To me, Sengun is an automatic take if he's there are 11/12... He's got more than a little Manu in him on D as well as passing - look at some of those flops to draw O fouls...
And people said he couldn't pass.
My comps for Sengun are sort of ridiculous, but: 1/3 Gasol, 1/3 Ed Nealy, and 1/3 Adrian Dantley.
To me, Sengun is an automatic take if he's there are 11/12... He's got more than a little Manu in him on D as well as passing - look at some of those flops to draw O fouls...
Who is this year's Obi Toppin?
Someone who posted gaudy stats, and exhibited elite athleticism in college but looks like a bust now? Quite a few people here thought he was a sure thing to be a star in the NBA, some even wanted to trade up for him.
What lesson can we learn from Obi and apply to this year's draft?
Sometimes, I find the draft more entertaining than the actual NBA season. I say that even if the Spurs were doing well. There's just something about the process of learning about each prospect, and watching them blossom in the league that appeals to me. Anyone else feel the same way about finding enjoyment in the draft like I do?
Giddey/Sengun are two of my favorite prospects, wouldnt mind if the spurs tried to grab another pick and get Usman Garuba too lol spurs are in a great spot to get a good player! I like all of the top 15 prospects right now
Same Bro! The draft + Summer league are my favorite parts of the NBA calendar
you saw us in this thread talking about the draft since a lot of weeks lol so we like the process
for me, this is one of the best thing in basketball : watching some prospects, evaluate them ... i really enjoy it.
i don't see a good comp for toppin in this draft , i was not a big fan of him last year : playing in a weak division, already 22 yrs old.
I think there will be a good number of Obi Toppins in this year's draft.
This video has good examples of what makes Sengun interesting and also examples of why I'm still iffy about him.
The good: He's coordinated, good athlete on the move, good feel for the game, good flexibility. It's easy to see why he's highly productive. Live I've said previously, I could understand picking him just based on the assumption that he's so productive at such an early age that he's bound to figure it out in the NBA.
The bad: Feet would be considered slow in the NBA. As power forwards get smaller and quicker, I just can't imagine that Sengun is anything but a center, especially when projecting down the road. Also worrisome is that he doesn't have much bounce when stationary and also doesn't have much length. That's a tough combo to overcome, especially for a big who hasn't proven to be a perimeter shooter. At the 0:32 mark and the 3:09 mark, that's Sengun getting stonewalled by 6-foot-7, 225-pound Jeremy Simmons. That's ... not good for a player whose main attribute right now is being an interior scorer.
He's a tough, tough call, IMO. What adds to his intrigue is he was fat just a few months ago so his athleticism is still a work in progress and there's likely some untapped potential in that regard. I don't think he'll rise too high in my Big Board because I don't believe in the value of undersized centers without provable three-point range and who project to be subpar defenders. That archetype just doesn't hold enough value for me to get behind. Sengun's path to being a truly valuable player is narrow -- more narrow than you want when drafting in the lottery. But, again, there are enough glimpses that I wouldn't be mad if the Spurs pick him with the hope that he's still an improving, moldable project who will learn to adapt.
About the bad, i agree he is a center , not undersized in todays nba ( could really be a 6'10 ).
When you talk about getting stonewalled by jeremy simmons , imo there is two things to notice : the first is unlike a lot of prospects he is playing against old mens who are physical, secondly that's not a concern because he did not rely on his body to score, he did not need to bulk players down low but he scores due to his footwork, IQ and touch around the rim. Imo that will translate in the NBA.
Another "Anti-Spur" who probably needs to be considered is Cam Thomas. Didn't like him at first because he plays zero defense, doesn't pass unless he has to and is a B- athlete at best. But he can score. He's a natural-born bulk scorer -- and that's something the Spurs could use, especially if they're not re-signing DeRozan. Thomas averaging 20 points per game isn't difficult to imagine at all. The question with him will never be scoring, it'll be whether he ever becomes a willing passer or can be convinced to play defense.
To put his scoring in perspective, he's the all-time leading scorer at Oak Hill -- the basketball factory that produced Keldon Johnson and before him a long list of highly productive scorers including Carmelo Anthony, Jerry Stackhouse, Stephen Jackson, Ron Mercer, Brandon Jennings, etc, etc. Then he went to LSU and averaged 23 points as a freshman. LSU got to the second round of the tournament, so his production wasn't completely empty -- even though his passing and defense never improved.
Thomas wouldn't normally be someone I'd think the Spurs should consider ... but this draft is weird and the late lottery will very likely require a rather large gamble to be taken. Gambling on a top tier scorer makes an extra amount of sense for these Spurs.
Cam Thomas. That would be an interesting test of Brian Wright’s goal, at least last year, of focusing on defense. I could still see them going for Garuba for some reason. But honestly, whoever they pick is going to have some amount of question marks. A disappointing pick would be Kispert so I’m preparing for that as well.
About Sengun athletism and how he is slow footed, i remember having the same impression of Isaiah Stewart last year.
Stewart is stronger( longer wingspan also at 7'4 vs 7'1, nearly the same height) than Alperen but he is not an elite athlet and he was pretty good during his first year in the league.
If Alperen could gain some mass without losing speed, i have no doubt on his ability to be hard to handle inside.
It will be interesting to see how his development is approached by whoever gets him. It's possible teams try to get him to lose weight to gain speed at the expense of power and mass because he's already pretty strong. He's not going to get force fed the ball down low, so he'll have to start out with being some type of role player that has to get by on his feel for the game and making good quick decisions, at least I would think.
I think everyone is going to have to realize that even if we pick at 11, there is no obvious foundational piece available or even best player available—that seems really subjective for this draft. Unfortunately, I think we're looking at team need (as TiVMP hinted at with scoring and Cam Thomas), or possibly even passing with Giddey, or shooting with Kispert, et cetera...unless Brian Wright has a vision for what he is trying to build, and then he'll follow that accordingly.
You may be right it could be interesting for him to slim down or lose some body fat. He will be quicker if he goes that way.
And yes not easy to see who will/could be the best pick at 11/12. Depends on what Spurs will value.
I do. Although in recent years I scout less and less, I used to watch more video in the past. I just don’t have as much time and other interests call my attention. I still really like to learn about them and read scouting impressions. If someone is hyped or recommended I’ll watch highlights. I like guys who can pass the ball well and have high IQ, but I was also a fan of Murray for his athleticism and fearlessness... I like all kinds .. that’s probably my problem as a scout, I don’t necessarily discriminate, so I don’t get too worried about it anymore... I will say this regardless of position the Spurs need a deadeye shooter, preferably one who can shoot off movement... anyone like that here?
I also enjoy watching summer league btw and did even when the Spurs were competing for les. I like to watch players evolve, develop and grow. Looking forward to see our own Samanic in SL, hopefully his hand is ready.
Odd definition of stonewall you got there. He made both buckets (admittedly the second off getting his own rebound). At 0:32, Simmons's feet are at the edge of the lane. At 0:35-36, Sengun is shooting and Simmons's feet are in the circle. 3:09 is less clearcut. Simmons starts in the circle, and Sengun bumps him back about a foot as he goes up on the initial shot. That knock back lets Sengun get his own board, and then he pulls a spin move ...
What the Spurs need is glaring. #30 in the league in 3ptrs made.
Field goals made, better than average, #11.
Free throws made, better than average, #9.
Total rebounds, a little below average, #18.
Assists, average, #16.
Avoiding turnovers, excellent, #2.
Steals, below average; blocks, above average; avoiding personal fouls, well above average, etc.
But 3pt shots made, dead last. The team needs long range shooters - who are not hopeless on defense.
Great breakdown. 3 pt shots made is the first stat I look in games I didn’t watch and the lost, attempted is second. There’s games they barely made 3-4 threes. Where did you pull your breakdown from?
That's the devil's dilemma -- the guys with the best three-point shooting are also generally the ones with lesser upsides.
So to address the team's most immediate need through the draft may ignore the team's bigger-picture need -- more upside talent.
No great answer to this. (However, the Spurs are pretty good at teaching shooting, other desirable attributes seem less teachable.)
Thank you.
There are some 1-dimensional shooters available in the second round; that would be my preference over drafting Kispert with their first pick, basically.
I would agree. Kispert pretty much disappeared against Baylor's NBA-like athletes.
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