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  1. #401
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    I've thought about this after reading an article on ways we could move up in the draft. They don't mention Kemba, but given the new FO in Boston it would be worth looking into.

    The two other options the article gave were: Spurs taking on Wiggins contact for Minnesota's pick or Love for Cleveland's pick.

    Honestly I would take either of the latter. We aren't winning a chip in the next two years (the length of each contract) but those picks may be good enough to find a franchise cornerstone that could lead us back.

    I'm partial to the Love trade because I think he could run at the 4 and spread the floor with his 3's. With DDR gone his minutes would be freed up and we could have a solid 1-3 rotation with our young guys while still using Johnson as a backup 4 occasionally. Tons of minutes to go around, time to develop the young guys, adds 3 point shooting, and provides a great pick in the process. Doubt they would do it though. They're in no desperation to clear up cap space.

    GS might because they are overloaded and moving Wiggins might give them the relief they need to find a quality role player to go with the current roster. They certainly have reasons not to though. Why keep Wiggins for two years then trade him away right at the finish line?
    I'd consider any of those if the consideration attached was substantial enough. I'd love to get into the top 5...

  2. #402
    Forum Official Personal Life Coach BacktoBasics's Avatar
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    Here we go again with the delusion that a team is willing to give up a lottery pick to shed a contract. It’s not happening. No team has done that after knowing where they pick. Sure it’s been done unintentionally when a team think that the trade returns an asset thats hopeful enough to keep the team out of the lottery but no team is giving anyone a top 10 simply to shed salary. Just stop already.

    Lottery picks on ty teams are 10 times more valuable than cap space. There is no potential free agent going to a lottery team to justify giving away a lottery pick to free up money.

    Who? Who is a team like Cleveland going to sign that’s sooo good that it’s worth giving up a high value prospect for cap space. Such a dumb fantasy.

  3. #403
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    Here we go again with the delusion that a team is willing to give up a lottery pick to shed a contract. It’s not happening. No team has done that after knowing where they pick. Sure it’s been done unintentionally when a team think that the trade returns an asset thats hopeful enough to keep the team out of the lottery but no team is giving anyone a top 10 simply to shed salary. Just stop already.

    Lottery picks on ty teams are 10 times more valuable than cap space. There is no potential free agent going to a lottery team to justify giving away a lottery pick to free up money.

    Who? Who is a team like Cleveland going to sign that’s sooo good that it’s worth giving up a high value prospect for cap space. Such a dumb fantasy.
    Minnesota kind of did this, except they got D'Angelo Russell while shedding Wiggins + giving up a 1st round pick (and a 2nd rounder). They were optimistic that they'd be better and that pick wouldn't be a lottery pick, but they were wrong about that. I think Golden State is probably too smart to do it, but who knows-- they're in a win now situation with Steph/Klay/Draymond and they have Wiseman... Would an offer of Lonnie Walker for Wiggins + pick at least be entertained? Maybe? Lonnie + 2nd rd pick? I hate to say it out loud (and I hope I'm wrong), but at this point I think Wiggins is kind of the ceiling for Walker, and that Wiggins contract isn't quite as outlandish now compared to two years ago. If the Warrior pick winds up being #7, maybe they think that doesn't necessarily help them next year, and so shedding Wiggins, saving tons of money, and signing a few vets on cheap deals makes sense. But I agree with you-- it's still unlikely. But man, the idea of adding Moses Moody and Franz Wagner sure is a nice daydream.

  4. #404
    Forum Official Personal Life Coach BacktoBasics's Avatar
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    Minnesota kind of did this, except they got D'Angelo Russell while shedding Wiggins + giving up a 1st round pick (and a 2nd rounder). They were optimistic that they'd be better and that pick wouldn't be a lottery pick, but they were wrong about that. I think Golden State is probably too smart to do it, but who knows-- they're in a win now situation with Steph/Klay/Draymond and they have Wiseman... Would an offer of Lonnie Walker for Wiggins + pick at least be entertained? Maybe? Lonnie + 2nd rd pick? I hate to say it out loud (and I hope I'm wrong), but at this point I think Wiggins is kind of the ceiling for Walker, and that Wiggins contract isn't quite as outlandish now compared to two years ago. If the Warrior pick winds up being #7, maybe they think that doesn't necessarily help them next year, and so shedding Wiggins, saving tons of money, and signing a few vets on cheap deals makes sense. But I agree with you-- it's still unlikely. But man, the idea of adding Moses Moody and Franz Wagner sure is a nice daydream.
    Exactly my point. They did it but returned an all star(perceived) at a position of need and expected much better results. They wouldn’t do that again.

    No one will make a trade anywhere near that already knowing their draft position. Not to mention we couldn’t return a player of Russell’s caliber, debatably that is.

  5. #405
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    Max him out, RJ I said!

  6. #406
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    I've thought about this after reading an article on ways we could move up in the draft. They don't mention Kemba, but given the new FO in Boston it would be worth looking into.

    The two other options the article gave were: Spurs taking on Wiggins contact for Minnesota's pick or Love for Cleveland's pick.

    Honestly I would take either of the latter. We aren't winning a chip in the next two years (the length of each contract) but those picks may be good enough to find a franchise cornerstone that could lead us back.

    I'm partial to the Love trade because I think he could run at the 4 and spread the floor with his 3's. With DDR gone his minutes would be freed up and we could have a solid 1-3 rotation with our young guys while still using Johnson as a backup 4 occasionally. Tons of minutes to go around, time to develop the young guys, adds 3 point shooting, and provides a great pick in the process. Doubt they would do it though. They're in no desperation to clear up cap space.

    GS might because they are overloaded and moving Wiggins might give them the relief they need to find a quality role player to go with the current roster. They certainly have reasons not to though. Why keep Wiggins for two years then trade him away right at the finish line?
    The Wiggins situation is worth paying attention to. They have certainly tried to move him, but they are in win now mode, they want a player back that can help them win and that’s no one on the Spurs roster for similar salary and no one that other teams would be willing to deal… Maybe a disgruntled star wants a trade and that’s when GSW swoops in with a package. That’s what they are saving their assets and Wiggins for. Otherwise he’s played well enough for them to see if the right opportunity presents itself.

  7. #407
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    Max him out, RJ I said!
    This is starting to get traction… leak likely coming from his agent… hmmm interesting

  8. #408
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    The Wiggins situation is worth paying attention to. They have certainly tried to move him, but they are in win now mode, they want a player back that can help them win and that’s no one on the Spurs roster for similar salary and no one that other teams would be willing to deal… Maybe a disgruntled star wants a trade and that’s when GSW swoops in with a package. That’s what they are saving their assets and Wiggins for. Otherwise he’s played well enough for them to see if the right opportunity presents itself.
    I don't think they need to match salaries because the Spurs will be under the cap. I haven't checked the specific #s, but I believe something like Wiggins + 1st rd pick for Walker + 2nd rd pick would work.

  9. #409
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    I don't think they need to match salaries because the Spurs will be under the cap. I haven't checked the specific #s, but I believe something like Wiggins + 1st rd pick for Walker + 2nd rd pick would work.
    Maybe I wasn’t as clear as I thought, I believe GSW wouldn’t trade Wiggins just to get out from his salary. They want a win now piece back or two. That’s perhaps no one on the Spurs right now.

    I think they are waiting for a disgruntled star to move in with an offer. I don’t know who specifically is in their sights or which team, but most likely it’s someone the other team doesn’t want to deal, which is why nothing has happened.

    Would Spurs want to deal White and/or Murray for Wiggins and a pick? Would GSW even be interested in that trade? I doubt it, Wiggins has been good enough for them, he’s overpriced but hasn’t been garbage or unplayable. Maybe White or Murray is slightly better than him but neither is a star and it’s not enough of an immediate improvement to make them contenders… Maybe San Antonio isn’t even interested in that either bc they like both White and Murray. I just don’t see that the Spurs have anything GSW would want to get back on win now mode.

  10. #410
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    Maybe I wasn’t as clear as I thought, I believe GSW wouldn’t trade Wiggins just to get out from his salary. They want a win now piece back or two. That’s perhaps no one on the Spurs right now.

    I think they are waiting for a disgruntled star to move in with an offer. I don’t know who specifically is in their sights or which team, but most likely it’s someone the other team doesn’t want to deal, which is why nothing has happened.

    Would Spurs want to deal White and/or Murray for Wiggins and a pick? Would GSW even be interested in that trade? I doubt it, Wiggins has been good enough for them, he’s overpriced but hasn’t been garbage or unplayable. Maybe White or Murray is slightly better than him but neither is a star and it’s not enough of an immediate improvement to make them contenders… Maybe San Antonio isn’t even interested in that either bc they like both White and Murray. I just don’t see that the Spurs have anything GSW would want to get back on win now mode.
    The looming tax bill for Golden State is enormous. This explains it better than I can: https://www.forbes.com/sites/patrick...e-a-big-trade/

    I think if the Warriors feel like they can sign a few players to reasonable contracts that actually help them, the chance of unloading Wiggins and saving a whole lot of money becomes possible. It's an interesting scenario, and I can't wait to see what they do. I think if Golden State had a do over, they take Tyrese Haliburton instead of Wiseman, and then the rest of the league is in trouble! It's crazy to think that after everything that's happened, they still might have two lottery picks this year.

  11. #411
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    The looming tax bill for Golden State is enormous. This explains it better than I can: https://www.forbes.com/sites/patrick...e-a-big-trade/

    I think if the Warriors feel like they can sign a few players to reasonable contracts that actually help them, the chance of unloading Wiggins and saving a whole lot of money becomes possible. It's an interesting scenario, and I can't wait to see what they do. I think if Golden State had a do over, they take Tyrese Haliburton instead of Wiseman, and then the rest of the league is in trouble! It's crazy to think that after everything that's happened, they still might have two lottery picks this year.
    Good article thanks for sharing. They are in a difficult situation and like the article says the time of reckoning $ is here. Klay’s injury screwed them and not just out of a championship, but they still want to field a good team and that’s not going to happen dumping Wiggins and his deal with a 1st round pick for no one of consequence (Walker in your example).

    They could put together a haul, they aren’t going to just use it to shed salary alone which is what some fans were expecting. That’s not happening. At worst they will look to improve their role players.

    There are a lot of rumors around Oubre, maybe put in place by his agent to exert pressure on GSW.

    At any rate I don’t think Walker is enough to get it done for them, and like I said maybe not even pieces that the Spurs wouldn’t make available would interest them. Still it’s going to be interesting to see what happens.

  12. #412
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    The Wiggins situation is worth paying attention to. They have certainly tried to move him, but they are in win now mode, they want a player back that can help them win and that’s no one on the Spurs roster for similar salary and no one that other teams would be willing to deal… Maybe a disgruntled star wants a trade and that’s when GSW swoops in with a package. That’s what they are saving their assets and Wiggins for. Otherwise he’s played well enough for them to see if the right opportunity presents itself.
    I think it's worth the ask. GS probably feels pressure coming off of Klay's injury. They know the window is closing and getting Wiggins salary off the books could let them make a run at a difference maker. I saw that as more probable than Cleveland's deal, but then I read this and it made me think:

    "The perfect example might be the Cavaliers and Kevin Love. Cleveland has an interesting young core. They will have to re-sign Jarrett Allen, which will eat into the potential cap space they could create. Because of those two facts, they might be interested in moving Kevin Love and the $60 million over two years that they still owe him to make sure they can bring in someone who actually wants to be there and fits their timeline better. The Spurs could offer to take him on, as long as Cleveland sweetens the pot. Maybe the Cavs send Love and the fifth pick to San Antonio for the 12th pick and a young player, for example."

    It's possible they want the space to resign Allen and chase a young piece or two with some cap space (maybe even make a run at Collins?). In essence we would be trading a young player (walker?) and whoever we would get at 12 for love and whoever we get at 5. In my opinion if they would accept we pull that trigger. Gives us a better chance to find a franchise cornerstone.

  13. #413
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    I think it's worth the ask. GS probably feels pressure coming off of Klay's injury. They know the window is closing and getting Wiggins salary off the books could let them make a run at a difference maker. I saw that as more probable than Cleveland's deal, but then I read this and it made me think:

    "The perfect example might be the Cavaliers and Kevin Love. Cleveland has an interesting young core. They will have to re-sign Jarrett Allen, which will eat into the potential cap space they could create. Because of those two facts, they might be interested in moving Kevin Love and the $60 million over two years that they still owe him to make sure they can bring in someone who actually wants to be there and fits their timeline better. The Spurs could offer to take him on, as long as Cleveland sweetens the pot. Maybe the Cavs send Love and the fifth pick to San Antonio for the 12th pick and a young player, for example."

    It's possible they want the space to resign Allen and chase a young piece or two with some cap space (maybe even make a run at Collins?). In essence we would be trading a young player (walker?) and whoever we would get at 12 for love and whoever we get at 5. In my opinion if they would accept we pull that trigger. Gives us a better chance to find a franchise cornerstone.
    IIRC, they already extended Allen (for a ridiculous amount). These kind of articles are written by “journalists” that are really speculating. It doesn’t make sense for Cleveland (a team that needs all the young talent from their picks they can get, in order to sift the gems from the sand) to trade a pick in order to get out from Love’s deal. The most they can hope for is to trade him for a different bad deal, or couple of deals because he’s become a locker room cancer or something like that. I am thinking about how the Grizzlies were finally able to get out from the Chandler Parsons deal (and I do believe he only had one year left, it was an expiring, but honestly I can’t remember that well.)

  14. #414
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    IIRC, they already extended Allen (for a ridiculous amount). These kind of articles are written by “journalists” that are really speculating. It doesn’t make sense for Cleveland (a team that needs all the young talent from their picks they can get, in order to sift the gems from the sand) to trade a pick in order to get out from Love’s deal. The most they can hope for is to trade him for a different bad deal, or couple of deals because he’s become a locker room cancer or something like that. I am thinking about how the Grizzlies were finally able to get out from the Chandler Parsons deal (and I do believe he only had one year left, it was an expiring, but honestly I can’t remember that well.)
    No, they didn't and as you alluded to, obviously the Cavaliers wouldn't do something that stupid.

    I don't know what's worse, the majority of fake trades that fail to take into account why it would make sense for the opposing team(s) or this notion that Walker IV and Samanic have sky high ceilings.

  15. #415
    My Girl's a Hooper keithington1's Avatar
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    Any way Spurs can sign Derozan and Chris Paul for 3 years?

    Paul Murray Vassell Johnson Poeltl
    White Walker Derozan Samanic Sengun
    T. Jones KBD Eubanks

  16. #416
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    Any way Spurs can sign Derozan and Chris Paul for 3 years?

    Paul Murray Vassell Johnson Poeltl
    White Walker Derozan Samanic Sengun
    T. Jones KBD Eubanks
    No. Paul put himself on the players committee for the express purpose of changing the rules on number of years on contracts for players over 35. He wanted to get paid, and will not give any kind of discount. He’ll also cost north of $40 M, like 85-90%of our cap room. DeRozan ain’t coming off the bench, either.

  17. #417
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    Can't believe I'm actually saying this, but I think my favorite free agent right now is Lonzo Ball. He's restricted, and I imagine that someone will overpay him, but a 6'6" PG who averages about 14/6/5, shoots the three, and at age 23 just posted the best advanced stats of his career so far. He's big enough to make a back court of Murray/White/Ball viable, and he increases a team's chance of landing LaMelo in the future. I really can't picture the Ball Circus ever moving to San Antonio, but if you take away the tabloid carnival atmosphere, he's a pretty good young player, and certainly better & younger than Kelly Oubre.
    Last edited by R. DeMurre; 06-15-2021 at 12:17 PM.

  18. #418
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    Can't believe I'm actually saying this, but I think my favorite free agent right now is Lonzo Ball. He's restricted, and I imagine that someone will overpay him, but a 6'6" PG who averages about 14/6/5, shoots the three, and at age 23 just posted the best advanced stats of his career so far. He's big enough to make a back court of Murray/White/Ball viable, and he increases a team's chance of landing LaMelo in the future. I really can't picture the Ball Circus ever moving to San Antonio, but if you take away the tabloid carnival atmosphere, he's a pretty good young player, and certainly better & younger than Kelly Oubre.
    I know it's not popular here but, I do like Lonzo a good bit. I can't see him fitting with DJ at all though and neither would be happy coming off the bench so unless there's a deal in place that moves DJ I can't see it working here.

  19. #419
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    I know it's not popular here but, I do like Lonzo a good bit. I can't see him fitting with DJ at all though and neither would be happy coming off the bench so unless there's a deal in place that moves DJ I can't see it working here.
    As a rule, I’m against guards who can’t get to the line. It’s part of why I’m higher on Derrick over DJ. But as abysmal as DJ is at getting to the line he is still twice as good at it than Lonzo. How do you only shoot 1.2 free throws a game when you have the ball every possession? There was also a stretch where the offense looked a lot better with Zion handling/bringing up the ball rather than Lonzo. I don’t know how to take that. Also he is pretty injury prone. Nothing major but just a lot nagging injuries where he misses 20 games a season.

    Having both Lonzo and DJ on the team makes zero sense. I will credit Lonzo where he has become a slightly above average 3 point shooter. But he doesn’t exactly break down defenses, he doesn’t get to the line, he somehow averaged less than 6 assists a game when he has the premier lob player in the league, and he doesn’t really know how to play the game of basketball.

  20. #420
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    As a rule, I’m against guards who can’t get to the line. It’s part of why I’m higher on Derrick over DJ. But as abysmal as DJ is at getting to the line he is still twice as good at it than Lonzo. How do you only shoot 1.2 free throws a game when you have the ball every possession? There was also a stretch where the offense looked a lot better with Zion handling/bringing up the ball rather than Lonzo. I don’t know how to take that. Also he is pretty injury prone. Nothing major but just a lot nagging injuries where he misses 20 games a season.

    Having both Lonzo and DJ on the team makes zero sense. I will credit Lonzo where he has become a slightly above average 3 point shooter. But he doesn’t exactly break down defenses, he doesn’t get to the line, he somehow averaged less than 6 assists a game when he has the premier lob player in the league, and he doesn’t really know how to play the game of basketball.
    But other than all that, you’re ok with him?

  21. #421
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
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  22. #422
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    But other than all that, you’re ok with him?

  23. #423
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    Lonzo's gotta be headed to the Knicks right?

    I think he is a good player but is best suited to playing with the ball in his hands.

    When I look at the Pace Adv. Stats on NBA.com - NY ranked 30th so then again, maybe not such a great fit.

  24. #424
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    Lonzo's gotta be headed to the Knicks right?

    I think he is a good player but is best suited to playing with the ball in his hands.

    When I look at the Pace Adv. Stats on NBA.com - NY ranked 30th so then again, maybe not such a great fit.
    Hopefully after the Knicks sign DDR, there’s still enough money for Lonzo! Though can’t see Thibs taking on that defensive nightmare. But let’s hope because I can’t think of any other team interested. I mean, maybe the Lakers try a last push with Lebron and sign DDR.

  25. #425
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    But other than all that, you’re ok with him?

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