration of the season.
In a season where he played 64 games, Kawhi was pushed into the primary option role when Porker went TOBS mid-season.
Had Poop stuck with Fatty instead of riding Porker then maybe the Cripples would have paid for their blitzing defense just like the Duds did in the Finals.
Dip who the told you that if a player has an all-time postseason run then their CAREER has to be elevated to a top 10 position?Regarding the bolded, yeah, you prove my point again, dip . "2 lead dog runs" doesn't make a tier 1 great legacy. This is, again, like crowning Wade after the '06 run. You weren't following basketball then, but the hype was HUGE. Next Jordan. Greatest Finals performance in history. Etc, etc. Then Miami hit a rough patch and Wade became something of an afterthought until '11. If Kawhi bolts to the Clippers and suffers early round exits for the next 3 or 4 years, he'll be an afterthought as the next shiny thing captivates the NBA world. Let's say Harden finally figures it out and plays historically great en route to a le. The hype will be huge.
Kawhi had an all-time postseason run (you can flagellate using arbitrary ranking systems to fuel your denial narratives) & I personally have NEVER said Kawhi has had an all-time great career at THIS point of time.
FYI: Been following the league diligently since Timmay's rookie season including witnessing the '01 ALL-TIME annihilation of the Spurs at the hands of Kirby & Timmay getting outplayed by Fisher the last 2 game of the SWEEP.
FACTS: Porker led the team in FGAs per 100 possession (minutes had to be cut due to multiple maladies) & Porker/Manu led the team in usage rate for the duration of the season.
In a season where he played 64 games, Kawhi was pushed into the primary option role when Porker went TOBS mid-season.
Had Poop stuck with Fatty instead of riding Porker then maybe the Cripples would have paid for their blitzing defense just like the Duds did in the Finals.
No. Maybe if Kawhi didn't get outplayed by Matt Barnes, the Spurs win that series. Everyone stepped up in the deciding game 7 except him. No amount of excuse making can undue that painful fact.
It wasn't an all-time great run. 9th per on/off since '01. You'll once again deflect by saying that is a cherry picked stat, but it's a better stat than the likes of BPM, PER, simple rating, and the like because it's a better estimate of overall player impact, attempting to account for elements like "gravity" (i.e. how a player's presence on the court makes offensive opportunity easier for his teammates) and defensive impact. Furthermore, all-time great runs do not conclude by you not being the best player for your team (Lowry and Siakam had better games) while getting outplayed by 35 year old role players.
Solid. Superstar. Run.
Last edited by midnightpulp; 06-15-2019 at 07:42 PM.
Terry/Barea had better games than Mr. 9-27 & were also the ones that closed out Gm 5 during Dork 'ALL-TIME" great run where he defended Haslem/Joel Anthony while taking a nap on defense.
Dork NEVER had to carry the Mavs to the same magnitude as Kawhi carried a bunch of choker against the Sixers & couldn't even dream about putting a straitjacket on the league MVP.
Pascal Siakam was Kawhi's stretch 4 & he still dropped 30 on 62% TS while going up against LEGIT defenses for 4 straight rounds.
I never said Dirk's run was all-time great from a stats perspective. But his on/off was higher than Kawhi's and he at least had a strong game 5 in the Finals along with a game winning stretch in game 2 facing an 0-2 deficit. Even the narrative was better. A past his prime superstar known as a choker leads a bunch of cast off vets past the defending champs and improbably reaches the Finals where a superteam awaits.Terry/Barea had better games than Mr. 9-27 & were also the ones that closed out Gm 5 during Dork 'ALL-TIME" great run where he defended Haslem/Joel Anthony while taking a nap on defense.
Dork NEVER had to carry the Mavs to the same magnitude as Kawhi carried a bunch of choker against the Sixers & couldn't even dream about putting a straitjacket on the league MVP.
Pascal Siakam was Kawhi's stretch 4 & he still dropped 30 on 62% TS while going up against LEGIT defenses for 4 straight rounds.
Dirk outplayed Durant something fierce in the WCF. Something Kawhi has yet to do. Even in Durant's 10 minute cameo he somehow managed to outplay Kawhi in that game
So Dirk had the better on/off, faced a better team in the Finals, had a worse supporting cast, and actually had a good Finals late game (game 5). Yeah, I think that run deserves a bump over your hero's.
I never said Dirk's run was all-time great from a stats perspective.
Since on/off is the be-all and end-all metric for OBJECTIVELY ranking "ALL-TIME" postseason runs according to YOU then why do we examine another case.But his on/off was higher than Kawhi's
2001 Lakers: https://www.basketball-reference.com...ayoffs_pbp::11
-Kirby: +14.2
-PEAK Shaq: -0.3
I'll wait for you to pull a rabbit out of your ass.
Yeah, it fit *YOUR* anti-Kiwi narrativeEven the narrative was better. A past his prime superstar known as a choker leads a bunch of cast off vets past the defending champs and improbably reaches the Finals where a superteam awaits.
The Heatles put their best defender (LeBrat) on JET while Dork was primarly being guarded by TOBS Haslem. Imagine Shaun Livingston guarding Kawhi.
And the "superstar" team that showed up in the Finals, their Big 3 might as well have been Wade/Horace Grant/Lamar Odum.
Dirk got mopped off the floor by with the same cast in the 2010 playoffs by George Hill when he couldn't hid behind Daddy Chandler's skirt.Caron Butler was Dirk's sidekick on that team. Caron in' Butler. And he got injured. That was a team where Peja was getting 20 minutes per game in the playoffs
If it wasn't for Chandler patrolling the paint & shutting down driving lanes then Dork would have been swept in the Finals as LeBrat would have had his way in the paint instead of having to postup Barea.
Butler missing the playoffs didn't matter b/c the Mavs won the series on the defensive end where Dork hid behind Chandler's skirt &Terry outscored LeBrat for the duration of the series.
Against OKC, Marion/Kidd/Chandler put the clamps on Snake/Brick while Dork was hiding on ChewBaka/Collison.
Meanwhile against the Sixers/Bucks, Kawhi was guarding Simmons/Butler/Giannis/Middleton & dropping 30+ on better than 60% TS while his wing-man Siakam was averaging 17 on
LoL @ Dork's Gm 2 (where he scored 24 point on 22 shots & committed 5 turnovers) being better than Kawhi's Gm 4 (where he scored 36 on 22 shots & committed ZERO turnovers, only been done once on the road) just b/c one finished off his opponents early including keeping them in the game in the 1st quarter by scoring 14 of his teams 17 then ending it with 17 in the 3rd.
In Gm 2 of the '11 Finals, Dork scored most of his buckets in transition b/c Chandler was shutting down & the Heatles couldn't score. Meanwhile, Kawhi was destroying set defense on a team that had Iggy/Draymond/Klay.
Context: Heat went on a 12-0 to start the 4th then Chandler checked-in & JET, with his team on the verge of getting buried) responded by scoring 8 straight points before Dork even scored a bucket in the 4th despite being on the floor the ENTIRE time.
With Daddy Chandler on the floor, Heatles couldn't buy a bucket & Dork proceeded to score 3 straight UNCONTESTED transition buckets then sealed the win w/ a wide open layup b/c LeBrat didn't want to help off JET (Meanwhile Duds left Lowry WIDE open for a series winning shot)
Gm 5: JET being guarded by LeBron & carrying Dork to promise land (Chandler with the good on the other end):
That's all you do. You never make a salient point and just cherry pick situations to diminish a certain player's performance while propping up your hero's. "Oh, see, this is why Kawhi's run was better or this is why he sucked against Matt Barnes, because of this, that, this, that, and this here. Dirk was great because he didn't encounter these things that Kawhi did!" Again, ALL superstar players during le runs have faced increased defensive pressure, faced elite teams and matchups, and have had sidekicks and role players disappear on them and/or become unsung heroes. Kawhi faced no more challenges in that regard than any other star player. Quit trying to sell him as a one man team.
And yes, on/off is a pretty good solid indicator. Many people felt Kobe was the best player in that '01 run. Shaq still had a mammoth +22.9 on/off the next season.
^^^Oh, and don't think I'm backing out discussing Xs and Os. It's kind of humorous that you don't even pay attention to the youtube vids you link that you believe are supporting your argument of how Dirk was "carried" in that 4th. From the first in' 5 seconds of the video:
Dirk catches the ball and 4 Miami players immediately close in. That's how focused Miami was on stopping him after he decimated OKC and Durant (something Kiwi has yet to do). Dirk's "gravity" created that wide open 3 Terry would hit in the next frames. That play should explain Dirk's on/off (again, higher than Kawhi's) during that run.
I refuse to do the "analysis" thing because I can bring up dozens of selective examples and situations that prop up Dirk (or any other player) and diminish Kawhi. It's an arbitrary and subjective exercise. What is less arbitrary and subjective are stats. And
Talk about cherry picking.
Picked an arbitrary stat to SUBJECTIVELY judge "ALL-TIME" runs & blew up in his face.
Spreadsheet McBuster: '01 Lakers BETTER w/ Shaq OFF the floor.
Then tries to save face by using the phrase "many people felt" after years of belittling Kirby when according to your spreadsheet he CARRIED Shaq to a 15-1 postseason run including sweeping Timmay.
If it don't fit the NARRATIVE then you must DODGE. Log off fam:
Who cares? Next season Shaq was a +22.9. I don't know why you bring up '01 since I never listed it as a run that was better than Kawhi's. But next season, Shaq's on/off was higher than Kawhi. Dirk was also higher than Kawhi. That's the real truth bomb that is blowing up in your face you can't seem to handle.Talk about cherry picking.
Picked an arbitrary stat to SUBJECTIVELY judge "ALL-TIME" runs & blew up in his face.
Spreadsheet McBuster: '01 Lakers BETTER w/ Shaq OFF the floor.
Then tries to save face by using the phrase "many people felt" after years of belittling Kirby when according to your spreadsheet he CARRIED Shaq to a 15-1 postseason run including sweeping Timmay.
If it don't fit the NARRATIVE then you must DODGE. Log off fam:
And
Last edited by midnightpulp; 06-16-2019 at 05:52 PM.
Who do you remove? You cannot fit 50 people into the top 20.how the is Kawhi not top 20 all time?
2x NBA Championship
2x Finals MVP
2x DOPY
"b-b-but no regular season MVPs
So I guess Harden and Westbrook rank higher than Kawhi??
If he wins one more championship he's in the top 10 all time.
You don't truth bomb your own post you stupid gotTalk about cherry picking.
Picked an arbitrary stat to SUBJECTIVELY judge "ALL-TIME" runs & blew up in his face.
Spreadsheet McBuster: '01 Lakers BETTER w/ Shaq OFF the floor.
Then tries to save face by using the phrase "many people felt" after years of belittling Kirby when according to your spreadsheet he CARRIED Shaq to a 15-1 postseason run including sweeping Timmay.
If it don't fit the NARRATIVE then you must DODGE. Log off fam:
Yeah, the play started at 5 seconds
From the ing 1 second of the video:
JET runs a PnR & he has 4 Miami players BLTIZING him while leaving Dork OPEN, that's how focused Miami was on stopping him after he decimated the Lakers and Kirby on
They gave him the ultimate respek by putting LeBrat on him from the beginning of the series & even refused to help off him when Dork was driving for an uncontested game winning layup.
JET got in LeBrat's head by getting the Larry OB trophy tattooed BEFORE the finals then declaring that LeBrat can't guard him for the entire series.........then proceeded to outscore him including hitting a dagger shot in his face. Folks talk about Kyrie owning Curry when JET had LeBrat reevaluating his life for an entire summer.
JET's "gravity" forced the Heatles to scramble & eventually generated a wide open 3 Terry ala Curry relocating after getting the defense discombobulated. That play should explain to you why LeBrat refused to help off JET on Dork's drive.
Nothing you pull out of your cervix will absolve you after holding on/off as the holy-grail then '01 Shaq having a NEGATIVE on/off.nothing will change the fact that Dirk's on/off was higher in '11 than Kawhi's '19 campaign. Just accept it and move on.
Again, log-off fam.
No, if they were that concerned with Terry beating them over Dirk, they would've spied him. Players that teams gameplan to stop don't get shots like these off of secondary action:Yeah, the play started at 5 seconds
From the ing 1 second of the video:
JET runs a PnR & he has 4 Miami players BLTIZING him while leaving Dork OPEN, that's how focused Miami was on stopping him after he decimated the Lakers and Kirby on
They gave him the ultimate respek by putting LeBrat on him from the beginning of the series & even refused to help off him when Dork was driving for an uncontested game winning layup.
JET got in LeBrat's head by getting the Larry OB trophy tattooed BEFORE the finals then declaring that LeBrat can't guard him for the entire series.........then proceeded to outscore him including hitting a dagger shot in his face. Folks talk about Kyrie owning Curry when JET had LeBrat reevaluating his life for an entire summer.
JET's "gravity" forced the Heatles to scramble & eventually generated a wide open 3 Terry ala Curry relocating after getting the defense discombobulated. That play should explain to you why LeBrat refused to help off JET on Dork's drive.
Nothing you pull out of your cervix will absolve you after holding on/off as the holy-grail then '01 Shaq having a NEGATIVE on/off.
Again, log-off fam.
Dirk created that absurdly wide open shot. Bosh could've stayed home as the "spy," Miller could've switched, but got sucked in the moment Dirk caught the ball.
All you're doing is basically showing Terry doing his job as the second offensive option
Anyhow, I refuse to play this game any more (don't waste your time posting youtubes like Kool. I won't be responding). I can bring up situations where Lowry created advantageous situations for Kawhi. Again, since the point seems to be lost on you, no player is a one man team. Players get help from the sidekicks and role players all the time during le runs. Kawhi's run wasn't a unique cir stance.
On/off is a much better stat than raw BPM. BPM does not factor in defensive impact. If anything, on/off is the better impact stat to use in evaluating Kawhi's run since he's an impactful defensive player. Something like BPM would actually punish two way players more.
Find a better stat, then. You want to use BPM?The "on vs off" data is particularly useful in assessing the impact the player has on the team's overall performance. For example, to the left we list the on/off numbers for Jason Kidd through 1/12/04.
At a glance you can see that Jason's playing a good portion of the minutes (76% of the team's total), and having a HUGE impact on the offense. When he's on the court, the Nets are scoring almost 106 points per 100 possessions, whereas when he's on the bench the offense is struggling to post 85 pts per 100 poss -- a whopping +21 difference! The team is also slightly better defensively when Jason's on the floor,
Last edited by midnightpulp; 06-16-2019 at 06:38 PM.
do you think repeating these "nicknames" enhances your argument, tbh?
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