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Common knowledge at this point.
We keep hearing how Dirk still has a few years of his prime left. I'm here to tell you all that his prime blew by us, and we're witnessing the decline right now.
His scoring is up - great. His scoring is up only because he's taking more shots. His jumper used to be consistently great and automatic. A 4 for 18 night was a blue moon shock. Nowadays, he's just another streaky shooter who from time to time can get dialed in and never miss. Nowadays, a 4 for 18 shooting night is "Dirk's stinker of the week".
He never drives anymore, and when he does, he's almost guaranteed to miss the layup. He never had much of a post game, but at least before he could get a low post hook shot or two in every game.
His rebounding is way down, and his defense is far worse. There was a point a couple year's ago when Dirk's defense was actually pretty decent, and anybody who actually watched him on D regularly would know this. But he's right back to being the piss-poor defender he used to be, only now it's not because he's not focused, it's because physically he can't do it anymore.
This isn't meant to on Dirk because he can't help that his body is deteriorating. I'm sure he's working just as hard, if not harder, on his game.
This is just a wakeup call to all Mavs fans that Dirk simply isn't the superhero he used to be, that he is past his prime, and that at this point he is best served being a secondary option. And that things are only going to get worse from here for Dirk. Hopefully Mark & Donnie pull their head out of their ass and see the same thing, and do something about it (yeah, right).
Common knowledge at this point.
If I made a thread saying the sky is blue, would you argue that it's actually green?
Nobody thinks Dirk is deteriorating, most people are claiming he's had a resurgence this season. Most people think he's got "a couple more years of his prime left" and that the team needs to take advantage of it. I'm saying his prime is gone, and that he had a better season last year when he was halfassing and not giving a , than he is this season playing his ass off.
Just saying bro... its kinda common knowledge..
No more 90/50/40 Dirk. Rebounding at a lower rate... getting to the FT line less... still very good but his best years are behind him. More bad shooting outin
If someone's prime is the 2-3 best years of their career it's usually ages 26-28 which for Dirk is 04-05 - 06-07.
But he's only exited his prime in the same way Duncan, Kobe, and Garnett have exited theirs. All are still productive players. It's not like Dirk has had a steep decline... just a gentle decline expected with a 30 YO.
he still has a lot of good years left due to size and shooting, just not MVP level.
Kobe the defending MVP and MVP contender, the most feared player in crunch time has exited his prime?
Is that why you said Horry > Kobe?
Kobe is PEAKING right now. Just like Jordan was better than he ever was in his early to mid 30's. Exited their athletic prime? Then yeah, but there's much more to basketball than your max vertical leap.
If he's declining it's pretty small.
Good thing the Mavericks have done such a great job developing young talent.
It's really hard to define what the "prime" exactly means. Individually Dirk isn't as good nowadays as he was in 06-07 season in which he won the regular season's MVP, but his impact on our team hasn't decreased a bit. I think Duncan is farther from his prime than dirk from his, and KG is even farther than both of them IMHO. Dirk's personal performances are overshined by our team-work, which is an achievement of our team's developing.
Our team is ranking at 8th but only 2.5 games from the 3rd seed and there are still 15 games left for our boys in blue, so we still have the chance to climb higher in order to avoid the lakers in the first round. It's true that we will have to face the lakers in their faces if we want to win the ticket to finals, but I would like to let the spurs erase the lakers a little bit before they meet our mavs. Out of lakers, there isn't any team in the west that has the unreversable advantage over other teams. there is only one team that can make some troubles to lakers, but that only team is very likely to miss the playoffs regretfully.
Trade him for the younger Amare.
How do laker fans seem to get kobe's name in every topic? Seriously this thread has nothing to do with Kobe.Kobe the defending MVP and MVP contender, the most feared player in crunch time has exited his prime?
Is that why you said Horry > Kobe?
Anyway IMO Dirk's ankle and knee injury at the end of last season has drastically effected his first step and his ability to get to the basket, plus playing with the GER national team over the summer didn't help.
Dirk was the best player in the league in 06 because he had a deceptively quick first step and constantly got to the line 10-12 times a night. Now, 75-80% of his offense is a jump shot or a fade away.
Dirk has peaked, and definitely is declining. Fortunately, due to his skill set, he should be able to still play at a fairly high level for a pretty long time. He won't ever be what he used to be obviously, but he can still average over 20 ppg for another 4-5 years just because he is such a tough match-up, and has such great shooting touch.
Mavs should do what they can to get a youthful star, and have Dirk become the #2 guy soon. He would still be fantastic as a #2. If they could somehow land a guy like Dwayne Wade or Kevin Durant... that would be something great to see.
I think this is what people were debating earlier, Pau is better than Dirk this year.
I would take Dirk on my team every time over Pau. That said, Dirk could not have made a big enough difference for LA to beat Boston, so its pretty much a moot point.
+1. That's the thing, Dirk's game is so finesse and thereby conducive to longevity. It's just a question of him ever being good enough to be anything other than the number 1 guy on a pretender-contender. IMO he won't even be that good ever again. But yeah, as he gets older, Dirk's going to be a great second option, either for Dallas or someone else.
IMO people aren't being fair to Dirk. All he needs is to share co-honors with being number one. He needs some ing help. Look at our roster and tell me it isn't pathetic
Excluding LeBron, Duncan, Kobe & Garnett any team would trade their best player for Dirk…
I didn't watch much of the Lakers game, but what few bits I did see included Dirk bricking a wide-open three and two elbow jumpers, all short.
I changed the channel cuz' I got pissed that he never missed those when playing the Spurs.
My team wouldn't. I'm pretty sure NOH wouldn't. I'm pretty sure Portland wouldn't. Or Orlando. Atlanta might, but then again maybe not? JJ for Dirk? I'd pass. Miami wouldn't. If I thought harder I could come up with more.
You're a known Dirk hater. Joe Johnson better than Dirk? GTFO. JJ has much more help than Dirk, who has to rely on guys like JJ Barrea who shouldn't even be in the NBA, yet Dirk's team is still better.
Known Dirk hater? I've called him soft, finesse and I'm still pissed he injured AK by flagrantly fouling him. That's my take on Dirk, but I don't hate him and I've seen every mavs fan on this board call him worse. Plenty of times. The mavs aren't a rival of the Jazz, neither is Dirk and really I care about him as much or as little as I do anyone else. I'm just trying to give my objective opinion here, so please, spare me the whole, "you're just a hater," routine.
If you think he's better than JJ, fine. That case could easily be made and I wouldn't begrudge anyone for making it. And it's not as if I'm God, writing it in ing stone; it's just one man's opinion after all. I'd think long and hard though about taking a 30+ and declining Dirk over a 27 year old Joe Johnson.
that flagrant on AK was priceless, knowing him, he probably flopped his way through that too.
But comeon..Dirk is a top 10 PF of all time, the skill set he had from 03-07 was unmatched....
I'm not debating his historical validity. Or disputing Dirk's talent level. I'm saying personally IMO, I'd rather have Joe Johnson from the ages of 27-31 than I would Dirk from 31-35. Is that really so insane? Joe Johnson is a 20, 5 and 5 guy. He's a legit ing all-star. Is it really that hard to believe that I'd swap Dirk for a legit all-star who has his prime years immediately ahead of him?
Last edited by balli; 03-16-2009 at 12:07 PM. Reason: form<from
Dirk is currently better than several of the players ballijuana mentioned, but those same teams wouldnt trade their best players at this point in his career for him either. maybe if he was just entering, or currently in his prime, i can see that. but i wouldnt trade JJ, Dwight Howard, Deron Williams, or several other players for Dirk at this point in his career, even though he is RIGHT NOW, a better basketball player than them.
Gotta side with ballijuana on this one, and I might be the biggest Dirk lover on this board.
depends on how Joe Johnson keeps playing, not big enough sample size....and on the other hand we have the MVP from 07...
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