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^^ It's going to be be quite the sight seeing LeBron in the silver and black.
^^ It's going to be be quite the sight seeing LeBron in the silver and black.
Thanks to all.
And props to MaNu4Tres.
Manu4Tres should get a trophy or something for this one.
Amazing thread.
Don`t tell me that RC and Pop don`t read Spurstalk.
They only have to send e-mail to Bucks and trade was completed.
Gj Bruno
Some Thoughts on the Jefferson Trade
Ed. Note: I apologize for my recent absence. I began graduate school on Monday so, needless to say, my life has been a bit hectic the last few days. Once I get a better sense of my schedule, I’ll be back in full force. But I couldn’t let yesterday’s events pass without offering some comment.
As you know, yesterday the Spurs acquired Richard Jefferson for Bruce Bowen, Kurt Thomas and Fabricio Oberto. I agree with the general consensus: The Spurs have made a smart move and have firmly placed themselves back into the hunt for a 5th le. According to our friendly neighborhood Bucks blogger, this isn’t such a bad move for Milwaukee either. But there have been a few naysayers, and rightfully so. Few trades are all reward and no risk. That being said, I think some of the criticisms that have popped up are misguided and I want to take this opportunity to respond. I also want to raise a few concerns of my own:
Some questions have been raised regarding Richard Jefferson’s at ude. He has developed a reputation as a problem in the locker room, and in some people’s mind his acquisition has put the Spurs much-heralded chemistry at some amount of risk. Personally, I am not that concerned. Jefferson went from a devolving situation in New Jersey to a dead end situation in Milwaukee (Yes, the Bucks were in striking distance of the playoffs but, as Jeremy Schmidt himself admitted, A Jefferson-Redd led team was never going beyond the first round). Few players would survive such a transition without some negative press about their “at ude.”
In all honesty, I think there are plenty of reasons to be quite optimistic about the at ude and energy Jefferson will bring: Jefferson has his best, and what may be last, opportunity to win a ring this next season. And he didn’t have to sacrifice a dime to get it. I see no reason why we can’t expect 82 games of ear-to-ear grins from number 24.
You know the interesting thing about this speculation regarding Jefferson and his at ude? For one man it isn’t speculation: Gregg Popovich. Popovich served as an assistant coach on the 2003 FIBA U.S. Men’s National Team and on the 2004 Olympic Team, both of which Jefferson played on. Popovich hasn’t merely scouted Jefferson; he has coached him directly. No one in the organization is in a better position to judge Jefferson’s at ude than Coach Pop. And if Popovich is a believer than I am as well.
On a similar but slightly different note, take a look at the elite small forwards the Spurs have targeted in the last 12 months: Corey Maggette, Vince Carter, Richard Jefferson. Jefferson is easily the least established “head case” of the three.
Aaron Stampler of Pounding the Rock pointed out that Jefferson had a rather poor +/- this past season. In fact, with -104 he had the second worst +/- on the team. I think this is an excellent opportunity to point out the fundamental problem with the +/- metric: There are always 4 other guys in your same jersey with you on the court. And every time one of those guys allows a basket or fails to score, that affects your +/-. When you are Matt Bonner, and you start alongside Tim Duncan and Tony Parker, you could accidentally end up with the highest +/- on the team. When you are Richard Jefferson and you not only start alongside Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric but also primarily play against other team’s starting 5, you may end up with a terrible +/-. I’ll readily admit his PER this last season (15.45) was low considering his salary but I think his +/- is a misleading stat.
Before moving on to my criticisms, I want to propose an idea which I have yet to do the appropriate research for: One legitimate point of concern many commentators have noted is how dangerously close this move puts the Spurs to the luxury tax. If the Spurs are going to finish rounding out this roster (after yesterday’s events, the the frontcourt is certainly in need of a little depth), they will most likely have to head north of the cap. For many this has come as a surprise given how closely associated the Spurs are with the ethic of frugality. (Although, as R.C. Buford said during an interview yesterday afternoon, “this won’t be the first time we’ve been a luxury tax paying team.”)
I have a theory. This past season the Spurs experienced an uncommon financial shock. They received the revenue from only two home playoff games. By some estimates, a franchise can make close to $1 million per playoff home game. Although it would be an enormous gamble, the Spurs may be preparing to defy our expectations and absorb the luxury tax in the hopes that the excess revenue from a deep playoff run will offset the costs. I will do some research and try to find out how much the team made in ‘07, ‘08, and ‘09. If there was a significant drop in the Spurs ‘09 revenue, there may be some truth to this idea. (I’m hardly the first person to propose that this business strategy may work for an NBA team, but I have never seen hard numbers that prove its validity.)
At this point, my primary concern is our frontcourt depth. Matt Bonner is unacceptable as a starting center. With players like James Gist and Ian Mahinmi in the pipeline, we are in an excellent position to pad the end of the bench but, if we legitimately intend to compete this season, we need a frontcourt contributor we don’t currently possess. As Tim said to me late yesterday evening, “We have roster spots 1 through 6 and 9 through 12. We need 7 and 8.”
We also still need some depth at the small forward position (Who will backup Jefferson? Udoka?), but that can be more readily solved by the draft. If we do choose a small forward, Jefferson’s acquisition does take a fair amount of pressure off of that young man: Instead of praying that he will grow into a semi-legitimate starter by mid-season, he can contribute 10-15 minutes off of the bench and develop comfortably and calmly.
At the end of yesterday, there were some questions that still hung in the air. But all in all, this is a trade I am excited about. Had we allowed those contracts to expire and waited for the 2010 free agent class, we would have quietly suffered last season’s fate while Duncan and Ginobili grew a year older. Add on the fact that the 2010 FA market would be a free-for-all full of attractive buyers, giving us no assurances the Spurs would land the caliber of player we sought. We had an opportunity to compete now and we took it. Given the ages of Duncan and Manu, I’m glad we did.
http://www.48minutesof .com/2009/...ade/#more-3287
I can't believe almost 2 months later, the Spurs have now acquired Richard Jefferson. Some thought it would never happen. Wow oh wow
Seriously...
+1
Took me till today to come into this thread, but I started from page 1 (already knowing the outcome) and watched as lines were drawn (chuckling) comments cracked (giggling), impossible proclaimed (smile).. and then the trade announced and crow being served.
Then I read that and laughed like Santa Clause. Hohoho
I thought you were being facetious when asking for props the first time, thus my post of sarcasm.(Probably should've read the OP
With the Spurs owning many expiring contracts, the spurs front office may question the " 2010 plan" because of many teams having cap space for the summer of Le'Bron.
With that the Spurs may not want to waste another year with 66 percent of the big 3 slowly deteriorating as Manu and Tim will ride off into the sunset after the year 2012 or maybe sooner. Therefore the FO may push all in ASAP instead of waiting and gambling on signing a big name free agent 2010, which may be very unlikely.
If we are able to sign a capable athletic back up such as Carney/ Moon/ Barnes/ Jones with the LLE. And sign Sheed with the MLE. I think it would make the most sense to package up Mason/ Bonner/ Oberto/ Bowen to Milwaukee for Richard Jefferson.
They were on the cusp on trading Richard Jefferson to the Blazers for Raef LaFrentz and Travis Outlaw for financial reasons. That makes me believe this could be a realistic possibility.
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/richard_jefferson/)
Nice post.
Props to Manu4tres and to all the good contributors of this awsome forum !!!!!
You hit it on the head as well Bruno. Great job. I am just so damn happy with this trade. Getting Bowen back would be icing on the cake.RJ is almost the perfect fit for Spurs' SF spot.
Bucks will have some luxury tax troubles next year. Spurs with Bowen and Oberto partially guaranteed contracts have the ability to make an offer that will allow Bucks to save money as soon as next year.
Providing Spurs are ready to say goodbye to the 2010 plan and Bucks are ready to nearly salary dump him, it could be interesting.
A trade like Oberto+Bowen+Thomas+picks for Jefferson would be great for SA.
Re-sign Bowen and put Finley in the trash and Spurs have a great perimeter rotation:
PG : Parker/Hill
SG : Ginobili/Mason
SF : Jefferson/Bowen
After that, you spend the MLE on bigs and
Jefferson is actually 6'7.25" without shoes. Making him about 6'8"-6'9" in NBA height. Thats pretty damn big, even for a SF. He's got a 7'0" wingspan which is pretty good, and a standing reach of 8'7" which is about average for his size.
Impressive for a guy that size to be the athlete that he is.
You were wrong. You said there was no chance of this happening.
Great call on this one.
Read again, every time he gave the context and every time one condition was that the Spurs wouldn't go over the luxury tax threshold, which they have always been reluctant to do, so it was a fair assumption.
Of course when the owners decide to open the pocketbook anything can happen (e.g. Shaq going to Phoenix - and Sarver isn't really Mark Cuban).
Still a good call by Manu4Tres, I really didn't see that one coming at all - way under the radar at the time.
Great foresight!
With the Spurs owning many expiring contracts, the spurs front office may question the " 2010 plan" because of many teams having cap space for the summer of Le'Bron.
With that the Spurs may not want to waste another year with 66 percent of the big 3 slowly deteriorating as Manu and Tim will ride off into the sunset after the year 2012 or maybe sooner. Therefore the FO may push all in ASAP instead of waiting and gambling on signing a big name free agent 2010, which may be very unlikely.
If we are able to sign a capable athletic back up such as Carney/ Moon/ Barnes/ Jones with the LLE. And sign Sheed with the MLE. I think it would make the most sense to package up Mason/ Bonner/ Oberto/ Bowen to Milwaukee for Richard Jefferson.
They were on the cusp on trading Richard Jefferson to the Blazers for Raef LaFrentz and Travis Outlaw for financial reasons. That makes me believe this could be a realistic possibility.
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/richard_jefferson/
Also, great insight.RJ is almost the perfect fit for Spurs' SF spot.
Bucks will have some luxury tax troubles next year. Spurs with Bowen and Oberto partially guaranteed contracts have the ability to make an offer that will allow Bucks to save money as soon as next year.
Providing Spurs are ready to say goodbye to the 2010 plan and Bucks are ready to nearly salary dump him, it could be interesting.
A trade like Oberto+Bowen+Thomas+picks for Jefferson would be great for SA.
Re-sign Bowen and put Finley in the trash and Spurs have a great perimeter rotation:
PG : Parker/Hill
SG : Ginobili/Mason
SF : Jefferson/Bowen
After that, you spend the MLE on bigs and
Tim Duncan: $22.2 million
Tony Parker: $12.6 million
Manu Ginobili: $10.7 million
Richard Jefferson: $14.2 million
TOTAL: $59.7 million
Everyone can get this idea out of their heads real quick. This team GAVE away a guy they had been fighting like dogs for 5 years to sign over a lousy $3 million and all of a sudden they're going to go with a $70+ million payroll? This thread is nothing more than SpursFan masturbation.
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