Yes to all. The MLE is pretty flexible.
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q25
What are possible nuances of the MLE? I assume it can be split between two players, and that it doesn't have to be for the full 4 years. Can it be structured to include team and player options in say years 3 and 4? Can the last year be partially guaranteed?
Yes to all. The MLE is pretty flexible.
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q25
^Except to the options part. It can only include an option in year four, and it can be either a team or a player option. Not both.
Diaw was signed with the MLE, and he had a player option on his second year (this year).
That was the final year of his deal. I was speaking the in context of CGD's questions, which asked about options in the third and fourth years of a four-year deal.
I think Spurs might not want to sign contract which is more than two years unless a player is in long term plan, so Spurs could create a lot of cap space when Duncan and Ginobili retire.
I want to know what you think about these recent moves of Spurs, Bruno.
I agree, which is why I don't like the Splitter signing. I don't see him in the long-term plans for the team.
It really depends on with what exception Belinelli has been signed.
If he will be signed with a part of the MLE, there might have a willingness for Spurs to have as little money as possible committed for the 2015-2016 season.
If he will be signed with the room exception, there is nothing to say since that exception max length is 2 years. What would be telling will be what Spurs will do with their cap space.
room exception or MLE : does the spurs have allready decided at the moment ?
Is it possible that the spurs have an agreement with belinelli for 5,5-5,6M, and that they will decide later with what exception they will pay him, in fonction of what they can do with other free agent ?
If they can sign kirilenko or millsap with a sign a nd trade, they give him the room exception.
If they can't, they give him a part of the MLE, and use the rest for a backup 3 like caspi.
The first day to sign Belinelli is July 10th. Spurs have no need or interest to decide before that.
It's even possible that Spurs and Belinelli have agreed at 2 different contracts: one at $5.6M paid with a part of the MLE and one at $5.42M paid with the room exception. To offset that difference, the $5.42M could feature a salary payment schedule more favorable, a trade bonus or even a player option on the second year.
Now, if Spurs have made the effort to fit Belinelli under the room exception, it's obvious that their first option would be to amnesty Bonner and use that cap space one way or another.
lol ak47 and casspi on their sights. they are not eyeing any americans at all?
Spurs might as well decrease some contracts if possible- Diaw + Bonner 10m combined expiring. Stack up and improve the second and third unit. Patty Mills as much as I love that dude, Cojo, De Colo, Baynes etc might be decent end of the bench but if you can further improve that would be cool.
Bruno Is it possible to make a sign&trade for Kirilenko as you mentionned somewhere else with a salary starting around $7m, sign Belinelli with the room exception and then sign another player with the MLE ?
You can't do that. The MLE can't be used at the same time than cap space or the room exception.
Spurs have basically 2 options:
- Cap space and room exception.
- MLE.
In the cap space + room exception case, Belinelli will eat all the room exception and Spurs will have about $6M in cap space to add another player. Bonner will be amnestied in that scenario. Spurs could open a little more cap space by, for example, salary dumping De Colo.
In the MLE case, Belinelli will take half of the MLE. Spurs will have the other half ($2.5M)to go after a player . Bonner will be kept.
If the spurs sign Neal for 4M/yrs, and trade him with another team for less salary (let's say Gerald Green ($3,5M/yrs) + 2nd round pick for exemple), is it considering using cap space, or is it a "normal" trade, and the MLE is still available ?
If Spurs do a trade or a S&T where they get 150%+$100K of what they have send, it would be a "normal" trade and Spurs would still have their MLE. For example, if Bonner guaranteed deadline has been pushed, he could be used in a trade or in a S&T.
The example you have given, doesn't respect that rule. Neal would be what was called in the previous CBA, BYC. His outgoing value in that trade would be half of his new salary. $3.5M doesn't fit into 150%+$100k of $2M. The trade would only work as a cap space trade with Spurs having to amnesty Bonner first.
In the case of trying to acquire AK47, here is my best estimate of where we stand in salary before trying to acquire him:
It is my understanding that we can go over the salary cap if we do the transaction as a trade with Minnesota. So if Minnesota agrees to sign and trade him to us, we could add him. We wouldn't have to send a player back, just generate a TPE for Minny (and maybe a protected 2nd rounder or so). If we do so, then we are hard capped at being no more that $4M over the Tax, which I do not think would be a problem. From my reading of the rules on the use of Exceptions, we could still use either the Non-Taxpaying MLE to sign Belinelli, so long as we do not go $4M into the Tax.
So if we end up not getting AK47 and we are under the cap, we must use the Room Exception on Belinelli. If we get Minnesota to sign and trade him to us, we would use the Non-Taxpaying MLE to sign Belinelli, which leaves room for another signing btw, so long as we stay within the Tax Apron ($4M).
Am I off somewhere on this?
CBA FAQ
Player 2013-14 Notes Manu Ginobili* $7,000,000 * = not confirmed Tony Parker $12,500,000 Marco Belinelli* $2,652,000 * = assumes Room Exception (Non- Taxpaying MLE could pay more) Tim Duncan $10,361,446 Boris Diaw $4,702,500 Tiago Splitter* $9,000,000 * = not confirmed Matt Bonner $3,945,000 Danny Green $3,762,500 Kawhi Leonard $1,887,840 Nando De Colo $1,463,000 Patrick Mills $1,133,950 Cory Joseph $1,120,920 Aron Baynes $788,872 Total salaries: $60,318,028 Salary Cap* $58,044,000 * = est from '12-'13 season Luxury Tax* $70,307,000 * = est from '12-'13 season Luxury Tax Apron, Hard Cap* $74,307,000 * = if Room Exception used or Received a Player in Sign and Trade
Last edited by bluebellmaniac; 07-05-2013 at 09:51 AM.
So refreshing my previous reading of the CBA brings the following to my understanding of the most likely scenarios in signing our new contracts.
For reference:
The Room Exception is for Teams that are under the Salary Cap. The Room Exception allows teams to sign additional contracts worth up to $2.652 million for '13-'14, even if it means exceeding the Salary Cap. Using the Room Exception eliminates being able to use the Non-Taxpaying Mid-Level Exception.
The Non-Taxpaying Mid-Level Exception is for Teams over the Salary Cap but under the Luxury Tax Apron, which is the Luxury Tax + $4M. This exception allows teams to sign additional contracts worth up to $5.15 million for '13-'14.
I seriously doubt we would go into the Tax, much less go over by more than $4M, so I won't discuss the Taxpaying Mid-Level Exception.
So this is what I think the order of our signings will be as of the 10th, if we get Minny to sign and trade us AK47:
AK47: Signed and traded to us by Minny. Salary = ???? (Free Agent Cap Holds are NOT taken into account when dealing with a S&T)
Manu: Signed for $7M in '13-'14
Splitter: Signed for $9M in '13-'14 (by this point we are over the Salary Cap, but under the Luxury Tax)
Belinelli: Signed using the NT MLE ... $2.8M ???
We will have the remaining of the MLE to sign any additional FA, so long as we don't go $4M over the Luxury Tax.
Then of course we have the Vet minimums we can offer.
That said, where are the mistakes?
Assuming that we're talking about the same hypothetical S&T, then you're right up the Beli signing. The most common hypothetical has the Spurs clearing cap space (Bonner amnesty and perhaps a small salary dump for Nando and/or Mills). Then the S&T with Minny would send a pick or a stashed Euro away for AK47. Bottom line is that Minny would take no salary in return and would trade AK47 into San Antonio's cap space (creating a good sized TE). Having used cap space to execute the trade, the Spurs would then sign Beli with the room exception. They would not have the MLE as a result of using cap space in the S&T. After the S&T and using the room exception, the Spurs would only have the vet min for any further FA signings.
I get confused as to why we would amnesty Bonner or salary dump NDC / Mills. So long as we are under the Tax apron we can go over the salary cap on a trade. If we can get Minny to trade us AK47 for enough to keep us over the Salary Cap, we are in a better position b/c we can then use the NT MLE.
Here is my logic for the order:
1. AK47: Minny S&T him to us for a protected 2nd rounder. FA cap holds are not taken into account for S&T (<-This is important). So for a S&T, we look like we are under the cap. No need to amnesty Bonner or shed salary.
2. Splitter: Sign to $9M via Bird Rights due to being over the Luxury Tax with Manu's $19M cap hold
3. Manu: Sign to $7M deal for next year. This drops his cap hold from $19M down to $7M and we are now under the Tax but over the salary cap. We now have the NT MLE available
4. Belinelli: Signed via the NT MLE. Money from the NT MLE is available for another FA.
I don't see us needing to amnesty Bonner to get this done or to shed NDC/Mills salary either.
Am I getting something wrong about step 1, being able to receive AK47 in a S&T to put us over the salary cap? Pretty sure that is what the CBA FAQ stated.
2 problems:
1. In a normal trade the salaries have to meet the rules of the CBA. So, the Spurs could take back 150% + 100K of what they send out. They can't just send out a second round pick unless they sufficient cap room to fit the incoming salary. (I don't know where you're getting the bit about cap holds not counting, but I'm sure that's incorrect)
2. On Minny's side, they have an agreement to sign Kevin Martin to a 4yr/28M deal. That means signing him with cap space, which means they can't take salary back, at least not much, in a S&T involving AK47.
Yes, you are. CBA FAQ states (Q80): "Teams under the salary cap may make trades as they please, as long as they don't finish more than $100,000 above the salary cap following any trade. But if a team finishes more than $100,000 over the cap, whether they started out above or below the cap, then an exception is required."
The second mistake you are making is not taking into account cap holds. As long as Ginobili and Splitter are not either resigned or renounced, they count for $19,1M and $7,5M against the cap, respectively. This is to prevent teams from signing other teams' free agents through cap space and then using the Larry Bird exception to re-sign their own ones as well.
1.Marc Gasol.
2.Kevin Love.
3.LaMarcus Aldridge.
Yes, Jim Boylen.
I think it easy to trade a quality big like Splitter if Spurs wanted to create cap space in the 2015 summer.
If Spurs went after a PF in the 2015 summer, I would like Spurs to keep Splitter. He is a very good role player.
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