Official San Antonio Spurs 2021 NBA Draft Discussion Thread

[mo7888]

I think the criticism of Springer is over blown a bit... I think he's a very solid prospect and I'm not worried one bit about his ability to become a good outside shooter. I do think #12 is too high though... if we pick up another pick in the 18-25 range he'd be one to look at.. just not at #12

[R. DeMurre]

You seem convinced Springer has issues. Are you taking this as a slight against your preference of Duarte? I’m trying to follow your insistence here.

You don’t think one of the youngest players in the draft has the ability to make adjustments to his game in general? UT fans were upset that Barnes was pushing his preferred style of mid range play onto the team.

He’s a guard. How are you considering him a wing now?

A guard who scores well at the rim has nothing to offer the team? 3s and layups are the modern game. I don’t see how scoring well at the rim is not useful, particularly on an offensively challenged team.

I think we’ll have to disagree and move on to other discussions.

I have confidence that by the time Springer is Chris Duarte's age-- in 2026-- he'll have it all figured out. () (just teasing, Dejounte!)

[KobesAchilles]

So you go from complaining about current Spurs players who hesitate to take 3s to yet another guy in the draft who hesitates with shooting 3s lmao

In my scenario we would be getting rid of Lonnie this year. What can I say though? I’ve always been a fan of high motor and athleticism. I was high on Lonnie until he showed how passive he is and scared of contact he is. Dude also has no finishing ability around the rim.

My first choice is a shooter like Duarte bc we need a freaking shooter. But Springer is so young and full of potential that I’m like hmmm…

[Dejounte]

In my scenario we would be getting rid of Lonnie this year. What can I say though? I’ve always been a fan of high motor and athleticism. I was high on Lonnie until he showed how passive he is and scared of contact he is. Dude also has no finishing ability around the rim.

My first choice is a shooter like Duarte bc we need a freaking shooter. But Springer is so young and full of potential that I’m like hmmm…

If Springer was truly athletic, I'd bump him up a tier.

He had FOUR dunks during the whole season.

For comparison:

Bouknight - 12 dunks
Duarte - 14 dunks
Keon - 15 dunks
Suggs - 9 dunks
Kispert - 9 dunks

For someone supposedly athletic and jumps high, he sure doesn't apply it in-game.

I get it-- Lonnie is frustrating, and Springer is likely tougher... the whole package just isn't enough to be amazed.

[The Truth #6]

In literally the last Springer video a page ago, Phantom posted a video on Springer with the commentator calling him a small wing. Not my own words.

The team's issue was SPACING. How is this all of a sudden forgotten? Where do you think Poeltl will position himself when Springer is trying to make a play inside? On the perimeter? Players are already collapsing with our lack of 3 point shooters.

Being young means absolutely nothing. Players who don't change are more common than ones who do. There is way too much emphasis on the youth of a player.

Springer does have issues, and it's asinine to pretend he doesn't.

You’re taking this to extremes it feels like to win an argument but I think it’s actually weakening your point. Now players shouldn’t drive to the rim because of how it will affect Yak? Am I interpreting you correctly? Maybe the problem in this scenario isn’t the player about to score at the rim but, you know, Yak?

Springer, Moody, Wagner or Duarte. I will be happy with any of those players unless someone drops. At 12 everyone has some flaw or issue.

[Dejounte]

You’re taking this to extremes it feels like to win an argument but I think it’s actually weakening your point. Now players shouldn’t drive to the rim because of how it will affect Yak? Am I interpreting you correctly? Maybe the problem in this scenario isn’t the player about to score at the rim but, you know, Yak?

Springer, Moody, Wagner or Duarte. I will be happy with any of those players unless someone drops. At 12 everyone has some flaw or issue.

I didn't say players shouldn't drive to the rim. That's creating a strawman out of nothing. Are you going to dismiss what I said about spacing? And that we have a lack of high volume 3 point shooters?

I don't know what's so "extreme" about bringing up the team's #1 issue from last season. If that's extreme to you, then I don't know what to tell you.

[PhantomDashCam]

Sincere question: what exactly has Springer accomplished that “most prospects would only dream of doing”? These sound like hyperbolic statements…

I don’t see anything on here that likely most other prospects also have, but I’ll see if I can pull up those achievements later.

Here’s one thing those players you listed don’t have: A HS National Championship.
http://geicohoops.com/2019-winner-and-results/



FWIW, The game before that they upset the heavily favoured Monteverde squad featuring Cade and Moody.



I’m a fan of hyperbole where I feel it’s warranted.

[Dejounte]

Here’s one thing those players you listed don’t have: A HS National Championship.
http://geicohoops.com/2019-winner-and-results/



FWIW, The game before that they upset the heavily favoured Monteverde squad featuring Cade and Moody.



I’m a fan of hyperbole where I feel it’s warranted.

There's so much context missing here that it's purposely misleading.

Jeremiah Earl Robinson was the MVP for the final game. Josh Green was also a big contributor. By your post, you've basically implied that Jaden led the team. Jaden was not a one-man show for any of these games. A single 26 point game doesn't change the overall talent his team had.

[alfahdlan]

If Springer was truly athletic, I'd bump him up a tier.

He had FOUR dunks during the whole season.

For comparison:

Bouknight - 12 dunks
Duarte - 14 dunks
Keon - 15 dunks
Suggs - 9 dunks
Kispert - 9 dunks

For someone supposedly athletic and jumps high, he sure doesn't apply it in-game.

I get it-- Lonnie is frustrating, and Springer is likely tougher... the whole package just isn't enough to be amazed.

if I may, Dejounte:

Bouknight - 12 in 15 games
Duarte - 14 in 26
Keon - 15 in 27
Suggs - 9 in 30
Kispert - 9 in 32
Springer - 4 in 25

Games played sourced from Tankathon.

[Dejounte]

if I may, Dejounte:

Bouknight - 12 in 15 games
Duarte - 14 in 26
Keon - 15 in 27
Suggs - 9 in 30
Kispert - 9 in 32
Springer - 4 in 25

Games played sourced from Tankathon.

Bouknight's in-game athleticism (what really matters) is insane.

[Ignazzz]

Bouknight's in-game athleticism (what really matters) is insane.

do You buy him in top 5 ( last mocks)?

[Mr. Body]

Question for those more in the know.

Does a guy like Filip Petrusev from Gonzaga/Europe make sense in the 2nd round? 6'-11" and 225, he looks like a stretch 4. 46% from 3 on about 3 attempts per game (not a very big sample size I know), looks like he has decent footwork around the basket, some nice spin moves in the post and is active on the boards. A bit older at 21, but seems like a stretch 4 option in the 2nd, a type of player the Spurs currently lack.

I may be all wet and was curious on others thoughts.

This pick would only be made if the Spurs go wing in the first obviously. Moody is my current favorite along with Duarte.

Last question, JT Thor. Im interested in him, but literally have no idea where he is gonna land in the draft. Anyone else like him and any idea where he goes? Seems like a guy that is gaining momentum as the draft gets closer.

Thanks in advance.

Yes, I think the Spurs look at a guy like Petrusev in the 2nd especially if they draft a wing/swingman, which I think they will. Petrusev, a guy with range and international/college experience, is exactly the type to look for.

JT Thor is super young, which is very attractive to many teams. He is a good shotblocker and suggests he could be a good shooter. Has iffy hands and is very weak, not a good rebounder, but teams will like the 3-and-rim protection thing.

I feel like this year teams will take a look at the Brook Lopez thing, also the Ayton thing, but it seems like a weak year for bigs -- most of them are really raw, which is understandable.

[KobesAchilles]

If Springer was truly athletic, I'd bump him up a tier.

He had FOUR dunks during the whole season.

For comparison:

Bouknight - 12 dunks
Duarte - 14 dunks
Keon - 15 dunks
Suggs - 9 dunks
Kispert - 9 dunks

For someone supposedly athletic and jumps high, he sure doesn't apply it in-game.

I get it-- Lonnie is frustrating, and Springer is likely tougher... the whole package just isn't enough to be amazed.

In my short 25 minute YouTube video of him he is very good at sliding his feet and staying with his man. This is a form of being athletic. He doesn’t need to dunk everything. I don’t care that much if my guard lays the ball up instead of dunking it. When he jumps he’s at the rim every time he shoots a lay up. His hops are fine. He finishes into the teeth of defenders and takes contact well. And at the very least he doesn’t shy away from it. IMO he looks like what KJ is but in guard version offensively where he bodies people in the lane and goes up strong. He looks like a good defender, slides feet well (better than KJ), has a knack for getting the ball or atleast poking it loose, and had some nice blocks.

Downside is that we would have to teach him basketball. He ain’t scared to shoot which I love. He has air ball after air ball in his weakness video which I love. That’s a shooter mentality. It’s kinda like how Giannis will airball a free throw but still go up strong and not give a if you foul him while Ben Simmons will wilt away and not dunk the ball bc he’s scared to shoot. You’re going to miss shots and some of them are going to be ugly but you can’t be afraid to shoot. I think Duncan had a stat where he was like the most blocked person ever (?).

With Duarte I get shooting. He doesn’t look nearly the defender but I’m not that interested in him being one tbh. As long as he learns positions and rotations that’s good enough for me. There aren’t that many good SG in the league anyways and we have DJ and White to guard the other teams PGs. He covers a lot of weaknesses that the team has. For instance, we are looking at Mark from CHI but that dude has horrible perimeter defense and that’s a bigger deal for big men than it is guards, and we would be signing the equivalent of a big Bryn Forbes just for spacing. I rather draft Duarte, hope to we can teach Luka how to shoot, and spend our cap space somewhere else.

[Mr. Body]

do You buy him in top 5 ( last mocks)?

It's not too surprising. As I've said elsewhere, the top five or six picks aren't gimmes by any means. Not even Cunningham. I see a big chance of a Wiggins-Parker draft writ large. I especially don't believe in the two G-League players. There's a lot of holles in these guys' games.

If people think Bouknight is in the Ja Morant or Trae Young mold (without the shooting), then yeah. He's a player who can get anywhere on the court and get any shot he wants. We're seeing that as gold-plated platinum in today's NBA.

[The Truth #6]

I didn't say players shouldn't drive to the rim. That's creating a strawman out of nothing. Are you going to dismiss what I said about spacing? And that we have a lack of high volume 3 point shooters?

I don't know what's so "extreme" about bringing up the team's #1 issue from last season. If that's extreme to you, then I don't know what to tell you.

Yes, SPACING is important. We need more outside shooters. Totally agree. But I responded to your point about Yak that you initially brought up because I think Yak is part of the SPACING problem, much more than Springer would be. I’m actually leaning towards Dieng over Yak. I think what is perplexing is that you think a 43% 3 point shooter is a problem that can’t be solved.

[Dejounte]

In my short 25 minute YouTube video of him he is very good at sliding his feet and staying with his man. This is a form of being athletic. He doesn’t need to dunk everything. I don’t care that much if my guard lays the ball up instead of dunking it. When he jumps he’s at the rim every time he shoots a lay up. His hops are fine. He finishes into the teeth of defenders and takes contact well. And at the very least he doesn’t shy away from it. IMO he looks like what KJ is but in guard version offensively where he bodies people in the lane and goes up strong. He looks like a good defender, slides feet well (better than KJ), has a knack for getting the ball or atleast poking it loose, and had some nice blocks.

Downside is that we would have to teach him basketball. He ain’t scared to shoot which I love. He has air ball after air ball in his weakness video which I love. That’s a shooter mentality. It’s kinda like how Giannis will airball a free throw but still go up strong and not give a if you foul him while Ben Simmons will wilt away and not dunk the ball bc he’s scared to shoot. You’re going to miss shots and some of them are going to be ugly but you can’t be afraid to shoot. I think Duncan had a stat where he was like the most blocked person ever (?).

With Duarte I get shooting. He doesn’t look nearly the defender but I’m not that interested in him being one tbh. As long as he learns positions and rotations that’s good enough for me. There aren’t that many good SG in the league anyways and we have DJ and White to guard the other teams PGs. He covers a lot of weaknesses that the team has. For instance, we are looking at Mark from CHI but that dude has horrible perimeter defense and that’s a bigger deal for big men than it is guards, and we would be signing the equivalent of a big Bryn Forbes just for spacing. I rather draft Duarte, hope to we can teach Luka how to shoot, and spend our cap space somewhere else.

Son, I am so proud of you. That first paragraph is what I would have written if I was responding to a guy who said something about dunks being the sole indicator of athleticism. In fact, I did write that about past prospects before, i.e. Obi Toppin probably. Hyperbolic statements are not needed. You didn’t focus on a single stat. You watched him play and didn’t care about his age and you’re telling it like it is. This shows you have potential to be one of the top scouts on this board. This is what I love to hear! When people are challenged, come up with answers like this. You really paid attention to detail and I respect that. I’ve got a tear in my eye…

RE: your second paragraph
Let me just tell you that Lonnie wasn’t afraid of shooting in college either. Regardless of if Pop is coach or not for the next few years, I believe the next coach will have SOME form of toughness on young players, especially if it comes internal. Say Pop is still the coach, you really think Springer is going to stay on the court if he has air ball after air ball? If you believe pro-Lonnie folks here (I personally dont), they say that Pop wrecked Lonnie’s confidence. Since Springer isnt accustomed to being a high volume shooter, he doesn’t have the “natural shooter’s confidence” yet. We could for sure see him turn into a Lonnie with Pop’s tough coaching (if you believe that has an effect).

All in all, with the points you made I still struggle to see Springer coming in and giving the Spurs more than a marginal improvement. Long term, he’ll probably take minutes from Vassell whereas if it was another prospect who has natural tendencies to shoot from outside, I think there would be more flexibility. Springer doesn’t really give any flexibility with the rotations. I know everyone wants to burn the whole roster to the ground, but I’m talking reality here. The next guy has to fit with at least A FEW players since we all know the Spurs have a few who they believe are long term main stays.

[Dejounte]

Yes, SPACING is important. We need more outside shooters. Totally agree. But I responded to your point about Yak that you initially brought up because I think Yak is part of the SPACING problem, much more than Springer would be. I’m actually leaning towards Dieng over Yak. I think what is perplexing is that you think a 43% 3 point shooter is a problem that can’t be solved.

I never said his 43% was the problem. I’ve pointed out consistently that it’s his shot profile that is the problem. I think pointing out a single stat without context is a problem. He shot that percentage on low volume. There is no guarantee that he will maintain that type of percentage on higher volume. That is called a risk. Springer favors close range and mid range baskets over 3-point shooting. That much is a fact. Getting Springer to feel comfortable shooting 3s at a higher rate is not as simple as many point it out be. We have seen it over and over with multiple players. That in itself is a 3-year project and there’s no guarantee there will be success. He could turn out to be a player who just loves to attack the basket more often than he shoots outside for his entire career…that is an actual possibility. There are guards in the NBA like that.

[look_at_g_shred]

Spurs worked out Tre Mann. Projected to go anywhere from 14-late

[offset formation]

Give me Sengun. He's a big that can shoot lights out. Isn’t that what we've all been clamoring for the last several years? He's a big, small ball dream player. He's a better shooting Batum. Who wouldn't take that today, now, as well speak?

I got Vassell correct last year so hopefully we can land this big guy this year too.

[look_at_g_shred]

Give me Sengun. He's a big that can shoot lights out. Isn’t that what we've all been clamoring for the last several years? He's a big, small ball dream player. He's a better shooting Batum. Who wouldn't take that today, now, as well speak?

I got Vassell correct last year so hopefully we can land this big guy this year too.

Don't forget the Jokic lite passing/playmaking. I think he's gone before our pick unfortunately.

[Dejounte]

Spurs worked out Tre Mann. Projected to go anywhere from 14-late

Not a huge fan because of the concerns on defense, but this is a lot more believable than Springer.

[offset formation]

Don't forget the Jokic lite passing/playmaking. I think he's gone before our pick unfortunately.

I just looked at mock draft boards after I posted this. I looked at like 5 or 6. The highest I saw on any of those that he went was 12 to us on the ringer. Aside from that it was 13th and 17th, etc. In fact, one didn't have him going in the first round at all.

So I think he'll be there although one mock did have him as the sleeper of the draft. And so it's entirely possible ppl are downplaying the kid in hopes he'll be there. I could see a team like OKC knowing the Spurs like him try to trade up to snag him quite honestly at 11.

He's really the perfect fit for us...a foreigner. And by that I just mean it's likely we can develop him and he'll fit into the culture really well. And maybe stick around long term even if he develops into a star. We need folks like that again.

[look_at_g_shred]

I just looked at mock draft boards after I posted this. I looked at like 5 or 6. The highest I saw on any of those that he went was 12 to us on the ringer. Aside from that it was 13th and 17th, etc. In fact, one didn't have him going in the first round at all.

So I think he'll be there although one mock did have him as the sleeper of the draft. And so it's entirely possible ppl are downplaying the kid in hopes he'll be there. I could see a team like OKC knowing the Spurs like him try to trade up to snag him quite honestly at 11.

He's really the perfect fit for us...a foreigner. And by that I just mean it's likely we can develop him and he'll fit into the culture really well. And maybe stick around long term even if he develops into a star. We need folks like that again.

I can easily see sac/magic (8th pick)/hornets drafting him.

[rankingtear]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-prospect-buzz

Bleacher mock is up.

Kai Jones second top 10 mock both to SAC at 9.
Springer seems to replace Butler spot in the late teens.
Defensive centers Jackson and Garuba dropping to mid 20's. ESPN has them mid teens.
Sengun to OKC approaching consensus.
Trey Murphy III not far from our range.

after the top 6, 7-10 athletic upside guys , 11-17 big wings then 18-24 you got the potential engine guards then 25-30 the energy bigs and 6th man type guards.

[Mr. Body]

I'd be happy with Giddey. Interesting to take him before Wagner but I see the rationale (just playing with this scenario). Wagner overlaps with Samanac a lot. Giddey is a big swing, but a potentially transformative player. I don't mean a star, necessarily, but his size and passing could open things up considerably for a team where only White is a regular playmaker beyond the standard mechanical sets.