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  1. #176
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    We know Bucks do it since no change to their current offer as reported. Think SA does it since have space to absorb 4M this year no problem and it gets them a first for Doug. Question is would Suns rather:

    Get two 2nds from Bucks & Nwora, Ibaka, Hill

    Or

    Get Doug who is better than Nwora/Hill, 2 2nds still, but send out a first to upgrade to Doug & save solid money
    so basically you are asking if the Suns would rather have Nwora, Hill, and a 1st, or

    McDermott

  2. #177
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    so basically you are asking if the Suns would rather have Nwora, Hill, and a 1st, or

    McDermott
    Correct. But to be specific: Do Suns want Nwora, Hill and a 1st or Doug McDermott + 8-10M in luxury tax savings

    So have to weigh do they think winning this year is possible/worth a try and if Doug gives them a better shot than Nwora+Hill

  3. #178
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    So... we didn't expect the Derrick White trade or the Dejounte Murray trade. What trade comes this deadline that shocks everybody?

  4. #179
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    So... we didn't expect the Derrick White trade or the Dejounte Murray trade. What trade comes this deadline that shocks everybody?
    white trade was kinda out of nowhere (though i was pleasantly surprised). murray trade had smoke leading up to it iirc

  5. #180
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    So... we didn't expect the Derrick White trade or the Dejounte Murray trade. What trade comes this deadline that shocks everybody?
    Collins or Tre has to be if its going to go that route?

  6. #181
    Veteran Ariel's Avatar
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    white trade was kinda out of nowhere (though i was pleasantly surprised). murray trade had smoke leading up to it iirc
    Yeah, a lot of it, including Dejounte posting cryptic messages on his social networks about it. There were definitely lots of clues pointing to an imminent move.

  7. #182
    Shaken, not stirred jjspur's Avatar
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    SpursTalk - thoughts on a deal like this:

    Suns Get: Doug McDermott + Serge Ibaka + 2 2nd RD picks from Bucks

    Bucks Get: Crowder

    Spurs Get: Saric + Hill + Nwora + 1st from Suns

    Suns not only shed Crowder and get a rotational player for him, but they get 2 2nds and shed 4M off salaries to help with taxes. Bucks get their guy for the package they have already offered. Spurs get their 1st for Doug and using some of their cap space to eat money this year/3M next year

    Spurs then waive Dieng again and another player but they get their first for Doug/Cap Space rental while shedding 10M next year for more space (even if not needed)
    I've heard a version of that trade but it involves only the bucks and suns (who have so far been reluctant to do) .

    Its Crowder for Hill + Nwora + Ibaka + a few seconds . I think that trade happens but would be nice if the spurs could somehow get involved in that action though.

  8. #183
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    I've heard a version of that trade but it involves only the bucks and suns (who have so far been reluctant to do) .

    Its Crowder for Hill + Nwora + Ibaka + a few seconds . I think that trade happens but would be nice if the spurs could somehow get involved in that action though.
    Ya - that’s where I got the idea. Bucks part stays the same - they don’t care. It’s just do the Suns want to try and save money + help make playoffs? Enough to give up a lottery protected first to upgrade to Doug (and save tax) over Hill/Nwora?

    Maybe not but I think it makes some sense, especially since they would be getting 2 2nds as well to offset the first a little they send out to get a better player and save money.

  9. #184
    Veteran spurs10's Avatar
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    Ya - that’s where I got the idea. Bucks part stays the same - they don’t care. It’s just do the Suns want to try and save money + help make playoffs? Enough to give up a lottery protected first to upgrade to Doug (and save tax) over Hill/Nwora?

    Maybe not but I think it makes some sense, especially since they would be getting 2 2nds as well to offset the first a little they send out to get a better player and save money.
    The Suns' lottery protected first would be 1-6?

  10. #185
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    The Suns' lottery protected first would be 1-6?
    I would guess 1-10 at least, but probably 1-14 for this year. Then maybe decline a little next years

  11. #186
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    SpursTalk - thoughts on a deal like this:

    Suns Get: Doug McDermott + Serge Ibaka + 2 2nd RD picks from Bucks

    Bucks Get: Crowder

    Spurs Get: Saric + Hill + Nwora + 1st from Suns

    Suns not only shed Crowder and get a rotational player for him, but they get 2 2nds and shed 4M off salaries to help with taxes. Bucks get their guy for the package they have already offered. Spurs get their 1st for Doug and using some of their cap space to eat money this year/3M next year

    Spurs then waive Dieng again and another player but they get their first for Doug/Cap Space rental while shedding 10M next year for more space (even if not needed)
    Yeah. I posted a very similar version of this on a different thread couple days back, but with Richardson and Hill going to Suns instead of Doug.

    Windhorst was saying Suns/Bucks motivated to deal but looking for 3rd team bc Suns don’t want Grayson Allen.

  12. #187
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    I've heard a version of that trade but it involves only the bucks and suns (who have so far been reluctant to do) .

    Its Crowder for Hill + Nwora + Ibaka + a few seconds . I think that trade happens but would be nice if the spurs could somehow get involved in that action though.
    I’d consider taking back Shatmet as well to improve the quality of the Suns assets coming back.

  13. #188
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    So... we didn't expect the Derrick White trade or the Dejounte Murray trade. What trade comes this deadline that shocks everybody?
    I don't really expect any shocking trades from the Spurs, but if it were to happen, it'd either be moving Devin or KJ with the latter coming in an unbalanced trade.

  14. #189
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Yeah. I posted a very similar version of this on a different thread couple days back, but with Richardson and Hill going to Suns instead of Doug.

    Windhorst was saying Suns/Bucks motivated to deal but looking for 3rd team bc Suns don’t want Grayson Allen.
    I’d be totally fine swapping Josh for Doug here. No problem.

  15. #190
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    I don't really expect any shocking trades from the Spurs, but if it were to happen, it'd either be moving Devin or KJ with the latter coming in an unbalanced trade.
    It’s so hard to imagine SA trading Devin after the season he has had…Keldon? Maybe, but he’s the face of the franchise, appears to have a value deal and is still very much young enough to be a part of a rebuild to playoff team arc.

    I don’t even know what a Keldon deal would look like where SA would consider it tbh…..at least a realistic one.

  16. #191
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    It’s so hard to imagine SA trading Devin after the season he has had…Keldon? Maybe, but he’s the face of the franchise, appears to have a value deal and is still very much young enough to be a part of a rebuild to playoff team arc.

    I don’t even know what a Keldon deal would look like where SA would consider it tbh…..at least a realistic one.
    For clarity...I don't expect either to be traded now.....that was just my definition of what a 'shocking' trade would be to me...

  17. #192
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    SpursTalk - thoughts on a deal like this:

    Suns Get: Doug McDermott + Serge Ibaka + 2 2nd RD picks from Bucks

    Bucks Get: Crowder

    Spurs Get: Saric + Hill + Nwora + 1st from Suns

    Suns not only shed Crowder and get a rotational player for him, but they get 2 2nds and shed 4M off salaries to help with taxes. Bucks get their guy for the package they have already offered. Spurs get their 1st for Doug and using some of their cap space to eat money this year/3M next year

    Spurs then waive Dieng again and another player but they get their first for Doug/Cap Space rental while shedding 10M next year for more space (even if not needed)
    Bucks obviously do it because as you said nothing changes from their perspective.

    Spurs, though I suspect they'd prefer to retain McDermott for now, obviously do it to shed money for next season and get a 1st.

    Suns more than likely balk though both because they'd be giving up a 1st and adding salary for next season on a one-way role player when they already have so much uncertainty.

  18. #193
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    For clarity...I don't expect either to be traded now.....that was just my definition of what a 'shocking' trade would be to me...
    For sure - I got that. Was just adding to it. Even trying to think of a somewhat realistic scenario where we could even see that type of surprise and what it would take. Hard for me to come up with anything (hence it being a major surprise lol). I think Zach/Tre are the ones no one is talking about as much as Doug/Jak/Josh that can surprise

  19. #194
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Bucks obviously do it because as you said nothing changes from their perspective.

    Spurs, though I suspect they'd prefer to retain McDermott for now, obviously do it to shed money for next season and get a 1st.

    Suns more than likely balk though both because they'd be giving up a 1st and adding salary for next season on a one-way role player when they already have so much uncertainty.
    Agree it’s not a slam dunk but that money they are adding next year is “functionally” offset by the luxury tax they save this year + Nwora.

    So if Suns just did the deal direct with MIL, Nwora is guaranteed 3.2M next year. So Doug would only be 10M extra. They would be saving I think over 8M in taxes this year in my deal too so between Nwora and that, they get Doug who they could at least possibly flip next year as an expiring (for maybe a 2nd) vs paying that money in taxes + Nwora

  20. #195
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    Agree it’s not a slam dunk but that money they are adding next year is “functionally” offset by the luxury tax they save this year + Nwora.

    So if Suns just did the deal direct with MIL, Nwora is guaranteed 3.2M next year. So Doug would only be 10M extra. They would be saving I think over 8M in taxes this year in my deal too so between Nwora and that, they get Doug who they could at least possibly flip next year as an expiring (for maybe a 2nd) vs paying that money in taxes + Nwora
    Maybe, but they'd probably view it like they can't afford to add that much at the moment for a one-way role player with new ownership and Paul, Ayton, Johnson and starting four all TBD going into the off season.

  21. #196
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Maybe, but they'd probably view it like they can't afford to add that much at the moment for a one-way role player with new ownership and Paul, Ayton, Johnson and starting four all TBD going into the off season.
    Definitely possible. Hard to tell. They are 7th and you would think they would want to try and make the playoffs and they aren’t getting a top 5 pick or anything at this point. So can trade for Doug, try to make playoffs and protect your pick in the lottery just in case and it only conveys if Doug helps you to make the playoffs

  22. #197
    Veteran scott's Avatar
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    It’s so hard to imagine SA trading Devin after the season he has had…Keldon? Maybe, but he’s the face of the franchise, appears to have a value deal and is still very much young enough to be a part of a rebuild to playoff team arc.

    I don’t even know what a Keldon deal would look like where SA would consider it tbh…..at least a realistic one.
    IIRC, there is some kind of poison pill on Keldon being traded this year, but could definitely be a possibility to be moved once the new league year starts.

  23. #198
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    Definitely possible. Hard to tell. They are 7th and you would think they would want to try and make the playoffs and they aren’t getting a top 5 pick or anything at this point. So can trade for Doug, try to make playoffs and protect your pick in the lottery just in case and it only conveys if Doug helps you to make the playoffs
    Do you think Doug is a better fits on the Suns than Josh?

  24. #199
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    IIRC, there is some kind of poison pill on Keldon being traded this year, but could definitely be a possibility to be moved once the new league year starts.
    Yes but he can be moved now in an unbalanced trade and we have plenty of cap space to make that happen if we wanted to.

  25. #200
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    Definitely possible. Hard to tell. They are 7th and you would think they would want to try and make the playoffs and they aren’t getting a top 5 pick or anything at this point. So can trade for Doug, try to make playoffs and protect your pick in the lottery just in case and it only conveys if Doug helps you to make the playoffs
    The other issue is, they're most likely looking to do something more significant, so salaries like Nwora and Hill, as well as retaining 1sts, would take precedent.

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