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  1. #201
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    i do, it's there, no statistically significant association, their own table says that. So if it doesn't affect suicide then it doesn't save their lives, if it doesn't save their lives it can wait.
    where does their table say that there is no statistically significant association?

    a figure is not statistically insignificant because it is less than 5 percent. statistical insignificance is if the p-value of a result is below a 5% confidence interval. if you've taken even an intro into statistics course you'd know this within your first two months of class

  2. #202
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    So they don't actually say that themselves?

    It's your interpretation?
    i do, it's there, no statistically significant association, you cannot assume it saves lives if you cannot assume it saves lives it can wait.

    The yellow are their words not my interpretation it's in their study, the blue is what any statistician would tell you based of their results, the purple is based off how medical studies work. I.E. we stopped giving hydroxycloroquine, when we established that there was no significance in treatment.

  3. #203
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    i do, it's there, no statistically significant association, you cannot assume it saves lives if you cannot assume it saves lives it can wait.

    The yellow are their words not my interpretation it's in their study, the blue is what any statistician would tell you based of their results, the purple is based off how medical studies work. I.E. we stopped giving hydroxycloroquine, when we established that there was no significance in treatment.
    now you're being intentionally dishonest for some reason. good thing you managed to quote a single sentence fragment without any surrounding context to make a point!

    In our primary analysis, although gender-affirming surgery was associated with lower odds of past-year suicidal ideation, there was no statistically significant association between gender-affirming surgeries and past-year suicide attempts. However, in a post hoc analysis respondents who underwent all desired gender-affirming surgeries had significantly lower odds of past-year suicide attempts.
    of course thats not even touching on the reduction in suicidal ideation, which i dont think can be brushed off with "lol they didnt even try to murk themselves". if your kid told you they were having suicidal thoughts without having actually attempted one, you'd still be pretty ing concerned

  4. #204
    Damns (Given): 0 Blake's Avatar
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    now you're being intentionally dishonest for some reason. good thing you managed to quote a single sentence fragment without any surrounding context to make a point!



    of course thats not even touching on the reduction in suicidal ideation, which i dont think can be brushed off with "lol they didnt even try to murk themselves". if your kid told you they were having suicidal thoughts without having actually attempted one, you'd still be pretty ing concerned
    Ouch

  5. #205
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    This thread is amazing. Liberals trying to cancel a reasonable liberal ( Will Hunting ) for being reasonable.

    It goes over about as well as me telling my conservative friends that Trump did a sh1t job handling COVID - or that I hope DeSantis ousts him in the primary
    No one's trying to cancel Will Hunting. I think what may be confusing you is that you've been trained to fall in line with your teammates even when they're doing something like nominating a trust fund billionaire with a reality TV show to the highest office in the land, then attempting to subvert democracy because he said to do so.

  6. #206
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    where does their table say that there is no statistically significant association?

    a figure is not statistically insignificant because it is less than 5 percent. statistical insignificance is if the p-value of a result is below a 5% confidence interval. if you've taken even an intro into statistics course you'd know this within your first two months of class
    I didn't say it was in their table I said it was in their study, i went through and read their paper, and no statistical significance is not based solely off a p-value being below .05, .05 is the common number, but that's only because Fisher used it. You can use any confidence level you want but most use .05. In this study's case they used .05 but because they used bonferonni correction which was .05/19 (i'm assuming it was 19 because they asked 19 questions their p-value went from .05 to .002. The p-value for attempted suicides was .009. So no p-value below .05 even in a .05 test does not guarantee significance. Also they acknowledge in their results that suicides had no statistically significant association. If you go through and read what i said, I said "combining the 5% difference and the studies authors own conclusions"

  7. #207
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    I didn't say it was in their table I said it was in their study, i went through and read their paper, and no statistical significance is not based solely off a p-value being below .05, .05 is the common number, but that's only because Fisher used it. You can use any confidence level you want but most use .05. In this study's case they used .05 but because they used bonferonni correction which was .05/19 (i'm assuming it was 19 because they asked 19 questions their p-value went from .05 to .002. The p-value for attempted suicides was .009. So no p-value below .05 even in a .05 test does not guarantee significance. Also they acknowledge in their results that suicides had no statistically significant association. If you go through and read what i said, I said "combining the 5% difference and the studies authors own conclusions"
    in almost every cir stance its set to 0.05, including this one. my point was that you dont just look at some number, see that its less than 5% and therefore call it insignificant. and initially you werent even mentioning statistical significance. you were saying the suicide attempt had an "almost negligible difference" when they were more than cut in half

  8. #208
    Believe. Dirks_Finale's Avatar
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    No one's trying to cancel Will Hunting. I think what may be confusing you is that you've been trained to fall in line with your teammates even when they're doing something like nominating a trust fund billionaire with a reality TV show to the highest office in the land, then attempting to subvert democracy because he said to do so.
    I was going to vote for the GOP nominee just like you were gonna vote for the Democrat's nominee.

    But it is interesting to see a Bill Maher type democrat dare to disagree with the mob, though

  9. #209
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    I was going to vote for the GOP nominee just like you were gonna vote for the Democrat's nominee.

    But it is interesting to see a Bill Maher type democrat dare to disagree with the mob, though
    "mob"

    So thirsty for drama.

  10. #210
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    I was going to vote for the GOP nominee just like you were gonna vote for the Democrat's nominee.

    But it is interesting to see a Bill Maher type democrat dare to disagree with the mob, though
    This is called discussion. Again, I see why it appears to be a foreign concept to you. Keep reading, maybe you will learn something.

  11. #211
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    now you're being intentionally dishonest for some reason. good thing you managed to quote a single sentence fragment without any surrounding context to make a point!



    of course thats not even touching on the reduction in suicidal ideation, which i dont think can be brushed off with "lol they didnt even try to murk themselves". if your kid told you they were having suicidal thoughts without having actually attempted one, you'd still be pretty ing concerned
    I'm not being intentionally dishonest, I said "it can wait" for a reason, their ad hoc analysis was them basically introducing a variable of "received all desired surgeries" and "received some desired surgeries" and even in the "some desired" variable it was once again not significant. So if these adult numbers do in fact apply to kids, they wouldn't be non suicidal until they've fully transitioned which probably wouldn't happen until they were adults anyway when they can get their surgery. So that variable doesn't apply to kids. I'll say it again that variable doesn't apply to kids
    Last edited by Trainwreck2100; 06-13-2022 at 08:11 PM.

  12. #212
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    And it's not your vote that's the problem as much as the unfailing fealty towards the person you voted for. It's okay to vote for someone and still be critical of them or other people who voted your way.

  13. #213
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    yes, decades. imagine we waited decades before we started giving people smallpox or polio vaccinations. or more recently, covid vaccines. its just poor practice and impractical. as of now theres no data to suggest it causes long term fertility issues, while the limited data we have now suggests that there arent any issues. hormone replacement therapy is quite different. but weighing that against the proven mental health benefits is something that every physician will and should do
    We accepted those risks even last year because of COVID and Smallpox, and polio, because the numbers were high enough to support it, this is something that affects a fraction of a fraction. And your "proven mental health benefits" were only proven for adults as well.

  14. #214
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    This thread is amazing. Liberals trying to cancel a reasonable liberal ( Will Hunting ) for being reasonable.

    It goes over about as well as me telling my conservative friends that Trump did a sh1t job handling COVID - or that I hope DeSantis ousts him in the primary
    They’re not trying to cancel me to be fair

    Plenty of libs on Twitter have tho, but they’re a different breed.

  15. #215
    point it at ed-209 Dick Jones's Avatar
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    LMAO always talking behind your alts ya ing pussy.
    Why do you whine so much about the alt is when you know exactly who it is?

  16. #216
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Also Dirks_Finale DeSantis wouldn’t challenge Trump in a primary but I’m looking forward to when he and Nikki Haley are in a primary together and he uses hilarious racial dogwhistles to pillow smother her campaign.

  17. #217
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    DeSantis in a primary debate and Nikki Haley - “I’m tired of watching NIMRATA HALEY try and CURRY FAVOR with the great voters of this state!”

  18. #218
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    We accepted those risks even last year because of COVID and Smallpox, and polio, because the numbers were high enough to support it, this is something that affects a fraction of a fraction.
    those people matter, too. within that fraction of a fraction of a people that are trans, they experience mental health issues ranging from depression to suicidality at alarming rates that absolutely justify intervention.
    And your "proven mental health benefits" were only proven for adults as well.
    if you want to fixate on the suicide attempts number which is just one of the criteria that they looked at. what about suicide ideation? what about severe psychological distress? these are important things, too

    the only reason i brought this up to begin with was will hunting's bogus claim that "its a fabricated myth that top/bottom surgeries decrease suicidal tendencies and in fact cause them to increase" or whatever. complete dogwater
    Last edited by spurraider21; 06-13-2022 at 08:36 PM.

  19. #219
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    DeSantis in a primary debate and Nikki Haley - “I’m tired of watching NIMRATA HALEY try and CURRY FAVOR with the great voters of this state!”
    "Nikki Haley is our version of Kamala Harris"

  20. #220
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    DeSantis in a primary debate and Nikki Haley - “I’m tired of watching NIMRATA HALEY try and CURRY FAVOR with the great voters of this state!”
    "Nikki Haley is our version of Kamala Harris"

  21. #221
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    DeSantis in a primary debate and Nikki Haley - “I’m tired of watching NIMRATA HALEY try and CURRY FAVOR with the great voters of this state!”
    "Nikki Haley is our version of Kamala Harris"

  22. #222
    Damns (Given): 0 Blake's Avatar
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    We accepted those risks even last year because of COVID and Smallpox, and polio, because the numbers were high enough to support it, this is something that affects a fraction of a fraction. And your "proven mental health benefits" were only proven for adults as well.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/11/w...-blockers.html

  23. #223
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    "Nikki Haley is our version of Kamala Harris"
    Her first name is Nimrata and there’s a 0% chance DeSantis wouldn’t use that when referring to her

    ”The last thing we need to do is THE STREET by picking GLOBALIST NIMRATA to lead the party in this election!”

  24. #224
    point it at ed-209 Dick Jones's Avatar
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    “Nimrata Haley will use her left hand to wipe away all the progress Trump made!”

  25. #225
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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