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  1. #51
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    How about the point that Biden is an actual Democrat who voted with them something like 85+ percent of the time?

    How’s that for clear?
    nobody is arguing that biden is literally a republican. AOC's is of the belief that the democratic party is (or should be) moving farther to the left, such that as it currently stands, biden would not be in it. you dont have to agree with her.

  2. #52
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    yes. virtually the same. more 08 clintonites stayed home and more 08 clintonites defected to the republican candidate



    That's pretty significant tbh.

  3. #53
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    I used to think this but just don’t see it anymore after 2016. The Republican primary was as nasty as primary debates get but in the end Republicans turned out their base better than the Democrats did. In a political climate as polarizing as were in nastiness and infighting seems to be what draws voter interest.
    Republicans suck it up and show up for the team more than Democrats. Could be that in rural America, voting is much less time consuming.

  4. #54
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    my man if you think the average American is in for constant culture wars and people dunking on each other over and over and basically constant chaos Wow. One is out of touch I guess. To normies someone who is willing to take care of the country and help politicians get along so they dont have to worry about it is appealing. The constantly online activist wing is not representative of the normal
    you’re resorting to quote changing? Keep Derping it up bro.

    Our current President got elected literally by giving his opponents 3rd grade level nicknames. You’re naive if you don’t think like “Little Marco” or “Low Energy Jeb” got traction with voters. For all my criticism of Hillary you couldn’t find a candidate who’d be as good as working across the aisle as she is, and her base couldn’t have had less enthusiasm for her on Election Day.

    People obviously don’t consciously want culture wars and polarizing politics, it’s a byproduct other things. Are you seriously arguing “Well there’s a poll that said Americans want compromise so we should nominate a candidate who says he likes compromise to?”

  5. #55
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    That's pretty significant tbh.
    i dont have the historical numbers to go back and see what the norms are tbh, and its harder to find good info the farther back you go. 2004's primary isn't a good indicator because kerry ended up tapping edwards who was #2 in the primaries, with dean being such a distant third that theres no significance. i dont know about how bill bradley primary voters did... hard to find that.

    but theres nothing to show that berniebros were particularly rebellious. i dont see anybody here complaining about clinton's 08 primary voters defecting at twice the rate berniebros did to go vote republican against black president

  6. #56
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    nobody is arguing that biden is literally a republican..
    You mean when AOC says Biden should be a Republican she’s not literally saying Biden is as far to the right as the current Republican Party is

  7. #57
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    i dont have the historical numbers to go back and see what the norms are tbh, and its harder to find good info the farther back you go. 2004's primary isn't a good indicator because kerry ended up tapping edwards who was #2 in the primaries, with dean being such a distant third that theres no significance. i dont know about how bill bradley primary voters did... hard to find that.

    but theres nothing to show that berniebros were particularly rebellious. i dont see anybody here complaining about clinton's 08 primary voters defecting at twice the rate berniebros did to go vote republican against black president
    I thought they were es tbh-- that's where all the birtherism started. Margins are closer. Every bit helps/hurts.

  8. #58
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    I thought they were es tbh-- that's where all the birtherism started. Margins are closer. Every bit helps/hurts.
    i dont disagree... but unless you can demonstrate that they were "out of line" in a more statistically significant way than is the norm, i dont see how you can go with the "this is how you get trump elected" shtick

    obama carried despite clinton voters because he ran a strong campaign. clinton coulnd't overcome less internal resistance and a substantially ter opponent than mccain (tho palin is easily more re ed than trump)

  9. #59
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    I thought they were es tbh-- that's where all the birtherism started. Margins are closer. Every bit helps/hurts.
    Margins weren’t close in 2008 or 2012, they didn’t wondrously become closer in 2016, they were closer because Clinton ran a ty campaign, which isn’t the Berniebros’ fault.

  10. #60
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) AaronY's Avatar
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    yeah and just about all of these pieces are supporting what biden says. not seeing how this is "his biggest criticism"
    Because what he is doing is smart despite progressive criticism. And all of those articles discuss the criticisms which you--like a dumbass--pretended never existed.

  11. #61
    Veteran SpursforSix's Avatar
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    Republicans suck it up and show up for the team more than Democrats. Could be that in rural America, voting is much less time consuming.
    I don’t think they can count on that again. I think there are plenty that voted for Trump that won’t repeat that in 2020.

  12. #62
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    Because what he is doing is smart despite progressive criticism. And all of those articles discuss the criticisms which you--like a dumbass--pretended never existed.
    im sure people on twitter offered that criticism, and i know you love looking for random hilarious comments on muh rose twitter

    im just asking how you came to the conclusion that it is his biggest or most common criticism, but all i've really gotten is "nuh uh" and spongebob.jpeg

  13. #63
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) AaronY's Avatar
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    im sure people on twitter offered that criticism, and i know you love looking for random hilarious comments on muh rose twitter

    im just asking how you came to the conclusion that it is his biggest or most common criticism, but all i've really gotten is "nuh uh" and spongebob.jpeg
    Every single article discussed it. He was asked about it in the debates. You are being insanely obtuse at this point by pretending it doesn't exist

  14. #64
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Every single article discussed it. He was asked about it in the debates. You are being insanely obtuse at this point by pretending it doesn't exist
    The articles discussed a bunch of criticism ostensibly being directed at Biden, you still haven’t posted examples of actual lefties lobbing said criticism. Like I said - strawman arguments.

  15. #65
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) AaronY's Avatar
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    Here is an article of all the presidential candidates discussing it

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/04/u...cans-2020.html

  16. #66
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) AaronY's Avatar
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    The articles discussed a bunch of criticism ostensibly being directed at Biden, you still haven’t posted examples of actual lefties lobbing said criticism. Like I said - strawman arguments.
    You criticized him for it in this very ing thread! Do I need to quote your posts now!

  17. #67
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    Dems should keep moving further left.
    This.

  18. #68
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    You criticized him for it in this very ing thread! Do I need to quote your posts now!
    if that was true you’d actually quote my post rather than say “DO YOU WANT ME TO DO IT?!”

  19. #69
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) AaronY's Avatar
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    I mean Jesus Christ guise


  20. #70
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    The current complaints are about how he is willing and wants to work with Republicans which is smart as....well you know...factually its what normal people want

    "More than eight in 10 voters believe “compromise and common ground should be the goal for political leaders” (87% agree, including 64% strongly agree)"

    http://politics.georgetown.edu/press...ease-oct-2019/


    so its good to pay lip service to even if it is ultimately not likely to happen. Same thing with the "I would appoint a Republican as VP" thing which is obviously just lip service as he's not going to do that.

    The other complaint is Buttigieg is a Republican as he "only" supports free college for those making less than $100k and "only" wants the public option
    Are ing re ed? What good can come out of Republicans. Republicans are way off the spectrum. Compromising is what the Clintons and Obama have been doing. There is no real left anymore. What happened to the days when the left represented unions, labor, workers, anti-war, etc?

    Go register as a Republican and gtfo here.

  21. #71
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    I mean Jesus Christ guise

    What exactly are we talking about here? Biden’s willingness to reach across the aisle (something I don’t think anyone is criticizing him for), or the stuff about how the Republican Party is just fine and it’s all Trump (if that’s all you’re saying then I agree on it being a criticism people are aiming at him).

    Before you say they’re the same thing, they’re not. Hillary called Republicans deplorables and still intended to work with them, making polarizing comments about the other party and working with the other party aren’t mutually exclusive.

  22. #72
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    my man if you think the average American is in for constant culture wars and people dunking on each other over and over and basically constant chaos Wow. One is out of touch I guess. To normies someone who is willing to take care of the country and help politicians get along so they dont have to worry about it is appealing. The constantly online activist wing is not representative of the normal
    The Democrats have been cooperating with Republicans to this very day. Democrats enabled Trump's actions by approving Trump's bloated military budget. Your ignorance is in full display on this thread.

  23. #73
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    I don’t think they can count on that again. I think there are plenty that voted for Trump that won’t repeat that in 2020.
    Unless the polls showing 90% approval rating of Trump by Republicans are wrong, I'm not getting my hopes up. Even many of the few conservatives who have the guts to hint they don't want to vote for him in 2020 will likely be fed something about the opposition that strikes enough fear in their hearts that they punch the box for him again.

    Plus, it doesn't help that Republicans have spent the last four years making voting even more inconvenient in urban areas of battleground states.

  24. #74
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Unless the polls showing 90% approval rating of Trump by Republicans are wrong, I'm not getting my hopes up. Even many of the few conservatives who have the guts to hint they don't want to vote for him in 2020 will likely be fed something about the opposition that strikes enough fear in their hearts that they punch the box for him again.
    Exactly, which is why the “we need muh Biden because he’s a nice cuddly moderate who’ll convince Fox News viewers that Democrats are nice!” arguments are re ed. No matter who the Democrats pick 35% to 40% of this country will believe the candidate is a radical socialist who wants to nationalize everything come Election Day.

    The Democrats could nominate Joe Manchin as the candidate with Doug Jones as his running mate and you’d see Republicans marching in the streets with “JOE MANCHIN IS A COMMUNIST WELCOME TO RUSSIA!” signs if he were to win.

  25. #75
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    Exactly, which is why the “we need muh Biden because he’s a nice cuddly moderate who’ll convince Fox News viewers that Democrats are nice!” arguments are re ed. No matter who the Democrats pick 35% to 40% of this country will believe the candidate is a radical socialist who wants to nationalize everything come Election Day.

    The Democrats could nominate Joe Manchin as the candidate with Doug Jones as his running mate and you’d see Republicans marching in the streets with “JOE MANCHIN IS A COMMUNIST WELCOME TO RUSSIA!” signs if he were to win.
    HE WANTS TO RAISE THE HIGHEST MARGINAL TAX RATE BY 0.5%, VENEZEULA HERE WE COME

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