Countdown To Kamala Presidency

[Winehole23]

Sure, as AG I think she was clearly more establishment.

But take a gander at her voting record. She isn't exactly Joe Manchin, she votes with the democrat's 99% of the time. She's for single payer, for banning fracking, likely wants to put AOC as the secretary of energy, etc.

BTW, she gets slammed on here for her record as AG on drug convictions, but even her position on that has changed as she introduced legislation to decriminalize weed. Not saying that's bad, I actually agree with it, I'm just saying she has moved further to the left.

Seems you don't like Harris because she doesn't vote with Republicans and she *might* support some things you don't like. If "hard left" just means Democratic party membership plus conventional 2020 Democratic positions, "hard left" just means "Democrat."

Can you lend any support to your claims that Harris wants to ban fracking and supports single payer healthcare?

(Your conjecture that AOC is somehow in the running for Sec'y of Energy seems more like a convenient juxtaposition than a real take -- AOC has no relevant bureaucratic or professional experience for a position like that.)

[Proxy]

Much worse than Obama.

She failed the Bar exam to practice law in California. She was polling at like 3% in the (D) primaries and nobody liked her or her ridiculous cackle. She runs to iden y politics whenever she feels cornered and just makes sh1t up on the fly like listening to Tupac when Tupac was like 4 years old We all know why she is VP as opposed to the usual Tim Kaine types.

I would argue that Obama was fairly centrist. Overall, in addition to being about as likable as a carbuncle, she is hard left.

agreed on all points in the first paragraph. Her and Obama are both center at their most liberal though, neither sniffs legitimate left politics tbh

[Dirks_Finale]

I've actually taken a look at her voting record and the legislation she introduced, as I know she will be POTUS soon. I've also paid attention to the comments she has made on several key issues. A quick search will help you as I don't do people's homework for them.

If you identify as progressive, I think you will be pleasantly surprised with her. The rest of us will have a grand celebration the day she walks away.

Seems you don't like Harris because she doesn't vote with Republicans and she *might* support some things you don't like. If "hard left" just means Democratic party membership plus conventional 2020 Democratic positions, "hard left" just means "Democrat."

Can you lend any support to your claims that Harris wants to ban fracking and supports single payer healthcare?

(Your conjecture that AOC is somehow in the running for Sec'y of Energy seems more like a convenient juxtaposition than a real take -- AOC has no relevant bureaucratic or professional experience for a position like that.)

[Winehole23]

I've actually taken a look at her voting record and the legislation she introduced, as I know she will be POTUS soon. I've also paid attention to the comments she has made on several key issues. A quick search will help you as I don't do people's homework for them.

If you identify as progressive, I think you will be pleasantly surprised with her. The rest of us will have a grand celebration the day she walks away.

Please share the info you're referring to, I'm not a mind-reader and besides, we probably don't agree on the basic terms, which are still undefined.

Which KH positions are "moderate"? Which are "progressive"? Which are "hard left"? Did you quantify the distribution between these, or did you just eyeball it?

I notice you took a pass on Harris supporting a fracking ban and single payer healthcare, so I'll just assume you pulled that out of the air.

What you call homework I would call the burden of supporting your own claims. If you abandon the effort, you abandon the claims. If support for your own point isn't handy, so much the worse for your point.

[spurraider21]

That chart is pretty bad tbh

gravel far right? Tulsi actually in Bernie territory? (I was admittedly duped by her facade as well)

[Winehole23]

That chart is pretty bad tbh

gravel far right? Tulsi actually in Bernie territory? (I was admittedly duped by her facade as well)

Yeah, there's some screwy stuff, but the general thrust -- most US politicians in the upper right quadrant -- strikes me as broadly accurate, which was the point of posting it.

[DMC]

Don't use a chart that's obviously wrong. I think people should stop using the entire world as a gauge for political leaning in the United States. It doesn't mean the same thing here that does there. We have different reference points.

[Winehole23]

I think people should stop using the entire world as a gauge for political leaning in the United States. It doesn't mean the same thing here that does there. We have different reference points.

The incidence of leftist politics in the USA is vanishing. It's pretty much all centrist and right wing.

[DMC]

The incidence of leftist politics in the USA is vanishing. It's pretty much all centrist and right wing.

Not if you use a valid reference point.

[spurraider21]

Not if you use a valid reference point.

it does if we all understanding "leftist" to mean left of liberal, or if taken to its ends, anti-capitalism

ie aoc/sanders

of course in american discourse, left or leftist typically just refers to the democrat party, though i think through context its clear what WH meant (though to some people like derp anybody who isnt a trump loyalist is a communist, so theres that)

[DMC]

it does if we all understanding "leftist" to mean left of liberal, or if taken to its ends, anti-capitalism

ie aoc/sanders

of course in american discourse, left or leftist typically just refers to the democrat party, though i think through context its clear what WH meant (though to some people like derp anybody who isnt a trump loyalist is a communist, so theres that)

But Sanders is barely left according to the chart. If we consider Sanders to be almost conservative, we don't really have a left in the US. So left of center doesn't mean anything if we don't define center. To some here, anyone who isn't a Marxist is a Trump . But there's a reason universal left isn't popular in the US. Maybe some should consider that instead of trying to shoehorn a broken system into place. Either system is selfish. It's human nature.

[DMC]

Has there ever been a video game where you can sim government styles to see how they play out, what roadblocks pop up and such? Would be interesting.

[spurraider21]

But Sanders is barely left according to the chart. If we consider Sanders to be almost conservative, we don't really have a left in the US. So left of center doesn't mean anything if we don't define center. To some here, anyone who isn't a Marxist is a Trump . But there's a reason universal left isn't popular in the US. Maybe some should consider that instead of trying to shoehorn a broken system into place. Either system is selfish. It's human nature.

ive already said the graph is bad (i was just addressing WH's comment)

the reason why sanders would not be far left by their system is likely because he's not calling for the abolition of capitalism. i dont think their economic center is aligned very realistically

[Dirks_Finale]

Please share the info you're referring to, I'm not a mind-reader and besides, we probably don't agree on the basic terms, which are still undefined.

Which KH positions are "moderate"? Which are "progressive"? Which are "hard left"? Did you quantify the distribution between these, or did you just eyeball it?

I notice you took a pass on Harris supporting a fracking ban and single payer healthcare, so I'll just assume you pulled that out of the air.

What you call homework I would call the burden of supporting your own claims. If you abandon the effort, you abandon the claims. If support for your own point isn't handy, so much the worse for your point.

Google search takes like 25 seconds bro You are doing the lawyer schtick like chump

https://www.cnn.com/2017/08/30/polit...payer-medicare

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph.../fracking-ban/

And there is more where that came from if you look at her voting record and legislation introduced which is all public record.

But I do think the Dems have moved so far left that you and I probably have different ideas about what is progressive, now. Things like reparations and UBI have become a thing with y'all, lately, so hard to keep up with the official progressive pendulum.

[Dirks_Finale]

But Sanders is barely left according to the chart. If we consider Sanders to be almost conservative, we don't really have a left in the US. So left of center doesn't mean anything if we don't define center. To some here, anyone who isn't a Marxist is a Trump . But there's a reason universal left isn't popular in the US. Maybe some should consider that instead of trying to shoehorn a broken system into place. Either system is selfish. It's human nature.

The dem's pendulum has move so far left that Sanders probably is a moderate now . What is his position on reparations, etc?

[DMC]

ive already said the graph is bad (i was just addressing WH's comment)

the reason why sanders would not be far left by their system is likely because he's not calling for the abolition of capitalism. i dont think their economic center is aligned very realistically

So I have no idea what you're arguing against (like always). Since my comment wasn't to you and WH left out my first sentence in my response, you're jousting windmills again.

[Winehole23]

The dem's pendulum has move so far left that Sanders probably is a moderate now . What is his position on reparations, etc?

Disagree thatthe Dems are left of Bernie.

By what definition of left is that true? What does the "leftist shift" consist of?

[Dirks_Finale]

Disagree thatthe Dems are left of Bernie.

By what definition of left is that true? What does the "leftist shift" consist of?

You tell me. Are you progressive? What is your position on the border?

[Winehole23]

Google search takes like 25 seconds bro You are doing the lawyer schtick like chump

https://www.cnn.com/2017/08/30/polit...payer-medicare

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph.../fracking-ban/

And there is more where that came from if you look at her voting record and legislation introduced which is all public record.

But I do think the Dems have moved so far left that you and I probably have different ideas about what is progressive, now. Things like reparations and UBI have become a thing with y'all, lately, so hard to keep up with the official progressive pendulum.

You still haven't shown your hand or defined your terms, you're just handwaving.

Which policies count as far left? Which are moderate? Which are conservative?

If you can't explain how you reached your conclusions about KH and the Demsin your own words, you probably haven't thought it through yet.

[spurraider21]

So I have no idea what you're arguing against (like always). Since my comment wasn't to you and WH left out my first sentence in my response, you're jousting windmills again.

ok, i'll explain (see how easy this is?)

The incidence of leftist politics in the USA is vanishing. It's pretty much all centrist and right wing.

i was responding in reference to this post. i think its clear given the context that by "leftist politics" he was not just referring to what we consider democrats in general to be, but rather, politicians of the sanders/aoc variety.

where you think that should show up on the graph is its own question, and i dont think the graph does a good job of it

[DMC]

Google search takes like 25 seconds bro You are doing the lawyer schtick like chump

https://www.cnn.com/2017/08/30/polit...payer-medicare

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph.../fracking-ban/

And there is more where that came from if you look at her voting record and legislation introduced which is all public record.

But I do think the Dems have moved so far left that you and I probably have different ideas about what is progressive, now. Things like reparations and UBI have become a thing with y'all, lately, so hard to keep up with the official progressive pendulum.

He cannot get off Twitter long enough to search for anything.

[Winehole23]

You tell me. Are you progressive? What is your position on the border?

Happy to once you define your own terms. Of you can't or refuse to, others will be free to conclude you're just making stuff up

[DMC]

ok, i'll explain (see how easy this is?)

i was responding in reference to this post. i think its clear given the context that by "leftist politics" he was not just referring to what we consider democrats in general to be, but rather, politicians of the sanders/aoc variety.

where you think that should show up on the graph is its own question, and i dont think the graph does a good job of it

Ok you don't follow conversations, you just take a post out of context and go on a tangent from there. Got it.

Him: ty graph
Me: Don't use ty graph, have a valid reference
Him: Left doesn't exist
Me: Not on your chart basically, because no valid reference
You: tangent

[pgardn]

You're not turning tables, BlakeBlaker.

The busboy speaks...

[DMC]

Happy to once you define your own terms. Of you can't or refuse to, others will be free to conclude you're just making stuff up

Valid reference good now