Official 2016 Spurs Offseason Thread

[palangi]

Gasol would be alright, nothing special, tbh..

Better than standing part, I suppose..

If only he was black? Right BIGOT!

[Hoops Czar]

That's not really possible.

Ah, the Spurs have their MLE right?

[Uriel]

As of right now, the Spurs have $10,427,634 to sign Bertans and Gasol, assuming Manu comes back for the room exception (which is actually not guaranteed, taking that for what you will). The team pretty much has no ability to go beyond that limit without creating another hole that would potentially take even more cap space to fill than is currently being used.

This is currently what the roster looks like (again, ignoring their training camp guys):

Player	Salary/Hold
LaMarcus Aldridge	$20,575,005
Kawhi Leonard	$17,638,063
Tony Parker	$14,445,313
Danny Green	$10,000,000
Boris Diaw	$6,500,000
Tim Duncan	$6,393,750
Patty Mills	$3,578,948
Kyle Anderson	$1,192,080
Livio Jean-Charles	$990,700
Dejounte Murray	$983,400
Jonathan Simmons	$874,636
Roster Charge	$543,471
Total	$83,715,366
Remaining Cap	$10,427,634

The depth chart looks like this:

Parker, Mills, Murray
Green, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson
Aldridge, Diaw, LJC
Duncan

The only hope is praying that A) Tim doesn't retire, and Manu comes back for the room exception, or at least that some serviceable guard does; B) Bertans can be signed cheaply (forget a minimum offer -- think $5M/3); and C) Pau would take what's left over, which is just over $9 Million. Then you use exceptions to bring back Manu and bring in Cady/Ndoye/Lorbek or some other center you can get for the min. That would leave the team with this:

Player	Salary/Hold
LaMarcus Aldridge	$20,575,005
Kawhi Leonard	$17,638,063
Tony Parker	$14,445,313
Danny Green	$10,000,000
Pau Gasol	$9,393,000
Boris Diaw	$6,500,000
Tim Duncan	$6,393,750
Patty Mills	$3,578,948
Manu Ginobili	$2,898,000
Davis Bertans	$1,578,105
Kyle Anderson	$1,192,080
Livio Jean-Charles	$990,700
Dejounte Murray	$983,400
Jonathan Simmons	$874,636
Cady Lalanne	$543,471
Total	$97,584,471
Remaining Cap Space	-$3,441,471

That's about $16 Million under the tax, so some trades could definitely happen. No Boban, but that's for the best in most of these scenarios. The depth chart looks like this:

Parker, Mills, Murray
Green, Ginobili, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson, Bertans
Aldridge, Diaw, LJC
Gasol, Duncan, Lalanne/The Field

That's not bad -- I could see that team catching fire and winning a le -- but it's obviously not where it needs to be. As always, using Mills and/or Diaw to acquire an offensive guard would be nice, especially if West was willing to return on a min deal to fill that backup PF spot. The issue is that there really isn't a good candidate for a trade. You have guys like Ty Lawson and Jennings still in the wind, but they might get more than the team can or either is willing to pay, and that's ignoring that those team might not even want Diaw or Mills back or even be able to complete the deals, as they could have already used their space. The Pel might be willing to deal Evans or Holiday, though the latter is extremely unlikely. The Pacers could move Ellis.

I think it's likely the front office moves Diaw to create enough cap room to sign Gasol to a near market value deal.

[SAGirl]

As of right now, the Spurs have $10,427,634 to sign Bertans and Gasol, assuming Manu comes back for the room exception (which is actually not guaranteed, taking that for what you will). The team pretty much has no ability to go beyond that limit without creating another hole that would potentially take even more cap space to fill than is currently being used.

This is currently what the roster looks like (again, ignoring their training camp guys):

Player	Salary/Hold
LaMarcus Aldridge	$20,575,005
Kawhi Leonard	$17,638,063
Tony Parker	$14,445,313
Danny Green	$10,000,000
Boris Diaw	$6,500,000
Tim Duncan	$6,393,750
Patty Mills	$3,578,948
Kyle Anderson	$1,192,080
Livio Jean-Charles	$990,700
Dejounte Murray	$983,400
Jonathan Simmons	$874,636
Roster Charge	$543,471
Total	$83,715,366
Remaining Cap	$10,427,634

The depth chart looks like this:

Parker, Mills, Murray
Green, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson
Aldridge, Diaw, LJC
Duncan

The only hope is praying that A) Tim doesn't retire, and Manu comes back for the room exception, or at least that some serviceable guard does; B) Bertans can be signed cheaply (forget a minimum offer -- think $5M/3); and C) Pau would take what's left over, which is just over $9 Million. Then you use exceptions to bring back Manu and bring in Cady/Ndoye/Lorbek or some other center you can get for the min. That would leave the team with this:

Player	Salary/Hold
LaMarcus Aldridge	$20,575,005
Kawhi Leonard	$17,638,063
Tony Parker	$14,445,313
Danny Green	$10,000,000
Pau Gasol	$9,393,000
Boris Diaw	$6,500,000
Tim Duncan	$6,393,750
Patty Mills	$3,578,948
Manu Ginobili	$2,898,000
Davis Bertans	$1,578,105
Kyle Anderson	$1,192,080
Livio Jean-Charles	$990,700
Dejounte Murray	$983,400
Jonathan Simmons	$874,636
Cady Lalanne	$543,471
Total	$97,584,471
Remaining Cap Space	-$3,441,471

That's about $16 Million under the tax, so some trades could definitely happen. No Boban, but that's for the best in most of these scenarios. The depth chart looks like this:

Parker, Mills, Murray
Green, Ginobili, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson, Bertans
Aldridge, Diaw, LJC
Gasol, Duncan, Lalanne/The Field

That's not bad -- I could see that team catching fire and winning a le -- but it's obviously not where it needs to be. As always, using Mills and/or Diaw to acquire an offensive guard would be nice, especially if West was willing to return on a min deal to fill that backup PF spot. The issue is that there really isn't a good candidate for a trade. You have guys like Ty Lawson and Jennings still in the wind, but they might get more than the team can or either is willing to pay, and that's ignoring that those team might not even want Diaw or Mills back or even be able to complete the deals, as they could have already used their space. The Pel might be willing to deal Evans or Holiday, though the latter is extremely unlikely. The Pacers could move Ellis.

ugggghhh so many ppl in that list that are not pulling their worth that it's necessary to hope some unheralded young player has a fantastic year bc a lot of the highest or even mid-level players in that list are not producing what you would expect for what they are paid. Tony is the worst, but Diaw is next behind him and if TD retires yuck. I'd say let's swallow his contract this year and not stretch him but they may need to for Gasol. Dead salary.

[Chinook]

I think it's likely the front office moves Diaw to create enough cap room to sign Gasol to a near market value deal.

I disagree strongly. I think they would have done that last month if that were the case. Anyway, they'd still be missing a rotation-caliber player. I'd be fine with Anderson moving over to the four, but that just means they'd need another wing.

[Chinook]

Ah, the Spurs have their MLE right?

They might have it depending on whether they stay over the cap or go under. Even so, that wouldn't get them the ability to make the contract Nathan was suggesting.

[MaNu4Tres]

I disagree strongly. I think they would have done that last month if that were the case. Anyway, they'd still be missing a rotation-caliber player. I'd be fine with Anderson moving over to the four, but that just means they'd need another wing.

What if Gasol was willing to sign for 12-14 mil, SA trades Diaw/Mills to free up another 11 mil, SA uses that to sign a PF (Robinson, TJones, Reed, L. Thomas) and Sloan? Trading Mills would be dependent on how much the back up PF costs.

[Chinook]

Chinook, what is the scenario if TD retires? I find it hard to believe Pau and the Spurs will be a thing unless TD retires bc of Pau diva allegations/touches.

Manu doesn't sound like he wants a smallish deal and he opted out to get more that is absolutely clear.

Where does this leaves Boban?

I had a really long post just after your question, but to summarize:

Tim really needs to come back. If he doesn't, the best I think they could do would be to stretch him and hope they can find a center with the $4 Million that opens up. Maybe Dedmon?

The Spurs simply don't have the room to keep Manu at anything else unless they stay over the cap. He may well end up parting ways with the team, though I think he'll be back for the room exception. The Spurs absolutely can't kowtow to him.

Boban is likely gone if Gasol shows up. The only thing he has going for him is that he hasn't been in any rumors for contracts. So the Spurs have an outside chance of locking him up to that aforementioned $4 Million or the room exception. Failing that, I don't think he's back if the Spurs go under the cap, whereas I think there's a very good chance if they stay over it.

[SD126]

I think it's likely the front office moves Diaw to create enough cap room to sign Gasol to a near market value deal.

PATFO weren't strong enough to let him walk after '14, they certainly won't trade Diaw's useless arse now.

[Ditty]

Chinook Are the Spurs able to sign LJC, and Murray if they're over the cap if they reannounce Milutinov, LJC and not sure if they can with Murray? Just seeing what the max salary cap the Spurs can have if they trade Mills, and Diaw for a salary dump or a 1st/2nd round. Of course Gasol at $10-$12 million would be ideal if we sign him.

[SAGirl]

The way I see that above ^ they are letting Boban go for Pau basically and we better hope TD returns.

The other option is that's we are reuping Manu in a farewell contract, and fit Boban and Bertans into the exceptions. The rest are all of our rookies. We basically don't add any FA except the training camp invitees and all our stashes that Pop intends to bring in anyways. Something of that nature. It TD doesn't retire. It works. If TD retires this is where it doesn't work bc then you'd have to start Boban.

[DPG21920]

I've been saying that if Gasol did not want the Spurs (he knows the money available) he would have signed with MIN/POR etc..nothing is stopping him from signing there.

The only logical thing is he's waiting for the team he wants to make a decision.

[MaNu4Tres]

I've been saying that if Gasol did not want the Spurs (he knows the money available) he would have signed with MIN/POR etc..nothing is stopping him from signing there.

The only logical thing is he's waiting for the team he wants to make a decision.

How much do you think he signs for?

[Chinook]

What if Gasol was willing to sign for 12-14 mil, SA trades Diaw/Mills to free up another 11 mil, SA uses that to sign a PF (Robinson, TJones, Reed, L. Thomas) and Sloan? Trading Mills would be dependent on how much the back up PF costs.

Those trades would only free up about $9 Million (they make about $10 Million combined, and then you have to add the two roster charges of about $500k each), so that would leave the team with $19,419,640 in space and with nine players accounted for. Assuming Pau took $12 Million, the Spurs would have about $8-9 Million to get a backup PF and backup PG. That's possible, but pretty risky. Let's just assume Jones and Teodosic, since that's like best-case here, along with Manu, Tim and Lalanne as before:

Parker, Teodosic, Murray
Green, Manu, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson
Aldridge, Jones, LJC
Gasol, Duncan, Lalanne

The big thing missing is Bertans. The Spurs would likely have to choose to let one of the two full rotation spots go to bring him on. If the team is comfortable with Andre Miller being the backup PG, maybe they could have him instead of Milos and have Bertans as that final spot.

[Chinook]

Chinook Are the Spurs able to sign LJC, and Murray if they're over the cap if they reannounce Milutinov, LJC and not sure if they can with Murray? Just seeing what the max salary cap the Spurs can have if they trade Mills, and Diaw for a salary dump or a 1st/2nd round. Of course Gasol at $10-$12 million would be ideal if we sign him.

The Spurs can't really renounce LJC or Murray in the same way they can cap holds. They can release their rights, but obviously, they really don't want to do that. They can go over the cap to sign them -- and they will -- but they can only do so if they had their holds on their cap. They're apparently keen on doing that now, but they are saving at most a half-million bucks by doing it. Milutinov isn't an obstacle, as he's still under contract in Greece.

[ace3g]

Shams Charania Verified account ‏@ShamsCharania

Vertical Sources: Free agent Tarik Black has agreed to a two-year, $12.85 million deal to re-sign with the Los Angeles Lakers.

[palangi]

Those trades would only free up about $9 Million (they make about $10 Million combined, and then you have to add the two roster charges of about $500k each), so that would leave the team with $19,419,640 in space and with nine players accounted for. Assuming Pau took $12 Million, the Spurs would have about $8-9 Million to get a backup PF and backup PG. That's possible, but pretty risky. Let's just assume Jones and Teodosic, since that's like best-case here, along with Manu, Tim and Lalanne as before:

Parker, Teodosic, Murray
Green, Manu, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson
Aldridge, Jones, LJC
Gasol, Duncan, Lalanne

The big thing missing is Bertans. The Spurs would likely have to choose to let one of the two full rotation spots go to bring him on. If the team is comfortable with Andre Miller being the backup PG, maybe they could have him instead of Milos and have Bertans as that final spot.

What if they are expecting Lalanne and LJC to be the backups? I know it isn't ideal, but year me out here. Aldridge plays 30 minutes. leaving 18 minutes to be filled. In small ball guys like Kawhi and KA or even Burtans can fill in. Leaving small amount of time for these two to fill in.

PG- Parker, Teodosic, Murray
SG- Green, Manu, Simmons
SF- Leonard, Anderson, Bertans
PF- Aldridge, Lalanne, LJC
C- Gasol, Boban, Milutinov

[Snaq O'Meal]

ugggghhh so many ppl in that list that are not pulling their worth that it's necessary to hope some unheralded young player has a fantastic year bc a lot of the highest or even mid-level players in that list are not producing what you would expect for what they are paid. Tony is the worst, but Diaw is next behind him and if TD retires yuck. I'd say let's swallow his contract this year and not stretch him but they may need to for Gasol. Dead salary.

Actually, most of them were pulling their weight:


Kawhi Leonard: +$20.8 value ($37.2 million value produced, $16.4 million contract value)
David West: +$9.9 value ($11.4 million value produced, $1.5 million contract value)
Tim Duncan: +$8.4 value ($14.4 million value produced, $6.0 million contract value)
Manu Ginobili: +$6.8 value ($9.6 million value produced, $2.8 million contract value)
Kyle Anderson: +$6.1 value ($7.2 million value produced, $1.1 million contract value)
Patty Mills: +$6.0 value ($9.6 million value produced, $3.6 million contract value)
Danny Green: +$5.0 value ($15 million value produced, $10 million contract value)
Boban Marjanovic: +$3.0 value ($4.2 million value produced, $1.2 million contract value)
Rasual Butler: +$1.5 value ($2.4 million value produced, $0.9 million contract value)
Jonathon Simmons: +$0.7 value ($1.2 million value produced, $0.5 million contract value)
Andre Miller: +$0.3 value ($0.6 million value produced, $0.3 million contract value)
Matt Bonner: +$0.3 value ($1.2 million value produced, $0.9 million contract value)
Boris Diaw: -$0.9 value ($6.6 million value produced, $7.5 million contract value)
LaMarcus Aldridge: -$6.5 value ($13.2 million value produced, $19.7 million contract value)
Tony Parker: -$7.4 value ($6.0 million value produced, $13.4 million contract value)


The exceptions are Diaw, Aldridge and Parker.

And you can excuse Aldridge from that group, since he did produce $13.2 million of value in a new system, and will only get better.

[timtonymanu]

Shams Charania Verified account ‏@ShamsCharania

Vertical Sources: Free agent Tarik Black has agreed to a two-year, $12.85 million deal to re-sign with the Los Angeles Lakers.

[Chinook]

I actually like Black. If there's a team option or non-guaranteed year in there, it seems fine.

[MaNu4Tres]

Those trades would only free up about $9 Million (they make about $10 Million combined, and then you have to add the two roster charges of about $500k each), so that would leave the team with $19,419,640 in space and with nine players accounted for. Assuming Pau took $12 Million, the Spurs would have about $8-9 Million to get a backup PF and backup PG. That's possible, but pretty risky. Let's just assume Jones and Teodosic, since that's like best-case here, along with Manu, Tim and Lalanne as before:

Parker, Teodosic, Murray
Green, Manu, Simmons
Leonard, Anderson
Aldridge, Jones, LJC
Gasol, Duncan, Lalanne

The big thing missing is Bertans. The Spurs would likely have to choose to let one of the two full rotation spots go to bring him on. If the team is comfortable with Andre Miller being the backup PG, maybe they could have him instead of Milos and have Bertans as that final spot.

Diaw is due to make 7 million, Patty 3.6 million= 7+ 3.6 = 10.6 million, no? 10.6 is closer to 11 than 10 no? Am I missing something?

[Chinook]

Diaw is due to make 7 million, Patty 3.6 million= 7+ 3.6 = 10.6 million, no? 10.6 is closer to 11 than 10 no? Am I missing something?

Diaw is due $6.5 Million due to him missing his weight incentive last season (not confirmed that he missed it, but c'mon now, that wasn't helium). Mills makes $3.578 Million. Those combine for $10.078 Million. That minus two roster charges leads to a savings of $8,992,006,

[SAGirl]

Actually, most of them were pulling their weight:


Kawhi Leonard: +$20.8 value ($37.2 million value produced, $16.4 million contract value)
David West: +$9.9 value ($11.4 million value produced, $1.5 million contract value)
Tim Duncan: +$8.4 value ($14.4 million value produced, $6.0 million contract value)
Manu Ginobili: +$6.8 value ($9.6 million value produced, $2.8 million contract value)
Kyle Anderson: +$6.1 value ($7.2 million value produced, $1.1 million contract value)
Patty Mills: +$6.0 value ($9.6 million value produced, $3.6 million contract value)
Danny Green: +$5.0 value ($15 million value produced, $10 million contract value)
Boban Marjanovic: +$3.0 value ($4.2 million value produced, $1.2 million contract value)
Rasual Butler: +$1.5 value ($2.4 million value produced, $0.9 million contract value)
Jonathon Simmons: +$0.7 value ($1.2 million value produced, $0.5 million contract value)
Andre Miller: +$0.3 value ($0.6 million value produced, $0.3 million contract value)
Matt Bonner: +$0.3 value ($1.2 million value produced, $0.9 million contract value)
Boris Diaw: -$0.9 value ($6.6 million value produced, $7.5 million contract value)
LaMarcus Aldridge: -$6.5 value ($13.2 million value produced, $19.7 million contract value)
Tony Parker: -$7.4 value ($6.0 million value produced, $13.4 million contract value)


The exceptions are Diaw, Aldridge and Parker.

And you can excuse Aldridge from that group, since he did produce $13.2 million of value in a new system, and will only get better.

Yup I saw that post. I cut Aldridge slack bc his first half of the season he was utterly in deferral mode and I know it affected his stats. I would expect a better season from him next. Tony and Diaw were the ones underperforming yet they won't be traded. Tony is the worst but Diaw is super streaky and flat out disappears at times. As much as the trolls hate on Kyle for example, the proof is in the pudding. Even with a terrible super passive start to the season Kyle outperformed his contract times six bc he picked up the slack when we had vets injured. It just showed he had been underused up until then. If he picks it up where he left off I think he will far outperform himself, and bc he can play so many positions I see him filling up a lot of holes. But it does make one wonder about the "dead weight" bc those guys are unlikely to increase their production. All one can hope is that they hold steady. Tony and Diaw won't be better than they were, they simply can't.

[SD126]

Yup I saw that post. I cut Aldridge slack bc his first half of the season he was utterly in deferral mode and I know it affected his stats. I would expect a better season from him next. Tony and Diaw were the ones underperforming yet they won't be traded. Tony is the worst but Diaw is super streaky and flat out disappears at times. As much as the trolls hate on Kyle for example, the proof is in the pudding. Even with a terrible super passive start to the season Kyle outperformed his contract times six bc he picked up the slack when we had vets injured. It just showed he had been underused up until then. If he picks it up where he left off I think he will far outperform himself, and bc he can play so many positions I see him filling up a lot of holes. But it does make one wonder about the "dead weight" bc those guys are unlikely to increase their production. All one can hope is that they hold steady. Tony and Diaw won't be better than they were, they simply can't.

Turning another post into yet another Kyle love affair per par. We get it, you're in mad love with the guy. No need to say it 1,000,000 times. Just get his # already. Lol

[marinoman]

Shams Charania Verified account ‏@ShamsCharania

Vertical Sources: Free agent Tarik Black has agreed to a two-year, $12.85 million deal to re-sign with the Los Angeles Lakers.

The rich get richer