Shocking as it may be, I'm not Pop or Morey, so I won't be able to consummate a trade.
Pretzel logic. My proposal is on, so I say it’s fake.
Shocking as it may be, I'm not Pop or Morey, so I won't be able to consummate a trade.
Tbh they probably can’t either so don’t beat yourself up over it.
lol don't know how to respond to this because it's so obvious but provide some stats that show how any of our young spursies is in simmons' league, and i'll pay attention
Player A per 36: 17.7 PTS / 8 REB / 6 AST / 1.7 STL / 45% FG / 79% FT / PER: 16.5 / VORP 1.4 / WS 3.3
Player B per 36: 16 PTS / 8 REB / 7.7 AST / 1.8 STL / 55% FG / 61% FT / PER: 18.3 / VORP 2.2 / WS 6
Which one is Simmons and which one is Murray?
Me neither.
FiveThirtyEight Raptor WAR
37) Danny Green, Royce O'Neal, Ben Simmons
96) Jarrett Allen, Chris Boucher, DeMar DeRozan, Duncan Robinson, Domantis Sabonis, Christian Wood.
DeRozan 3.6 Off; -2.9 Def.
Simmons 0.7 Off; 1.8 Def.
At least he isn't scared of shooting the three.. isn't a mental midget, and doesn't have the contractual baggage of simmons. He would also probably have good trade value for a contender.
He had a great Olympics and i can see him building off it if he gets minutes this season.
Murray is the one who is able to stay on the court in the 4th qtr
If that shoot around video is legit he'll soon be in the pantheon of hated Spurs franchise guys of which DeRozan is a single member.
For those who want him this was his play that cemented Philly wanting to unload him. Not unlike Raptors wanting to dump DeRozan after his 4th Qt benching in the playoffs vs James and co.
Of course we'll give him a chance as Spurs fans initially but based on his career thus far it's gonna be a long road for him to measure up to the haul the front office gives up for him.
guy is a fkn scrub, 5yrs in the league..yet doesnt have a jumpshot to rely on
makes a dunk and screams like a like he did some meaningful to the scoreboard...
I just don't want the guy. Multiple reasons but at the end of the day, he is not as compe ive as any of the guys we would have to give up to get him. Maybe he changes, I am not willing to ship out talent and pay him his salary for his lack of heart.
Just remember fur every sixers playoff failure, he was the scape goat for simply not fitting with Embid. From the sounds of this, sixers locker room is a mess.
The one with far superior advanced stats. You left out (flawed) plusminus too btw
Far superior? Plenty of advanced stats, especially https://www.bball-index.com/ have DJ and Simmons impact very close FWIW.
FT% kind of give it away tbh
But in all seriousness I really agree with this. I think the ONLY thing you can reasonably say Simmons does better than DM is guard the 4-5. Some people on here are ready to sell the farm for a slightly taller Murray.
He does several things better probably, but the question is his impact so much greater than Murrays along with DJ coming into a more prominent role, worth giving up a lot for?
It gets pretty damn murky IMO and depends on how much you think Ben can make a leap. He’s still fine if he doesn’t leap, but if that gap keeps closing because Murray keeps improving then the impact Murray has on winning (when surrounded by good players like Ben was) means that SA shouldn’t be giving up too much IMO
Imagine what would happen when Ben Simmons refuses to take a dunk in the 4th quarter of a game 7 for San Antonio
Big time shoulder rubs from Pop, just like whenever Forbes was a 4th quarter disaster.
I can kind of see it now, lol. Murray has too much fire, Simmons has the right kind of no-threes, no-twos, no-free-throws dribble dribble dribble game that Pop might be going for
paywall sorry
dejounte took a big leap last year; simmons had a subpar year last year, and simmons is still far ahead.
simmons also is physically superior. people are counting on dejounte to keep on getting better but there's no guarantee he'll ever be better than simmons is right now ... and if spurs do trade for simmons it would be betting that he can sort out his glaring weaknesses (in spite of which, he remains way better than any of the spurs yoof)
don't get me wrong. i'm not super-high on ben. i'm just relatively down on the spurs youngsters, compared to most on this board
You keep saying that but I literally posted the raw per 36 numbers and a link to advanced stats that LITERALLY say he was not “far” ahead. Especially on impact stats.
One could argue that while Simmons had a subpar year, he also played in a far weaker conference, alongside an MVP level player and better all around team to make things a lot easier for him.
Agree on the part that DJ may never be better than Simmons is now; but that’s not really the question here. It’s how much does SA give up for someone who right now isn’t light years ahead already? And will the gap close more or will Simmons finally improve his game and stop relying strictly on the talent he came into the league with.
That’s a tough question.
win share rank -- ben 39 dejounte 131
vorp rank - ben 38 dejounte 69
per rank - ben 53 dejounte 76
bpm rank - ben 40 dejounte 77
i looked at the LEBRON ratings and yes they have ben being better on D and dejounte being better on O and them evening out
otoh 538's RAPTOR ratings has ben being equal on O and far superior on D
so unless you are talking strictly about LEBRON ... ben is unquestionably a tier above dejounte (with a far higher hypothetical ceiling imo)
Point being I think it’s obvious with the situation that SA is in, they should absolutely be doing their due diligence on situations like Simmons or any other “star” that may be available. But they also need to tread lightly for “stars” like Simmons that come with so many question marks.
They need to stick to a firm offer and if that can’t get it done, walk away and protect the franchise. But I am fine with taking a swing on Simmons even if its not my preferred path. But I would understand it and support it and be excited to see what happens. But only if the cost is reasonable (which is a very debatable and subjective thing at the moment).
Again - for me it would need to be something like Murray - Thad - Jakob - CHI 1st and maybe another lottery protected 1st. But that is like my max offer I can understand.
You can be quasi far apart in rankings but in reality the gap is very close. And yes, I do place a little more emphasis on LEBRON right now personally; I think it’s a nice stat.
But of course I am not saying DJ>Simmons. I am simply saying DJ has been steadily closing the gap, he’s about to get his first role as a leading guy (he has gotten minutes and stuff but there is no real high usage guy in front of him now) and that there is real risk with Ben.
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