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torture and gay people belong in the closet in WC's mind
I didn't have too much time to post more in this thread, considering the playoffs and what not, but I just wanted to say that the other methods I was referring to include spying, infiltration, bribery, social engineering, fraud, etc. All legal methods that have provided this country with more than enough intel during all sorts of different theaters.
torture and gay people belong in the closet in WC's mind
Frankly, I don't think the semantic argument is over. Many reasonable people still don't consider the variety (and, yes, there are several) of waterboarding cons uted torture.
But, in any case, many, possibly thousands of Los Angeleans are alive today, because our government was willing to employee aggressive interrogation techniques.
I'm okay with that.
Same here. They proved that this worked.
Thing with torture is that if less aggressive techniques didn't work, torture doesn't either. This was not torture, and it worked.
Meh, whatever you want to call it, it was effective and we need to keep it in our quiver of weapons.
I can't help that the liberal narrative in this matter won't allow for reasonable debate.
I'm sure it's already been pooh-poohed by the lefties on this board but, how do they reconcile that Nancy Pelosi was briefed, multiple times, on these techniques and she raised no concerns until it became a political issue?
Just curious.
I agree. All the more reason I say they try to destroy the Heart of America.
Last edited by Wild Cobra; 04-23-2009 at 04:58 PM.
I pray to God President Obama is never faced with the decision of having to employ such techniques -- now knowing they work -- to thwart a major terror attack on this country.
Torture or not, illegal or not, liberal or conservative...the American Public will never forgive him if it finds out he had the means to extract actionable intelligence and because of some silly rhetoric he failed to act.
Obama would have the suspect nuts chewed off. This whole topic is bogus! Just politicians being politicians. Funny. A week ago I am hearing how the Dems think Rush is the leader of the Republican party and now I am hearing how Obama would not rule out prosecuting the Bush admin. Anything to get the people including democrats to forget Obama just signed off on a bill that spent a TRILLION dollars. This dumbass won't get re-elected.
Well who is it then?Dems think Rush is the leader of the Republican party
Michael Steele
Praying to God and supporting torture are mutually exclusive. Please pick one or the other.
Bad call, Yoni. Overtaken by facts on the ground, though not yet pursued to a legal certainty. That's really all you have left here.
Who am I going to believe, my lying eyes, or a serial liar and plagiarist like you? It's not a very hard call to make.
Yoni thinks he wins because "24" might come true someday.
You only wish it would, Yoni.
You're obviously pining for it.
Some of us aren't willing to sacrifice our morals for expediency.
Lefties, as you say, have been railing on politicians like this for awhile. The biggest flaw with the Democrats of today are that a majority of them are right in line with the Republicans when it comes to promoting authoritarian mindsets/rules. Lots of Dems supported FISA as well.
I can only hope that my generation, generation Y, will be for more civil rights, less government interference, and less nation-building efforts.
Yoni thinks there are only two flavors of ice cream, so he can't comprehend that someone who hates one doesn't love the other. Fallacious.
He also doesn't see that when it comes to executive power, spending, national security and war, that there's really only one flavor: Cold War liberalism, retrofitted for 9/11. It includes the mainstream of both major parties.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/story/66622.htmlWASHINGTON — The Bush administration applied relentless pressure on interrogators to use harsh methods on detainees in part to find evidence of cooperation between al Qaida and the late Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein's regime, according to a former senior U.S. intelligence official and a former Army psychiatrist.
Such information would've provided a foundation for one of former President George W. Bush's main arguments for invading Iraq in 2003. In fact, no evidence has ever been found of operational ties between Osama bin Laden's terrorist network and Saddam's regime.
The use of abusive interrogation — widely considered torture — as part of Bush's quest for a rationale to invade Iraq came to light as the Senate issued a major report tracing the origin of the abuses and President Barack Obama opened the door to prosecuting former U.S. officials for approving them.
Thats right boys and girls, they used torture so that they'd have justification for starting a ing war.
The terrorists succeeded. Look at what they turned us into.
But the right will ALWAYS accuse Obama of having the means to extract actionable intelligence because it really can't be totally proven because we simply don't know.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nat...,6965513.story
approval ratings in new polls
In 5-year first, more Americans say U.S. headed in right direction than not
By Mark Silva | Tribune Washington Bureau
10:26 AM EDT, April 23, 2009
WASHINGTON - Approaching his 100th day in the White House at a time of economic turmoil, President Barack Obama holds the approval of nearly two-thirds of Americans surveyed for the job that he is performing -- and seven in 10 say they like Obama, the man.
Most say they approve of the president's overall handling of the economy, while the effects of his policies remain uncertain.
Obama's job approval as president stands at 63 percent in a poll released Thursday morning by the Washington-based Pew Research Center, with just 26 percent of those surveyed saying they disapprove of the way that Obama is handling his job.
The president draws a similar rating in a new poll conducted by the Associated Press and GfK Roper Public Affairs and Media: 64 percent job approval. The AP-GfK survey also finds, for the first time in five years, more Americans saying the nation is headed in the right direction than those who say it is not.
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Biden: $300 million from stimulus will go for 'clean' vehicles The president's job approval also stands at 64 percent in the latest results of the Gallup Poll's daily tracking survey.
In a reversal of the way that voters traditionally view leaders of the two major political parties, the Democratic president draws better ratings in the Pew survey for his handling of foreign policy and terrorism than for his handling of domestic issues such as health care, taxes or the budget deficit.
Nevertheless, 60 percent of those surveyed by Pew say they approve of Obama's overall handling of the economy.
First lady Mic e Obama also is having a honeymoon of her own with the American public, with 76 percent of those surveyed voicing a favorable view of her -- up from 62 percent in January, when the Obamas moved into the White House.
This is particularly true among Republican women, whose opinion of the first lady has grown by 21 points since January, to 67 percent approval in the newest survey. Among Republicans in general, the first lady holds the approval of 60 percent.
Still, the Pew poll, like others, reveals a wide disparity between Democrats and Republicans in the way they rate the new president's performance -- with 93 percent of Democrats surveyed voicing approval and just 30 percent of Republicans agreeing.
The Pew survey of 1,507 adults was conducted April 14-21 and carries a possible margin of error of plus or minus three percentage points. The AP-GfK poll survey of 1,000 adults was run April 16-20, with a 3.1 percent margin of error.
Nearly half of those surveyed by AP-GfK -- 48 percent -- said the country is headed in the right direction, up from 40 percent in February. And 40 percent still said the nation is headed in the wrong direction. Not since January 2004 has an AP survey found more "right direction'' sentiment than "wrong direction'' concern.
For a president whose Republican rival, Sen. John McCain, presented himself as a more seasoned expert on foreign affairs, the Democrat has gained respect at home for his work on the foreign stage. Most Americans surveyed by Pew -- 57 percent -- say that Obama is striking the right balance in pressing American interests while taking into the account the interests of U.S. allies.
The public also is taking a more positive view of Obama's decision to close the U.S. military-run detention camp at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba -- with 51 percent approving -- than it did when the president first announced his intentions to close the facility within a year in January, when 38 percent approved.
The president, who traveled across Europe and to Baghdad earlier this month, draws strong approval for his overall handling of foreign policy in the Pew survey -- 61 percent.
While most (60 percent) approve of Obama's overall handling of the economy, Pew found, most also say that it is too early to tell whether the president's economic policies have had an effect or say they have had no effect. Just 26 percent of those surveyed say his policies have made conditions better.
Most support the extent of the agenda that Obama is tackling early in his presidency, with 56 percent saying he is handling things right and 34 percent say he is taking on too much.
The president's campaign promise of "change'' and his pledge to set a new tone in Washington are still resonating with most Americans, the Pew poll suggests, with 63 percent of those surveyed saying that Obama has demonstrated a new approach to politics and just 27 percent calling his approach business as usual.
However, among the younger voters surveyed, that enthusiasm apparently has waned somewhat, with 61 percent of those under 30 saying the president brings a new approach to politics, down from 73 percent in February.
While the president has held the public's approval after three months in office, Vice President Joe Biden has lost some support.
About half of those surveyed by Pew, 51 percent, said they have a favorable view of Biden -- down 12 percentage points from January. It is largely among Democrats and independents that Biden's standing has slipped, Pew found, with Republicans holding roughly steady in their views of the vice president.
Not looking too good as of now Repubs.
I guess they will chalk it up as a bad poll or something. lol
In 2012......YES WE CAN!!!
So waterboarding proved there was no link between al Qaeda and Saddam.
See, torture works!
Science disdains the unfalsifiable but politics thrives on it.
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