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It’s hard to get in the conversation for trading for max type players without giving up multiple FRPs and the chance of a max player wanting to sign here is low. I’m all for throwing max money at Lavine, Beal, Harden etc but it won’t happen.
I never said the Spurs should trade their picks. But they should look to add a starting caliber PF, exactly for the reason you mentioned in your last sentence. They got 3 2nd rounders and the Chicago pick to play with. And they might still get some more minor assets by moving Young and Forbes. I'm fine with renting out cap space too.
It’s hard to get in the conversation for trading for max type players without giving up multiple FRPs and the chance of a max player wanting to sign here is low. I’m all for throwing max money at Lavine, Beal, Harden etc but it won’t happen.
I didn't say they should add a max player either. I don't know what you are reading. A Jeramie Grant caliber player would do wonders for this team
I think Wiseman skill set has a much higher ceiling. I also think Wiseman would do well in a pick n roll heavy offense rather than the heavy motion offense that warriors employ. It's a slight risk, sure, hence why the spurs deserve a 1st or another youth.
Massive risk. I don't get why you're bent on trading a very productive good defensive center on a pretty cheap contract for this guy. Are people just bored or something?
My mad, jumped to conclusions. I agree with targeting mid tier players like Grant in the short to medium term.
I mean dude, do you not see our record and the team we send out there? I think Jakob is a good player, and I defend him on this board regularly. I think he's underrated by a lot of the posters on here, but this team is going to have to make high upside trades with some of these players unless we are happy with where the team is. They have players that hold value to other teams that the Spurs should capitalize on in order to improve their situation. If they trade away Poeltl its not high risk at all. What are you at risk of losing? Yeah, you will likely downgrade at the center position, but in terms of win/loss changes its not a noticeable change.
The question people should be asking is keeping a player making the Spurs substantially more likely to make the playoffs in the next 2 years than trading them away. With Poeltl there is absolutely no way the answer here is to keep him. This doesn't mean the Spurs should just give him away to just do something, but he's an upcoming free agent that while fills a good role for a good team, on this team he doesn't really move the needle all that much.
The recent Spurs run of bad play has really pushed them into a position where they should absolutely be sellers at the Trade deadline. Poeltl is probalby their most valuable trade asset, is underpaid, and is only under contract for another year after this one. Its pretty hard to justify him being a long term solution for the Spurs, imo.
People are used to the Spurs not doing much at the deadline but I think this year they are primed to trade away multiple players. I think Jakob, Brynn, and Thad all have decent chances of ending up on another team at the deadline.
Don't know how Wiseman is a massive risk. He is on a rookie contract. Second year. Never had a training camp due to covid and injuries. I am not sure how much better Poeltl will get. When he slowly loses some speed, his defense will slowly go with it. I'm not sure he can increase his offensive production and liability enough to make up for it. To me, Wiseman is the center i want to invest in for 3 seasons time. But again, I want something more than just Wiseman for Poeltl.
Yeah, I was bummed we didn't get Wiseman on draft night. He appears to have lots of raw talent, but he's going to need some work before he's a regular rotation player. He's got lots of upside if that potential could be realized. It would definitely have to be sweetened quite a bit beyond a Wiseman for Poetl swap for it to make sense for San Antonio.
Nah I’d take it straight up. I know Poeltl played great last night, but I think Wiseman has a higher ceiling. It’s a win-now for Dubs who Poeltl can definitely help given in the right environment and talent around him. But two years from now, Wiseman will bury him. Already Poeltl couldn’t cover the likes of Wiseman with a passing PG. That’s the only thing, DJM is not really a true PG and it would be Derrick or Trey to create for Wiseman.
I wonder how opportunistic the Spurs will be with Jak. I’m not giving him away for cents on the dollar but Jak is a win now player who is only going to cost more on his next deal. We are nowhere near win now mode and could easily replace him in free agency or potentially internally, atleast in a capacity that sufficiently meets the needs of the rebuild. This year was all about analyzing talent, giving guys their opportunity and seeing what we have. We now have a great idea of exactly the player Jak is. This offseason is probably a good time to decide where he stacks up in our future.
Jak for Wisemen makes sense for both parties.
The Covid situation really forced Pop to play his young players more than he would normally do, which is the silver lining if anything. The next big step is to weed-out the players who are not necessarily helping as a rebuild team, and getting good assets in return. Forbes, Poeltl, Lonnie, Eubanks and even Derrick could be on the move for the right trade. I’ve never known the Spurs as a big player in trade market, but I haven’t seen the Spurs as a rebuilding team since Pre-DRob, and that’s older than any of Spurs players
I absolutely think D White should be opportunistically shopped. White is a solid 2-way player on a fair contract but I think we can confidently conclude he probably isn’t going to break through to that next tier of player; he has had many opportunities this season to take over and failed todo so. He is a perfect win now role player however. DJ solidified himself as a major building block for your long term plan. Primo/Vassell could take up the slack if White was moved.
Where is Wiseman now?
GLeauge he is not on roster.
Warriors shows zero minutes.
Is he at end of Warrior bench still rehabbing while not playing?
Yes perfect to find a team that thinks it can win now thus will give up a meaningful piece.
He’ll be cleared for play soon, likely getting reps in Santa Cruz first. Warriors hoping to have him back as their starting 5 for the playoffs I read. Jak could be a value add starting 5 this week.
It can't be a massive risk. Losing Poeltl for nothing is the absolute downside of that trade, and that wouldn't really hurt the Spurs. There will be centers the Spurs can take for free in trades or sign as free agents who will have a similar impact. Maybe it costs more money, but the Spurs will also have an extra pick (if not more) to work with. They can afford to take a step back at the deepest position on the team/in the league in order to put themselves in a better position to get a difference-maker.
Again, the idea that the Spurs should only trade away bad players and should keep all the good ones can only exist within an underdeveloped view of team-building. There are reasons not to trade Poeltl (chemistry being the largest), but him being on a good contract for a team with tons of cap space and him being good enough to have trade value don't belong on that side of the leger.
Then no way Warriors will go Wiseman for Jak.
What are you thinking they would offer?
What I don't understand is why people are wanting to undersell so much. I am willing to deal Jakob Poetle but he is a fairly young upper tier starting caliber starter on a team friendly contract, you don't give that up for a mid 20s first round pick. Now I would take a late first round pick, a PF prospect and a 2023 2nd rounder. I would take a probable lottery pick is someone was offering and a maybe risky prospect at some random position. But if you aren't getting equal or greater value you don't trade strong pieces of your rotation on good contracts.
I don't see it as an undersell.
Even if Wiseman had a 50% bust probability, you make a deal if you can get him for Jak straight up. I like Jak, but this franchise has to take some swings.
No, dude. Trading a good defensive center for a crap player like Wiseman or a first round pick who maaaaaybe might turn out to be as good as Jakob Poeltl is completely stupid. Wiseman may one day be as good as Poeltl, but he's already on a very expensive salary track.
Trading Poeltl just because is stupid message board bull .
Would feel better about trading Poeltl in general if they had decent replacement on the horizon, but they trade away Milutinov's rights. Landale is okay but not up to the defense and Eubanks is Eubanks.
I don't think Wiseman after all his injuries and lack of court time is good enough to be worth Poeltl straight up. And I was all about him in that draft because of the potential, but he's way way behind and too fragile.
Poeltl would be so awesome with GS with the bonus that he never has to play crunch time and be a free throw liability because Draymond is the closing center.
Maybe something like Poeltl and Lonnie for Wiseman, Moody and their late 1st, which will be 25-30
I'd be good with this. I do have those doubts about Wiseman but also, I am with the people saying Poeltl doesn't fit our timeline, as in he is going to want more money just for us to be the same kind of team we are now for the next 2-3 years at least..
Suffice it to say, I'm not super-attached to Jak if an offer that is interesting in a good way comes along.
At this point, looking at potential, if it's not DM, Keldon, Devin, Jock, or Primo they can probably go however they go, as long as we get something with really good potential for Jak and Derrick if they go.
This thread is as dumb as the "trade everything for Ben Simmosn" thread.
Those who think that Poeltl doesn't match the Spurs' timeline and doesn't complement the teams' core are morons who haven't watched a single Spurs game since the Big 3 retired. Poeltl has an infuriatingly poor free throw %. Other than that he has been a net positive for the Spurs in every aspect - rebounding, scoring, passing, screen-setting, rim defense, defending in space, playing within the flow of the offense. You name it and he has done that to the betterment of the Spurs team and that is why he is net positive by a margin on both defense and offense for the Spurs according to several advanced Stats. And his salary is barely mid-level. Poeltl is probably one of the best bargain players in the league. The same could be said of Dejounte and Derrick as well. The Spurs would be fools to give up on one of these three. And they should hold on to Vassell, Johnson and Primo as well.
They did the right thing by letting go of Forbes. Now they should find a partner to buy Young for a pick or a prospect. And the maddeningly inconsistent Lonnie Walker can be let go too.
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