Bulls: Pippen is just another cog in the Jordan propaganda machine

[lefty]

Scottie lost the whole team after sitting out. Kerr said it. Phil said it. Grant said it. Scottie wasn't a main guy. That's why they fell apart the next year.

Not denying that
Also the Kukoc incident is not a good look
Jost to clarify I don’t think Pippen was an Alpha leader , my point is his versatility was huge for Chicago and he took a lot of pressure off Jordan

[lefty]

It did. But that team defense improvement wasn't just or even mostly because of Pippen. Some folks credit the 94 Bulls as proof that Pippen was his own superstar. I didn't view it that way at all.

As for 94-95 it wasn’t a good indication either, they had lost Horace Grant to free agency and didn’t replace him until the following season (with Worm)

[KobesAchilles]

Not denying that
Also the Kukoc incident is not a good look
Jost to clarify I don’t think Pippen was an Alpha leader , my point is his versatility was huge for Chicago and he took a lot of pressure off Jordan

I know it's completely off topic and it didn't happen, but imagine if Reggie Miller played on the Knicks instead Indiana. Ewing was a monster and deserved a second star. Imagine passing the ball out of the post and having an actual shooter getting the ball.

Does Jordan even ring?

[james evans]

Rodman was finished mentally which is why he flamed out shortly after Chicago. He had 1 eye on life off the court even with the Bulls in the 2nd & 3rd season.

No one is saying Jordan led a team of nobodies to the le. We all remember his 2 seasons with the Wizards. The point is Pippen was a bigger beneficiary of the relationship. I highly doubt Scottie would be anywhere near these 50 Greatest Players lists without Jordan. On the flip side MJ would still be in the GOAT discussion.

IMO Scottie made sacrifices and feels they are overlooked. But he doesn't realize his legacy is tied to the Bulls and their accomplishments. He's a 16PPG career player. Jordan's influence goes beyond even the basketball court. It might sting Pippen that he was 3rd in terms of being a Pop Icon to Rodman.

He should have been finished AFTER Chicago, he was damn near 40 lol. You are aware that he was 37 years old in '98 right?

[lefty]

I know it's completely off topic and it didn't happen, but imagine if Reggie Miller played on the Knicks instead Indiana. Ewing was a monster and deserved a second star. Imagine passing the ball out of the post and having an actual shooter getting the ball.

Does Jordan even ring?

good question tbh
Reggie was a much better shooter than Starks and didn’t have a short fuse
I think they beat Chicago but it’s hypothetical so who knows.
Plus the refs were in Mike’s pocket

[james evans]

Jordan definitely deserves credit for keeping Rodman in line. No one else in the league would have but Jordan would have probably beat the living out of Rodman if he pulled the crap he did in San Antonio in Chicago.

Like he did Reggie Miller? hahahaha. Jordan couldn't fight. No one was afraid of him but Steve Kerr

[ambchang]

Tbh Chuck was robbed of a ring. But Chuck also had some bad luck when it came to injuries. He was injured after the 93 season a lot or KJ was injured a lot. They were a 1 year wonder due to that. The 93 team though was special and I don't think Chuck was that hard to build around.

Yeah his style of play where he pound the ball inside, back his man down, slow it down was repe ive, but a lot of successful teams played that way. The Celtics were the same style. Duncan and Shaq and Hakeem were too. He was also fantastic in the open court.

Barkley struggled with being in shape. It's why he jacked up so many 3s because he was too tired to play in the post. His defense wasn't that big an issue to me bc honestly you could hide him on a SF not named Pip. Also a lot of PFs in the East were really ty. Just bad luck for Chuck that he had to go against Malone and Kemp.

I actually view his defence was the major concern. Duncan did it because even though they had that 4-down offence, Duncan manned the paint and had historically good defensive teams because of it.

Shaq had Kobe/Wade which were known as 2 of the top 3 SG ever. Hakeem had that crazy three point shooting team and his defence was out of this world.

The Suns were really close, I would say they would likely win in most of the years he didn't have to go up against Jordan. That Suns team would have won it all against the Knicks in 94 for sure (not sure about the Magic in 95 though).

Barkley guarding SF would be a disaster, they can just blow past him. I never really figured out why Barkley is so poor defensively. Is it because he was unengaged? Because he was out of shape? He had all the physical tools to be great defensively.

But I agree, Barkley in the open court was a sight to behold. For all the talk about Jordan (Kobe, Carter, T-Mac, Iverson, Kawhi), Magic (Lebron, Pippen), Bird (Dirk, Luka), Shaq (Wilt) being unique, there really isn't another Barkley since Barkley. A 6'5" PF who can score, rebound, run, dunk, shoot, and ball-handle like him is just unique (unless you count Clarence Weatherspoon, who couldn't do most of those things and only similar to Barkley because they are short and fat PFs).

[ambchang]

Jordan definitely deserves credit for keeping Rodman in line. No one else in the league would have but Jordan would have probably beat the living out of Rodman if he pulled the crap he did in San Antonio in Chicago.

no

Rodman himself credited Jackson for reaching out to him. Not jordan or Pippen. He said he said daly and Jackson as father figures who cared about him and accepted him.

Jordan is a bully who can’t handle when he got it shoved back to him. Ask Cartwright and Kerr.

[ambchang]

Like he did Reggie Miller? hahahaha. Jordan couldn't fight. No one was afraid of him but Steve Kerr

Steve Kerr beat his ass and jordan never bothered him again. Over the years people make it out as Kerr got beat by jordan or something.

[lefty]

no

Rodman himself credited Jackson for reaching out to him. Not jordan or Pippen. He said he said daly and Jackson as father figures who cared about him and accepted him.

Jordan is a bully who can’t handle when he got it shoved back to him. Ask Cartwright and Kerr.

[Dirks_Finale]

Like he did Reggie Miller? hahahaha. Jordan couldn't fight. No one was afraid of him but Steve Kerr

Well, he never got his azzz beat by Chris Childs like Kobe did

[Dirks_Finale]

Chicago was the only team that would trade for Rodman after his gotry in the 95 playoffs.

They landed Will Perdue in return. You have to do better than that for a player of Rodman's caliber. You just have to.

[baseline bum]

They landed Will Perdue in return. You have to do better than that for a player of Rodman's caliber. You just have to.

Rodman might as well have been Royce White as far as NBA GMs were concerned after the crap he pulled in the 1995 WCF. Perdue from Chicago was the only offer any team made for Rodman, and they probably only offered him because Jordan hated Perdue. He used to call him Will Vanderbilt since he didn't think Perdue should share a name with a decent college program.

[Isitjustme?]

Phil Jackson also handled Rodman well tbh

Lefty always there the minute anyone says anything even remotely positive about Jordan with a "yeah, but.." Never seen a person so brain ed by an athlete

[Dirks_Finale]

Lefty always there the minute anyone says anything even remotely positive about Jordan with a "yeah, but.." Never seen a person so brain ed by an athlete

This is what Jordan did to an entire generation of Ewing/Barkley/Malone/Miller fans.

[lefty]

Lefty always there the minute anyone says anything even remotely positive about Jordan with a "yeah, but.." Never seen a person so brain ed by an athlete

apparently Jordan’s is still in your mouth because it’s a well known fact it was Phil who handled Rodman and not Jordan

[lefty]

This is what Jordan did to an entire generation of Ewing/Barkley/Malone/Miller fans.

thinking a Spurs fan would be rooting for those guys, great logic, but I guess that’s what you did since the Mavs were one of the worst teams in the league
vivre par procuration

[Killakobe81]

Well, he never got his azzz beat by Chris Childs like Kobe did

Neither could fight (MJ Kobe or Bron) … doubt you can either if a two piece (really just one clean) counts to you as getting someone’s ass beat. Child’s won the encounter but let’s not exaggerate.

[ambchang]

Neither could fight (MJ Kobe or Bron) … doubt you can either if a two piece (really just one clean) counts to you as getting someone’s ass beat. Child’s won the encounter but let’s not exaggerate.

Did Katie one piece or two piece Kobe. I don’t remember the details.